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A home without a wall, |
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| Poetry Workshop |
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Those Smelly Feet! |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA 
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When you WANT all the WORDS to just FLOW like the SEA and you DON'T know the METH-od then TAKE it from ME. This great STYLE is the AN-swer to MAKE it come TRUE, just two SHORTS and one LONG is the THING you can DO. WANT to MAKE it POW-er-FUL? then THIS form DOES it WELL. START-ing OUT tro-CHA-ic IS the WAY to WEAVE this SPELL. LEAD-ing SOUNDS that CATCH the READ-er's EYE is THIS form's KEY. START with ONE strong SYL-a-BLE and YOU will QUICK-ly SEE. i-AM-bic STANDS out AS the LEAD-er OF po-ET-ic VERSE. al-THOUGH to MAST-er THIS one FORM can MAKE a PREACH-er CURSE. short, LONG, short LONG, just TAP your FEET and YOU will DO it WELL. you MAY be-COME a POE or ROB-ert SER-vice. WHO can TELL? Here are the three main forms of meter in writing rhymed poetry - anapestic, trochaic and iambic. Get your feet moving and give me a poem using one of these forms. Put your poem in a new thread and post the link to that thread here in this one. You done yet?  For those of you who critique, don't give me any GREAT POEM! or WOW! THAT'S COOL! FOllow the meter of the poem and state any areas where the form broke down. If you don't feel it broke down anywhere just say GREAT POEM! and we will take it from there. |
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| © Copyright 2008 Michael Mack - All Rights Reserved | |||
Alison 
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
'Scuse me, Mr. Balladeer (most wonderful teacher and all that good stuff that people who suck up say). I can't start a new thread on this board - I only get this message: Sorry, but you are not authorized to post a new topic in this particular forum. Only moderators, administrators, and authorized users may post new topics in this forum. ----- Could you maybe use your wizardly powers and fix this for me? Maybe? With the deepest gratitude, Alison |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Aha!I wasn't aware of that, being the new teacher here. Perhaps Marge or Munda knows, since they posted poems on this forum... help? |
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chopsticks Senior Member
since 2007-10-02
Posts 888The US, |
Balladeer, you are a modest man, with no reason to be so.( That is a reverse take on Mark Twain’s quote on modesty ). When it comes to writing, I would not question your knowledge about it , as I wouldn’t others on here , Brad and BobK, to mention a couple. Btw, Poe and Service are my favorites , after you of course . |
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Not A Poet Member Elite
since 1999-11-03
Posts 3885Oklahoma, USA |
Hey Mike, Nan has to authorize new students in here. Alison you can send her an email and she will get you set up. Or Mike could probably do it too, if he knew how, that is.  |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
Duck and Cover (It's Grandma)! Hide the liquor! Grandma’s coming to visit again! It’s no wonder that old woman is fashionably thin; Her hollow leg must run straight down from her thighs to her toes. She carries a flask in her girdle wherever she goes. Hide the family jewels! Grandma will be on the next train! She can still pick a pocket without showing great strain. Grandma stuffs wallets deep in her alligator bag. Her underwire bra won’t let any stolen goods sag. Hide the checkbook! Grandma can still copy all of our names! If she finds it, our reputations will go straight down the drain. Grandma rolls all her pennies (she loves to roll old men too). What’s an old lady to do when she becomes ninety-two? Batten the hatches; Grandma’s just now arrived at the door! There’s our sweet blue-haired Grandma that we all simply adore. Frisk her to make sure that there are no weapons in her hose, Grandma’s been known to pack an arsenal wherever she goes! We’d like to have a Grandma who bakes cookies and knits hats. But deep down inside we know that’s not where our Grandma’s at! She smokes cigars and cusses and she leers at young men. There is plenty of time to grow old, she just doesn’t know when! --- Alison |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Thank you, chopsticks, for your kind words. I will happily follow behind Poe and Service any day! Ok, Pete, thanks. No, I don't know how. Nan? Who's that? I got an e-mail from someone that could have been named that asking me to come in and get things going but haven't seen her since. Maybe I was dreaming?  |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Alison, that's a cute poem. I'm not looking for cute. For this lesson I'm looking for meter. HIDE the LIQ-or! GRAND-ma's CO-ming to VIS-it a_GAIN!.........(13)......./-/-/-/--/--/ it's no WON-der THAT old WO-man is FASH-ion-A-bly THIN....(14).......--/-/-/--/-/-/ GRAND-ma STUFFS WAL-lets DEEP in her AL-i-GAT-or BAG..(13)......./-//-/--/-/-/ her UN-der-WIRE BRA won't LET AN-y STO-len GOODS SAG..(13).......-/-//-//-/-// The numbers in parentheses is the syllable count. You did well in that. However, if the meter is not consistent, the syllable count loses value. At the end I break your accents down to short (-) and long (/). If you check your lines none of them hold an iambic, anapestic ot trochaic rythym throughout the line, much less the stanza. It doesn't flow. The rest of the poem is basically the same. No one said this was easy and I'm certainly not saying it, either. It takes a lot of work to come up with proper meter. Most will throw up their hands and say heck with it. I'll just write the way I want to....and that's fine. For those who want to write excellent verse, however, it will never be achieved without proper or well-planned meter. Those are the poems people remember and consider more than cute. Wanna try again?  |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
Yep, I do want to try again. Cute is not my objective either. I struggle with this meter stuff and getting a handle on it is my real hope by taking these lessons. Thank you and I'll review your response again and keep giving it a shot until I get a grasp on it. A |
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Munda Member Elite
