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Critical Analysis #2
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Beyond The Joyful Wisdom
| Critical Analysis #2 |
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Beyond The Joyful Wisdom |
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Stephanos
since 2000-07-31
Posts 3618Statesboro, GA, USA 
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Since some say the Aristocracy Must forget but never forgive How could they not imagine God A Sipo Matador of the same soil? Just another burning Jingo In the wasteland of the happy ones. Can’t they hear and smell and see That even gods despoil? The proof is plain enough to slaves For whom Christ is yet alive For if we are Holy murderers Then our crime is not atoned By a celestial Will to Power Who sees Calvary an anthill And the doers of this great event Hardly worthy to be stoned. For the dead need not be mortified In the strictest sense of meaning Many cold and blue toward others Yet breathe and walk the street. The Joyful Wisdom thus described Is our death by God’s forgetfulness (Which to some is life indeed, To others, a love they dread to meet). And what if the whole philosophy Of the so-called Death of God turns out Another kind of sacred game That only madmen tend to play A charade of “beyond good and evil” Where control and not transcendence Belies the reason ghostly men Light lanterns in the day? SDJ 2/2007 |
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| © Copyright 2007 Stephen Douglas Jones - All Rights Reserved | |||
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ChristianSpeaks Member
since 2006-05-18
Posts 396Iowa, USA |
This is amazing:. quote: South of this point you really loose your punch. I think I understand the cynicism, but I don't get the message after the quote. But, whoa, the first half......great. CS |
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Stephanos
since 2000-07-31
Posts 3618Statesboro, GA, USA |
CS, thanks. I guess I understand how you could take this for cynicism, but in acutality, it is quite the opposite ... using reductio ad absurdum to ultimately criticize cynisism itself. Many lines either allude to, or overtly quote from Nietzsche's "The Joyful Wisdom" and "Beyond Good and Evil", both of which I've recently been reading. I tied in Nietzsche's views about master morality (ie, aristocracy, will to power), as being part of his problem. Since he seemed to praise a "higher" morality which treated lower men as mere instruments of disposal, he could only (reasonably) think God to be the same way. And if so, then the "murder of God" is something that God would not even acknowledge, much less forgive. Hence God was dead to the likes of Nietzsche, even if not dead in the common usage of the term ... but dead in the sense of "estranged". Therefore boldly claiming that "God is dead", is little more than to say "I am dead to God". And the fact that men seek to "light lanterns in the day", belies the fact that they give recognition to the light, even though darkness eminates from themselves ... literally "holding the truth in unrighteousness". Anyway, I guess you're right about the second part. I want to keep the idea the same, but tighten up and sharpen the latter half, making it as striking as the first. Stephen. |
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Brad Member Ascendant
since 1999-08-20
Posts 5705Jejudo, South Korea |
Stephen, I like this. It took me a second, but I think I get your reversal here. The yearning for control instead of transcendence is a constant post-N concern (look at Heidegger for example). While I think this is a necessary corrective for those of use on the other side, my one criticism would be that the slave mentality masks the same problem (control through the claim of transcendence). Maybe not for you personally, but certainly for many others. I was in America last week and gotta chance to watch some Christianist shows. |
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Stephanos
since 2000-07-31
Posts 3618Statesboro, GA, USA |
Brad, thanks. And authentically Christian TV is hard to find amid the flood of ... you know. Stephen. |
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rhia_5779 Senior Member
since 2006-06-09
Posts 1334California |
I think I understood most tof it, the way the words are used in the first part is really great. I actually liked the second part too, I thought it was also very good. What is Christian Tv? |
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oceanvu2 Senior Member
since 2007-02-24
Posts 1066Santa Monica, California, USA |
Rhia - "What is Christian TV?" Creflo Dollar, Jimmy Swaggart One's a liar, one's a braggart. If this conflicts with anyone's views, Well, one sells wealth, and one Good News. Jim |
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Stephanos
since 2000-07-31
Posts 3618Statesboro, GA, USA |
I think many things called "Christian" are not very Christian in reality. This is especially true concerning television. I'm not so offended and cynical to think that authentic Christian expression is absent on the tube, but Television popularity will almost always demand a degree of compromise and catering to the monetary "bottom line", as opposed to speaking the truth. Priorities are skewed. Heresies creep in. For many of them, perhaps their beginnings were better intended. Stephen |
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oceanvu2 Senior Member
since 2007-02-24
Posts 1066Santa Monica, California, USA |
Stephan: I think that most widely popular televangelists sell a form of spiritual materialism, that is, if you "believe" correctly, you get rewarded, either on earth or in heaven. It's really none of my business, but I was wondering if you find your spiritual strength in the context of an organized religious body? And no, I have no intention of disparaging anyone's belief system. Best, Jim |
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Stephanos
since 2000-07-31
Posts 3618Statesboro, GA, USA |
oceanvu2: quote: I understand your point. Because, if God is God, then worship cannot be all about what you can get out of it. However if God is benevolent and worship is about love, then the relationship cannot totally exclude the idea of benefit. I think balance is needed. Any truth can become a heresy if it is made out to be the whole truth. In light of your disgust with mercenary religion (which I share), I urge you to remember that there's always the possibility that the Church as organization may use money for helping and ministry, rather than for personal gain. As a Christian, many religious practices anger me also. However, I'm not so offended and skeptical that I think it's all gone awry. There's always a "remnant", as it were, who are seeking the truly spiritual. quote: I understand. I do find spiritual strength in the context of an organized religious body. Though for the past several years, I have been a part of a "home church" movement that has sought to correct (within my circle of influence), what has become self-serving and rote in the context of larger denominational religion. However that doesn't mean that I think this is the only valid expression of Christianity. It's just where I have been personally led. The organization is less rigid, but not absent. Doctrine and definite belief is still important, as is set leadership and form. Having said all of that, my truest spiritual comfort comes from something that goes beyond all local expressions of Christian worship ... a higher unity of those who love God and Christ and desire to know him. In that sense I have many brothers. And even those outside of the Church, who are seeking truth, I consider my brothers as well. Stephen. |
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Stephanos
since 2000-07-31
Posts 3618Statesboro, GA, USA |
Oh, by the way. We can finish this discussion privately via email, or in another forum if you wish. I am aware that it doesn't involve critical analysis. Or maybe it does ...  Stephen |
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oceanvu2 Senior Member
since 2007-02-24
Posts 1066Santa Monica, California, USA |
Stephen: Your post to me was absolutely beautiful and clearly sincere. I thank you from the bottom of my heart for sharing this with me and others. Thank you for your invitation, but it is very hard for me to discuss Christian beliefs, and I wouldn't want to bother you with nattering from a nobody. Very best regards, Jim |
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Stephanos
since 2000-07-31
Posts 3618Statesboro, GA, USA |
Jim, You're no nobody. (hmmmm, that's a strange sentence). Seriously though, I can understand. I know the difficulties surrounding this. I'm no witch burner, I assure you. I don't view tough questions (even pointed ones) as necessarily disparaging. Without the chip-on-the-shoulder attitude, then such questions can only lead to learning for everyone. But I understand the discomfort and passion (negative or positive) involved. One of my goals in life is to take religion out of the taboo public discussion categories. It's either argued or not spoken of at all. Very little conversation in the middle spaces. But let conversations go where they may. Thanks for your replies. Stephen |
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rhia_5779 Senior Member
since 2006-06-09
Posts 1334California |
I agree with you on that, maybe if we talked about religons more and explored the reasons people are anti certain things or learn more about other peoples religions there might be a bit less fighting for it. |
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