since 1999-10-08
Posts 3544The Hague, The Netherlands |
Yep, Nan is the owner of the new student magic. Alison, I will have a look at your poem later, but trust me when I say I will surely have a hard time with this assignment. I know all about throwing my hands up and say 'heck with it', but somehow I can never resist the challenge and struggle until I get it right. (Until the teacher points out my mistakes! ) Balladeer, I hope I am allowed a couple of days for this assignment. Beside work, homework for my course 'writing for children', a book I'm working on and a map I'm creating for it, a son who insists on a meal now and then and the occasional hour of sleep I seem to need from time to time, I will make sure to submit something before the end of the week. Yeah... I can almost hear you think... excuses, excuses...  |
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nakdthoughts Member Laureate
since 2000-10-29
Posts 19200Between the Lines |
Silent Word The saddest sound I ever heard came from the deadened, silent word. A look of nothingness in eyes, when words non-loving reached my sighs. And how I gasped to breathe the air, to purify that deadened stare. Forget not ever, shock unheard, from deadened look of silent word. It reached into, turned inside out, the crying words, that could not shout. Instead they numbed me, thoughts and feel,such words of hurt, that seemed unreal. The muted, dampened, soaking tears, now left behind those youthful years, When happiness and loving thrilled, his deadened eyes, have all but killed. But say I, to myself in thought, a present to me, soon be brought. For wishes, dreams I've had but few in want of making memories, new. Released from mind soon, hurt of old, now making room for words that mold, To treasure keep, the silent word this time of loving only, heard. Beholding soon, your pair of eyes, blue pools that drown me into sighs. Surrounding me in silence sweet, to coat my thoughts in warmth, complete. With touch of gentleness, your song, will slowly turn, to right the wrong. And in my silence, love shall reign, to shower me, in life, again. M... a poem rearranged from 2000 once inspired by Balladeer ( not sure if it meets which feet...)p.s. I undoubled my lines so the rhyming is within each line "Love is not blind - It sees more and not less, but because it sees more, it is willing to see less." (Will Moss) |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Munda, take all the time you need. I'm not going anywhere.... |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Maureen, I bow to your greatness! This is a wonderful poem. It is perfect iambic, it flows throughout each line and I can find no fault with it whatsoever. It also shows how setting up a rythym can make the reader read the way you want it done. For example... But say I, to myself in thought, a present to me, soon be brought. This line could be read in different ways. It could be read... BUT SAY i to my-SELF in THOUGHT, a PRE-sent to ME, SOON be BOUGHT..//---/-/-/--//-/ This is choppy and kills the rythym of the poem completely. However, your excellent iambic to this point which has manifested itself in the reader's mind, will cause them to read.. but SAY i TO my-SELF in THOUGHT, a PRE-sent TO me, SOON be BOUGHT ...perfect iambic. The difficulty in writing good meter is not only getting the long and short syllables in the proper place, but getting the reader to read it the way you want it read. That makes all the difference. Here you have done it in an excellent manner. There will be no eraser cleaning for you! |
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Nan
Administrator
Member Seraphic
since 1999-05-20
Posts 21191Cape Cod Massachusetts USA |
 The door's opened Shhhh - don't tell Balladeer I was here. He might stop doing all this good work..  |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
I'll just stay in this thread with this poem as I started it in here, but will do all others in their own post. Thank you, Nan! Okay, my eyes are spinning and my feet are tapping out of control. Here's my corrected homework -- now I am off to dust erasers.  (Whooops, I didn't mean to erase the teacher. Honest) ---- Duck and Cover (It's Grandma)! Hide the liquor! Grandma’s coming back to visit again! It is liquor keeping Grandma fashionably thin In her hollow legs seems like the gin flows to her toes Grandma stashes merlot bottles among stacks of panty hose Hide the family jewels! Grandma’s riding that noon train! Fingers picking stranger’s pockets, sticky once again. Grandma pushes pilfered wallets down her canvas bag. Wired bras heft stolen goods from occupational drag. Hide the checkbook! Grandma can still forge all our names. Believe it; our reputations will flow on down the drain. Grandma rolls her pennies (often rolling men for money too) Recreation narrowed when Grandma became ninety-two! Batten all the hatches; Grandma’s arrived at the door! Darling little Grandma whom we so lovingly adore Frisk her quick to ensure that there's no weapon in her hose; Grandma always packs an arsenal when moving on the go We’d love to have Grandma bake nice cookies and sew hats. Yet we all know that is not where Grandma’s mind is at! Grandma smokes on cigars and she leers at younger men. Telling us there’s lots of time to age - and she’ll tell us when. Alison [This message has been edited by Alison (05-05-2008 12:48 AM).] |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Hide the liquor! Grandma’s coming back to visit again! ..........(14)...../-/-/-/-/-/--/ It is liquor keeping Grandma fashionably thin..........................(13)...../-/-/-/-/-/-/ In her hollow legs seems like the gin flows to her toes ...........(13)....--/-/-/-//--/ Grandma stashes merlot bottles among stacks of panty hose .(15).../-/-/-/--//-/-/ As you can see, the syllable counts are off in the first stanza. and the meter off in three lines. In the first line "VIS-it a-GAIN" deviates from the meter. Well, since the line has one syllable too many, that's easy to fix. We can make it "Hide the liquor! Grandma's coming over once again!" The third line is pretty much of a mess with respect to meter. Let's go with "Seems like gin, through hollow legs, goes right down to her toes." Fourth line has too many syllables and "among stacks" kills meter. How about "Grandma stashes Merlot bottles under panty hose."? Hide the family jewels! Grandma’s riding that noon train! ........(13) .../-/-/-/-/-/-/ Fingers pick in stranger’s pockets, sticky once again. ............(13) ../-/-/-/-/-/-/ (perfect) Grandma pushes pilfered wallets down her canvas bag. .........(13).../-/-/-/-/-/-/ (perfect) Wired bras heft stolen goods from occupational sag................(13).. /-/-/-/-/-/-// The second stanza is very good as far as the syllable counts and meter goes, as long as I grant you that "jewels" and "wired" and "family" are two-syllable words. I don't care for "occupational sag", which sounds clumsy and throws the meter off but I leave that to you. Hide the checkbook! Grandma can still copy down our names.(13) /-/-/-/-/-/-/ Believe it; our reputations will flow on down the drain................(14) -/--/-/--/-/-/ Grandma rolls her pennies (often rolling men for money too).....(15) /-/-/-/-/-/-/-/ Recreation narrowed when Grandma became ninety-two! ........(14) /-/-/--/--//-/ Disaster! syllable counts are all over the place which has a majot effect on the meter. The first line is perfect and then all crashes. In the second line you begin with an iambic word (-/) "believe", whereas, you had always led off with a trochaic one (/-). How about something like "Holy cow! Our reputations will go down the drain". Third line has two syllables too many and one useless two-syllable word (often) so that's easy enough to fix. To fix the fourth line, which has a syllable too many and deviations in meter, we can change "became" to "hit". The meter will still be off in one place but we can live with it. Batten all the hatches; Grandma’s arrived at the door! ............(13) /-/-/-/--/--/ Darling little Grandma whom we lovingly so adore ..................(14) /-/-/-/-/-//-/ Frisk her to ensure that there are no weapons in her hose;.......(14) /-/-/-/--/-/-/ Grandma always packs an arsenal when moving on the go ......(15) /-/-/-/-/-/-/-/ Line #1, "at the" are words that hurt the meter. Replace "arrived" with "here now". Line #2 has one sullable too many and one useless word, "so". Easy to fix. Take it out. Line #3 has one syllable too many and one useless word, "that". Do the same thing. Line #4, two extra syllables and one two-syllable word too many, "always". We’d love to have Grandma bake nice cookies and sew hats. ..(13) -/--/-/-/--/- Yet we all know that is not where Grandma’s mind is at! .........(13) -/-/--/-/-/-/ Grandma smokes on cigars and she often leers at young men..(14) /-/--/--/-/-/- Telling us there’s lots of time to age and she’ll tell us when.......(14) /-/-/-/-/--/-/ well, you began the first two lines with iambic words, deviating from the other trochaic beginnings and, in both cases, the meter was thrown off. Line #3 needs changes to the meter since you put "and she" in there. Line #4 the same with "and she'll". We need to change this whole stanza Ok, let's throw in my changes and you read the revised poem and let me know if it sounds any better to you. Say no if you don't think so, please. I won't make you clean erasers...promise! Hide the liquor! Grandma's coming over once again! It is liquor keeping Grandma fashionably thin. Seems like gin, through hollow legs, goes right down to her toes. Grandma stashes Merlot bottles under panty hose. Hide the family jewels! Grandma’s riding that noon train! Fingers pick in stranger’s pockets, sticky once again. Grandma pushes pilfered wallets down her canvas bag. Wired bras heft stolen goods from occupational sag. Hide the checkbook! Grandma can still copy down our names. Holy cow! Our reputations will go down the drain. Grandma rolls her pennies ( rolling men for money too). Recreation narrowed when Grandma hit ninety-two! Batten all the hatches; Grandma’s here now at the door! Darling little Grandma whom we lovingly adore. Frisk her to ensure there are no weapons in her hose. Grandma packs an arsenal when moving on the go. How we'd love to have her bake nice cookies and sew hats, All here know, though, that is not where Grandma’s mind is at! Grandma smokes cigars and often leers at younger men Telling us there’s lots of time to age. She’ll tell us when. It's still rough and can use more polishing but that's more of a vocabulary thing. Let me say that I admire you, Alison. Instead of giving up you show that you are determined to put in whatever effort necessary to try to improve this part of the craft and I applaud you for that! I'll help you in any way I can. (don't forget to bring my apple tomorrow!) |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
Okay, I printed your response and am going to look at it again. I really appreciate your time - I have struggled with this for a long time. I am not sure that I understand "long" and "short" - and am feeling rather idiotic at the moment. I think that your example will be really helpful because I can look over the poem as you are seeing it - and build on the changes. I'd like to try this assignment again with another poem. I think I am a bit mired in what I once saw in my head - maybe it would be best to give this one a rest. What do you think, illustrious teacher? Are you willing to hang with me on another shot at this assignment? Thank you, Alison PS - I agree about the 'occupational drag' part - and everything else. Is it possible to be rhythmiclaly handicapped? I just don't tap in sync with the rest of the world maybe. Okay enough excuses and whining. I am gonna bury this one and work on another tomorrow. |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
Maybe my problem is that my feet don't smell enough! --- Poetic Snit My feet just seem to tap totally out of sync I am so frustrated I might need a stiff drink I can’t count out a waltz and I can’t even knit If counting is involved, I just cannot do it! My head aches; my stomach is rolling and churning My poor brain throbs from all this poetic learning Why is poetry so complicated to write? I’ll flunk class if I don’t learn to count meter right! This poem should read like a plaintive country song Whining might make it easier to find what’s wrong Maybe I am too stubborn to just up and quit I am truly in a metered poetic snit! --- Alison  |
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Essorant Member Elite
since 2002-08-10
Posts 4769Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada |
I gave this ensample in another thread to try to express iambic very plainly. Perhaps it may help Alison hear the meter more clearly: (Every second syllable is the "beat" you are looking for): BeHIND this ROSE in SEcreCY of MANy THINGS is KEPT the KEY. And many farers come to me And ask the runes of victory The runes of love, the runes of lore The runes of weal, the runes of war But nothing from my answerhoard Shall I uplift to any lord Or lady come to me in need: For nothing nothing is the meed. But whoso gives his hearty cares To write a verse, whoever dares, This enterprise of price pursue His due devoir in deed to do Whoever seeks, with this in mind, The answers truly he shall find. For him that comes with poetry For him I turn to turn the key. The most important part is hearing the main (or "long") stresses first, then you may see how they are used to fill the pattern of "beats" (the syllables that are capitalized). It is the main stresses that are the BEATS in a poem. 1. If a word is one syllable distinguish whether it is a Function Word or not. If it is not a function word then it has main stress. If it is a function word it doesn't. 2. If a word is more than one syllable, only one syllable in the word has the main stress. Pronounce the word carefully and listen for the syllable that has more pressure in pronunciation than all the others. In horror the first syllable has the main stress (HORror). Sometimes pronouncing the word incorrectly may help find out where the stress is. Pronouncing horror as horROR, putting most force on the second syllable, sounds incorrect to the ear, and thereby one may be the more sure that the stress must be on first syllable. If you are unsure of the correct pronunciation , then usually the dictionary may help. For example, at dictionary.com the pronunciation is given in brackets with the syllable that has the main stress in bold type: "Horror [hawr-er, hor-]" Exception::The only exception to main stresses being the beats is that sometimes other syllables get away as "beats" by being necessary / important to the word-structure or sentence structure, or being given special emphasis.) Hope that helps a bit. |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
Thank you, Essorant, for adding to the explanations. I think it all is slowly coming together. One of my confusions is understanding the stress on one syllable words and how they fit as 'smelly feet'. I feel like I am teetering on understanding after printing and reading the comments on this thread. I also have been reading Stephen Fry's book "The Ode Less Travelled" and will get it out and see if the chapters regarding stress, rhythm, meter, etc make more sense. So far, the only stress I am feeling is in my head. Thank you both for the time that you are taking to pull me through - and I will be back tomorrow with my third version of my Grandma poem. Poor Grandma, it's not her fault that I am struggling. I am beginning to detest her and her bagging hose! A |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Alison, you are not alone. Mysteria began a support group for people with feet problems called the DaDummers and they go to meetings and chant da DUM for hours on end. I realize that, for those who have a natural ear for it, it seems simple and, for those who do not, it can be torturous but, once again, I appreciate your tenacity and will be here for you through da and DUM.The only thing I ask of people is that they make the attempt. You are certainly doing that. |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Essorant, thank you for your input. Your example poem is very precise and accurate, along with your helpful hints and insights. The only thing I would question would be your statement If a word is more than one syllable, only one syllable in the word has the main stress, but I think we may have discussed that before. In your poem, for example, the word "enterprise" is used. One may argue that there is only one main stress syllable while others would contend that there are two - EN-ter-PRISE, with both accented syllables given equal stress. For the purpose of this lesson, though, (and not to make Alison's head explode!) it is suffice to say that one uses the stressed and unstressed syllables to create iambic, trochaic, anapestic, dactylic, and spondees to create the proper rythym, without one standing up and claiming, "I'm the MAIN man and don't you forget it!" Thanks again for sharing your knowledge with us.Alison, this link leads to a page which I consider to be VERY complete and informative for those wishing to learn more of stress, rythym, beats, accents and feet and written in such a way it is easily understandable. I suggest you check it out. http://www.anitraweb.org/kalliope/rhythm1.html |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
For those of you who hadn't seen it, our brilliant little Kit McCallum wrote a terrific lesson in poetic form on this same subject six years ago. Six years ago???? WOW! Where does the time go...? /main/forumdisplay.cgi?action=displayarchive&number=69&topic=002478 |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
Dear Mr. Balladeer, I hate feet. I have always hated feet. I hate them on the end of legs and I hate them in poetry (where they attempt to disguise their little toes under poetic verbiage). Anyway, I am taking all the suggested reading, all the lessons, my "Walrus and the Carpenter" poem and heading out for a day of fun and frolic at work. When their is a break, I am dutifully going to take a look at my feet and the feet of others. I have read that poem by Kit and love it. I understand what everyone is telling me when I read it, it's when I write it that it all unravels. Also, I have found a help line 1-800-DAD-UMIS. I called but they are real dummies. Anyway, see what I have regressed to. Thanks and your apple is on the way. I am sending it book rate to you. A (and THAT'S probably the ONLY "A" that I'll see on anything close to me in this lesson) |
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Essorant Member Elite
since 2002-08-10
Posts 4769Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada |
Balladeer I think most experts agree that a word with more than one syllable has only one syllable that has the most amount of stress, and that is what I am calling the main stress, and main stresses are generally the beats when put in a poetic pattern. But as an exception, I pointed out that other syllables may sometimes be used as beats as well. This often needs to be based on where the main stress is though. For example, you can get away with ENterPRISE or ENterprise, because EN is the main and stationary stress (unless you use the word unnaturally or with a foreign accent). A main stress in a word (such as EN in ENterprise) is always followed by a syllable with less stress (as ter in ENterprise), and then the syllable after (the prise of ENterprise) always has a little more stress than the syllable before it, only because stress alternates between less and more, therefore the word stress of ENterprise, may show up with one or two beats in poetry: ENterprise or ENterPRISE. But the most amount of stress is still on the EN- of enterprise, and therefore that syllable is generally always a beat. [This message has been edited by Essorant (05-05-2008 03:10 PM).] |
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Essorant Member Elite
since 2002-08-10
Posts 4769Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada |
Alison It is not necessary to use the concept of "feet" and the special terminologies that go along with it. Whoever understands stress, shall understand what is going on within any example of meter, whether or not the concept of "feet" is used. For a beginner or for one struggling, though, I think it somewhat hindering to deal with the clutter of "feet" "anapests" "spondees" etc, that are based on stresses, when that same person may not be able to recognize stresses yet. Just focus on stress. Once you understand that, everything else shall be much more understandable too |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
That's fine, essorant. As I mentioned, this is not the place for a debate over such a point and will do little more than confuse an already confused person. As you point out, stress is the answer...and the less stress Alison or anyone goes through to learn this manner of writing is best. Looking forward to the apple |
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nakdthoughts Member Laureate
since 2000-10-29
Posts 19200Between the Lines |
Thanks Mike. I have never had much trouble with rhythm or rhyme. Don't know if it comes naturally or if my previous poetry site drummed it into me way back when I post what sounds good to my ear ...  M |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
I understand, Maureen, and that ear is very important. Ok, you won the first leg of the triple crown. Anapestic is next. Let's see what ya got! |
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Nan
Administrator
Member Seraphic
since 1999-05-20
Posts 21191Cape Cod Massachusetts USA |
Write a poem about smelly feet? I can do that... Playing barefoot is fun, don’t you think? It’s too bad that my feet really stink! I’ve tried cleaning and scrubbing my toes So my feet can be freely exposed, But no matter how hard I might try All those anapests lead me awry! They are having a toejamb-oree Without asking permission from me. Twixt my toes is not where they belong. I won’t have it – I’m shedding my thongs!  |
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Not A Poet Member Elite
since 1999-11-03
Posts 3885Oklahoma, USA |
OK Teach. if I understood right, this is how you wanted it posted and linked. Link here Go kinda easy huh? This is the first thing I have written that's not a computer program in a long time. Pete |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Lookee here! What's this sight that I see? Is that Nan writing something for me? Whoda thought she could get so darn brave That she'd finally come out of her cave? It's a miracle, boys, that's a fact One could say that she's been Michael Macked! I can easily rest in my grave Knowing Nan has come out of her cave! By the way, folks, her poem is a wonderful anapestic display of how it's done right...so what's new? |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
Wishing on the Tides The ocean whispered promise, hearing young love’s wish as gentle tides seemed to sip lightly at sand shores. The tantalizing breeze was the taste of first kiss; now memories lost in the early days of yore. A silhouette, worn edges, danced on jewels, smoothed bright, such explosion of color painted the new dawn. Framed shadows, mermaid pictured, sunrise washed warm light. The gentle current carried her sweet, plaintive song. Pure longing rose to lift deep waters darker blue. Her pale arms tenderly stretched towards golden lit shores; to capture his heart’s desire, her love was true. Tides blustered fiercely, setting forth an angry roar. Once peaceful sea, churned wildly; its intent clear to sweep a stalwart man to his new lover’s home. A sailor’s given one wish that he longs for dear; now land-locked no more, he swims freely in sea foam. When tides lap golden sand shores, and dusk frames moon light, one can hear haunting music lifting with the waves, and lovers dance, as forever one, close and tight. Their night light show incites awe, mere mortals rave. --- Alison |
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serenity blaze Member Empyrean
since 2000-02-02
Posts 27738 |
sigh... Karen drags her butt to the chalkboard.. *ahem* I am afraid to tackle this. It's different. I know it is. But trust that I am trying it. Iambic stuff is my third tit. *wince*  |
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Essorant Member Elite
since 2002-08-10
Posts 4769Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada |
Here is a little attempt to paraphrase the beginning of the bible with anapestic meter. I always thought the bible would read much better with rhyme First Elohim, with word and with hand, Both created the heavens and land That was shapeless and wanting of grace , Darkness over the fathomy face. And the spirit and breathing of God Then o'erfluttered the waters abroad. He said words thus: "Be light!" and it stood, He saw light and he saw it was good, And from darkness divided the light Called it "day" and the darkness the "night" There was evening and morning's red ray Thus it went: the good work of one day. |
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Munda Member Elite
since 1999-10-08
Posts 3544The Hague, The Netherlands |
Too Much! You're all too quick! I can't keep up!  I shall spent tomorrow evening on reading and replying. |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
I agree, Essorant, that the Bible would certainly sound better in rhyme There were too many deviations to call it anapestic but it was clever  |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Alison, you're doing MUCH better! Your syllable count on this last one is on the money. Undortunately, even with the syllable count correct, the rythym must be good and consistent for it to matter. The ocean whispered promise, hearing young love’s wish as gentle tides seemed to sip lightly at sand shores. The tantalizing breeze was the taste of first kiss; now memories lost in the early days of yore. A silhouette, worn edges, danced on jewels, smoothed bright, such explosion of color painted the new dawn. Framed shadows, mermaid pictured, sunrise washed warm light. The gentle current carried her sweet, plaintive song. Pure longing rose to lift deep waters darker blue. Her pale arms tenderly stretched towards golden lit shores; to capture his heart’s desire, her love was true. Tides blustered fiercely, setting forth an angry roar. Once peaceful sea, churned wildly; its intent clear to sweep a stalwart man to his new lover’s home. A sailor’s given one wish that he longs for dear; now land-locked no more, he swims freely in sea foam. When tides lap golden sand shores, and dusk frames moon light, one can hear haunting music lifting with the waves, and lovers dance, as forever one, close and tight. Their night light show incites awe, mere mortals rave. heck out the bold areas. That is where the iambic is lost because of using either two stressed or two unstressed syllables or words together. Say them out loud and learn to recognize stressed and unstressed sounds. Keep it up. You are improving greatly |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
Okay, I am going to look at this one again. I understand what you are saying (which is some progress). Thank you - and I'll have something in here tomorrow. Are you getting tired of me yet? A |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Never!  |
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Munda Member Elite
since 1999-10-08
Posts 3544The Hague, The Netherlands |
Alison: I really admire your determination. I've been there and know exactly how you are feeling, but don't give up. You WILL (to your own surprise) suddenly understand 'stress'. I tried to explain 'iambic' to an other poet once and thought it may be of some help to you, so I copied it for you. Hope it helps and good luck! quote: p.s. I still struggle with meter! |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
Wishing on the Tides The ocean whispers promises of young love’s wish as gentle tides swell to rush quickly upon shores. Soft breezes tantalize while savoring pure kiss; new memories, once only tales from days of yore. A silhouette, moves slowly, glassy waters bright as pastels paint the sunrise lifting a new dawn. A mermaid levitates from topaz morning light. The gentle current carries a soft, plaintive song. Her entreaties stretch across waters saline blue. Such expressive eyes beseeching him leave the shores; to captivate his heart, her desire is true. Tides bluster fiercely, setting forth an angry roar. Once peaceful water rolls, the intention now clear; to sweep this stalwart man to his new lover’s home. A sailor’s given one wish that he may long to hear; now locked to land no more, he swims in ocean’s foam. When nocturnal moon washes shells in deep of night soft melodies rise above whispered peaceful waves, and, embracing, the lovers song incites delight. Their adoration draws the stars to hold and save. Alison ---------- Okay, my fingers are crossed. I even did the bold thing that you do so I could see what I was doing. I even found myself counting in my head - I feel like Eliza Doolittle. I know if I can just say the "rain in spain falls mainly in the plains" you will start dancing. Yep, that's my vision anyway. Munda, this is so kind of you and I have printed out all the responses to save and read over. I appreciate your encouragement. I am feeling a bit 'duncey' right now. But .. ins spite of the frustration, I am having lots of fun! Alison [This message has been edited by Alison (05-07-2008 03:33 AM).] |
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Essorant Member Elite
since 2002-08-10
Posts 4769Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada |
quote: Indeed, I have difficulty coming up with so many unstressed syllables. Does this work any better: First Elohim, with word and with hand, Both created the heavens and land That was shapeless and empty of grace. There was dark on the fathomy face. And the spirit and breathing of God Had o'erfluttered the waters abroad. He then spoke thus: "Be light!" and it stood, There was light and he saw it was good, And from darkness divided the light, Called it "day" and the darkness the "night". There was evening and morning's red ray Thus it went: the good work of one day. [This message has been edited by Essorant (05-07-2008 06:11 PM).] |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Essorant, actually my saying "too many" was overstated and I apologize. The areas that struck me were as follows: I'm not sure how Elohim is correctly pronounced but I assume the accent is on EL. If that is the case, then the beginning is not anapestic, nor is it if the accent is on the second syllable, with FIRST being a stressed word. 2nd line...BOTH cre-AT-ed....not anapestic. BOTH is too strong. Perhaps if you substituted WHICH it would be more suitable. Actually the rest of it is very good and maintains the correct meter throughout. Nice job. |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
The ocean whispers promises of young love’s wish as gentle tides swell to rush quickly upon shores. Soft breezes tantalize while savoring pure kiss; new memories, once only tales from days of yore. A silhouette, moves slowly, glassy waters bright as pastels paint the sunrise lifting a new dawn. A mermaid levitates from topaz morning light. The gentle current carries a soft, plaintive song. Her entreaties stretch across waters saline blue. Such expressive eyes beseeching him leave the shores; to captivate his heart, her desire is true. Tides bluster fiercely, setting forth an angry roar. Once peaceful water rolls, the intention now clear; to sweep this stalwart man to his new lover’s home. A sailor’s given one wish that he may long to hear; now locked to land no more, he swims in ocean’s foam. When nocturnal moon washes shells in deep of night soft melodies rise above whispered peaceful waves, and, embracing, the lovers song incites delight. Their adoration draws the stars to hold and save. Alison, you're getting better but you still need to read the lines aloud and listen for the stressed (or strong) syllable or lines. Munda gave some wonderful advice. Case in point...your second line. as gentle tides swell to rush quickly upon shores. "as", of course, is unstressed. "gen" is stressed, "tle" is unstressed and "tides" is stressed. All good so far but then "swell" comes along and it is stressed so you have "tides swell" together, two stressed words...a no-no. "to" is unstressed and "rush" is stressed (good) but followed by "quick", which is also stressed so you have "RUSH QUICK-ly, two stressed syllables together, a second no-no. "-ly is unstressed but so is "up-", which puts two unstressed little buggers side by side, followed by "-on shores", two stresses. You need to read it, recognize the accents and eliminate areas in need of work. As GENT-le TIDES then SWELL to RUSH up-ON the SHORES. That is iambic. You need to experiment around and find words that allow you to maintain the meter. One piece of advise I always give is....never fall in love with a line. There are always other ways to say something which will maintain the meter if yours does not. Find them. (The only exception to this rule is that, if the line is so incredible you MUST use it, then make the rest of the poem fit the meter the line is in.) Keep trying...I'm here! |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
Wishing on the Tides On whispers, breezes lift the longing wish to ocean fairies flying over shores. The winds may carry craving's need for bliss; this wish on waves some lovers do implore. A mermaid sailing upon ocean's light, the pastels paint a vibrant shade this dawn. As dreamy aura soars off topaz light the currents wash her notes of plaintive song. While solo stretches over waters blue a longing draws her lover from the shore; she suffers growing need, as love is true. The ocean swelters, heated passion pours. With waters rolling, all is crystal clear; to take one to his lover’s saline home. The oceans swirl to show the love so pure. He lives with her in depth of frothing foam. The moon, so silver, watches from the sky, as music wells in duets shared in waves. Then, within stars, the magic reaches high the ocean fairies sprinkle 'wishing days'. ... Alison (I am not quitting until I drive one of us to drink) [This message has been edited by Alison (05-08-2008 12:52 PM).] |
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Munda Member Elite
since 1999-10-08
Posts 3544The Hague, The Netherlands |
 Allison! You're almost there! As far as I can tell only four small errors. inSTILL - maRine - aMONG - creATE. But then, I could be wrong, after all I'm Dutch and nuts. Back to Anna Pest for me. The girl is giving me a headache. |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
Munda, Thank you for the encouragement and suggestions. I made those changes and a few more that I edited while waiting for my latte at the drive-through stand. My head has a bruise from banging it against my screen! xoxoxox to you both (never forgetting the ever patient Balladeer), A |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Alison....what can I say? I feel like I've just witnessed the birth of a poet. What an incredible improvement and what tenacity you demonstrate! I am very proud of you, miss. This is truly awesome. I think that, if you look at your first attempt and compare it to the last one, you will see the incredible difference. Before your head gets too big, however, there WAS one mistake. A mermaid sailing upon ocean's light, Two unstressed syllables together (ing+up). That's it. You may now go back to feeling brilliant....and deservedly so. One more thing..... One of the traps rhymers fall into (and what rhymers are criticized most heavily on) is that they throw in words that shouldn't be there for the sole purpose on maintaning the rythym.Your "do" in the first line and a couple "so"'s qualify for that. Be careful not to let that look obvious. Now go get drunk! You deserve it! |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
With the changes (hope that I didn't screwe it up - I think it still is okay). I really appreciate you pulling me along. I might get drunk tomorrow. My brain is too fried right now. Thank you, most wonderful teacher. Alison ------------------------------- Wishing on the Tides On whispers, breezes lift a longing wish to ocean fairies flying over shores. Some winds may carry couple's need for bliss; this wish on waves the lovers’ sighs implore. A mermaid, graceful, brushes ocean light; the pastels paint a vibrant shade this dawn. As dreamy aura soars off topaz light the currents wash her notes of plaintive song. While solo stretches over waters blue a longing draws her lover from the shore; she suffers growing need, as love is true. The ocean swelters, heated passion pours. With waters rolling, all is crystal clear; to take one to his lover’s saline home. The oceans swirl to show a love so pure. He lives with her in depth of frothing foam. The moon, sighs silver, watches from the sky, as music wells in duets shared in waves. Then, within stars, the magic reaches high the ocean fairies sprinkle 'wishing days'. ... Alison |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
  It is a work to be proud of, Alison...and I am proud of you |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
:: Hugs you :: Thank you. A |
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Kit McCallum
Administrator
Member Laureate
since 2000-04-30
Posts 14774Ontario, Canada |
To Micheal the brilliant teacher ... and Alison the determined pupil ... Well done!  You've done beautifully Alison ... and Michael, your explanations were superb! Good job with ALL the work in this thread. It was a treat to read through from beginning to end. It will be a great tool and lesson for all to read! Best wishes, /Kit |
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Nan
Administrator
Member Seraphic
since 1999-05-20
Posts 21191Cape Cod Massachusetts USA |
I'm smiling.. A job well done! |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
Thank you both. Couldn't do it without a patient teacher. It's fun and I want to learn. Alison |
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Claira Member
since 2008-05-11
Posts 102British but living in Thailand |
sidles into class as quietly as possible, damn, didn't mean to scrap my chair. Sorry I'm late for lessons Mr Balladeer. I've tried to post my first attempt at an Iambic poem but have the same problems Alison did. So here is my attempt, only a couple of verses but I'm not sure if I doing it correctly, off to do more studying now: Back to School The teacher set class a task, which put me in a panic Its probably easier to rebuild the Titanic I take my pen and grabbing book, I sneak back into school As spit wads gather around me, creating a great pool. The other students fair quite well, I know I’m the rookie I’m slipping out with Alison, go and play some hooky Teacher please be gentle now, you really are a tonic. So is this poem nearly there, metered and Iambic? |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Hello, Claira! It's always a pleasure to welcome a new student! We have plenty of desks available. Ok, let's begin..... Your syllable count is not bad. You basically use a 14 syllable line, slipping to 15 a couple of times. The iambic is not bad for a first try, either. If you look at the bold type you will see where you either put two stressed or two unstressed syllables together. Iambic, of course, is based on unstressed-stressed flow (da-DUM). If you work on those areas, it will help greatly. Using commas to separate sentences doesn't work, as you have done in lines 3,5,6 and seven and, aside from misspelling fair, which should be fare, you have done quite well! the TEACH-er set CLASS a TASK, which PUT me IN a PAN-ic. it's PROB-a -BLY EAS-i-ER to RE-build the ti-TAN-ic i TAKE my PEN and GRAB-bing BOOK, i SNEAK back IN-to SCHOOL as SPIT wads GATH-er a-ROUND me, cre-A-ting a GREAT POOL. the OTH-er STU-dents FAIR quite WELL. i KNOW that I'M the ROOK-ie i'm SLIP-ping OUT with AL-li-SON, GO and PLAY some HOOK-y TEACH-er, PLEASE be GENT-le NOW, you REAL-ly ARE a TON-ic so IS this PO-em NEAR-ly THERE, MET-ered and i-AM-bic I will rewrite it in iambic and perhaps you will see the difference and pick up a few pointers to help you with your next one. Also, references in this thread you may want to check out will also help. Welcome to the class, my new friend. All you need here is the desire to learn and you have shown that so my time is yours The teacher gave the class a task, which put me in a panic. I think it would be easier rebuilding the Titanic. I take my pen and, grabbing book, I sneak back into school As spitwads gather 'round me to create a massive pool. The other students fare quite well. I know that I'm the rookie. I'm slipping out with Alison to go and play some hooky. Dear teacher, please be gentle now. You really are a tonic. So is this poem nearly there, both metered and iambic? Hope this helps |
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Alison
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy! |
Hey Claire Glad that you came on in. Alison |
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Claira Member
since 2008-05-11
Posts 102British but living in Thailand |
Thank you most kindly sir. Your help and time is valuable to me. Yes, seeing the difference does help. A lot.I originally had a similar line #2 but changed it. I think I beginning to understand the basics of iambic a bit more, been studying  Thank you again for your warm welcome, see you soon Claira Alison- Thanks for the encouragement, left to me it would have taken me months to come to school Cxxx [This message has been edited by Claira (05-13-2008 11:31 AM).] |
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Essorant Member Elite
since 2002-08-10
Posts 4769Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada |
In the times of kingdoms lived a manly man of mighty worth Truth's example and the flow'r indeed of chivalry on earth. Anyone want to add a couplet in Trochaic meter, and continue the poem? |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Be glad to, sir, but can you tell me what rhyme scheme your couplet represents and why you used a 13 syllable line followed by one of 15 syllables? Just curious....it would help to know this while trying to attach a couplet. |
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Essorant Member Elite
since 2002-08-10
Posts 4769Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada |
Alas, sorry for the miscount. It is corrected now: a couplet of two fifteen-syllable lines! |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Worth can come in many forms, not only gold and jewels suffice. Kindnesses to others proves invaluable and has no price. |
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Essorant Member Elite
since 2002-08-10
Posts 4769Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada |
Under heavens heroes clash in many meetings of the sword, Many of the battlebrightest thanes are sword-felled for their lord. [This message has been edited by Essorant (05-13-2008 05:37 PM).] |
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Claira Member
since 2008-05-11
Posts 102British but living in Thailand |
Hello teacher, just to let you know I'm not ducking out of class. I tried another poem but have realised that I am trying to run before I can walk. I am now attempting a shorter syllable count and will see you soon.  Claira I've just posted my new attempt at imabic, not sure how to do the linkey thing yet  /pip/Forum22/HTML/000908.html [This message has been edited by Claira (05-17-2008 04:11 AM).] |
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Munda Member Elite
since 1999-10-08
Posts 3544The Hague, The Netherlands |
Claira, welcome to the Workshop. I'm sure you will enjoy it here. Alison! It was such a pleasure to see your work develop and your determination is admirably. Take a bow, you deserve it. |
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rachaelfuchsberger
since 2007-02-21
Posts 609Las Vegas, NV |
AnaPEStic is STRANGE Makes me FEEL quite derANGED Words must BE rearrANGED For this STYLE that is STRANGE Short short LONG is a PAIN AnaPEStic is STRANGE Arana Darkwolf |
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