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Edward Grim
Senior Member
since 2005-12-18
Posts 1154
Greenville, South Carolina

0 posted 2007-07-20 03:51 PM


This is a little side question off of John's "Are Animals People" thread.


Does God frown on the torturing of animals? We assume that they don't have souls so they probably don't go to Heaven, right?

And in the Bible, they were always killing animals in sacrifice to God. So... Is it considered a sin against God to hurt/torture/kill an animal?

I'm personally disgusted with the torturing of these creatures. They are completely innocent and we still harm them needlessly.

From John's link, I read this:

quote:
"I am confident that the hottest places in hell are reserved for the souls of sick and brutal people who hold God's creatures in such brutal and cruel contempt," he said.





“Well all the apostles, they’re sittin’ on the swings, sayin’ I’d sell off my savior for a set of new rings.”

© Copyright 2007 Edward Grant - All Rights Reserved
SEA
Deputy Moderator 10 ToursDeputy Moderator 5 Tours
Moderator
Member Seraphic
since 2000-01-18
Posts 22676
with you
1 posted 2007-07-20 04:51 PM


I don't know if I believe in burning in hell exactly, but oh yeah, I think the sick people will get theirs....and I do believe animals have souls...
Huan Yi
Member Ascendant
since 2004-10-12
Posts 6688
Waukegan
2 posted 2007-07-20 06:03 PM


.


“And in the Bible, they were always killing animals in sacrifice to God. So... Is it considered a sin against God to hurt/torture/kill an animal?”

Well, how does an omnipotent god feel about animals being scourged
and then crucified?

.

Mistletoe Angel
Deputy Moderator 10 ToursDeputy Moderator 10 ToursDeputy Moderator 5 Tours
Member Empyrean
since 2000-12-17
Posts 32816
Portland, Oregon
3 posted 2007-07-20 06:34 PM


This is indeed a tough issue to talk about, often loomed with many contradictions I believe, and it's because of those contradictions I have been a vegetarian for over four years and going now.

I believed and I continue to believe that there is an ethical way to hunting an animal, as I have learned the Lakota and Sioux in particular understood; that whenever an animal was to be hunted, that the hunter would pay a proper blessing and respects to the animal, as well as promise to distribute the food democratically among the community.

Ultimately, I can understand how even that has some contradictions, in that ultimately it's killing an animal all the same and the animal surely feels tortured from it, but it is in my belief there are more ethical ways in preparing the hunt than others.

I became a vegetarian on the basis that, too often in the news, I heard food manufacturers and hog farms doing things to animals I found especially atrocious, like slicing the legs off of live steer and dumping young pigs into tubs of boiling water. I cannot accept that kind of treatment toward animals, and it got to the point where it seemed so commonplace, I didn't know who to trust anymore, and thus I didn't want to live with that guilty pang in my stomach that my dollars I spend for poultry at the supermarket were going to condone those especially barbaric acts on animals, so, I became a vegetarian. Not because I believe carnivores are evil people who hate animals and such like many radicals at PETA preach, which in fact the vast majority of carnivores I know love animals and don't endorse that sort of animal cruelty, but rather because I'm especially sensitive about animals and can't bear imagining my dollars running those tubs of boiling water and axe-grinders.

I believe a vast majority of carnivores are good, harmless people who simply can't resist the taste of meat and their love of meat isn't in any way associated with the masochism behind the torture of animals. After all, I used to eat meat.

Sincerely,
Noah Eaton


"If we have no peace, it is because we have forgotten that we belong to each other"

Mother Teresa

Ron
Administrator
Member Rara Avis
since 1999-05-19
Posts 8669
Michigan, US
4 posted 2007-07-20 07:03 PM


I don't have any pets (though I do seem to spend a lot on feeding wild animals, I guess). I do, however, have a whole lot of house plants, and I suspect I've planted at least ten trees every year for the past five or six years. Not to mention a few score lilacs, wisterias, roses, and other miscellaneous floras. I honestly get upset when I hear someone is cutting down a tree that I know took several decades to reach maturity. Looking at my home and yard, I think it would be pretty safe to assume that I really like plants. One might even guess I like them better than animals? Alive is alive is alive, and I see no reason to believe animals are any more privileged than vegetation.

I'm not, however, ready to start eating dirt.

Huan Yi
Member Ascendant
since 2004-10-12
Posts 6688
Waukegan
5 posted 2007-07-21 01:39 AM


.


Under Hinduism if one runs over a dog in the street
does it come back as a dog again or does it get a chance
at something else?  


.

rwood
Member Elite
since 2000-02-29
Posts 3793
Tennessee
6 posted 2007-07-21 09:13 AM


I don’t put animals above people unless people prove to be more vicious and animalistic than a poor animal. Animals think and feel and have families so I’d have a hard time understanding how anyone could just overlook that, soul or no soul.

I am human which makes me an omnivore. I do eat meat/fish & believe that I should in small choice quantities for my health. I was raised on a farm and I know there are humane ways of raising and preparing anything for consumption. Even vegetation should be gardened, sans the pesticides. I’m also very aware that I could easily be food for any wildcat or bear in these parts, so I respect the laws of nature to a high degree of caution & prayer while hiking in their territory, or swimming in the ocean, which I was nudged by a 4 foot hammerhead shark 3 summers ago. I didn’t stick around to pet him.

The torturing of animals is a sign of a real mental imbalance in the medical world.

Our culture has several examples of animal cruelty in underground sport: dog-fights and cock-fights are most prominent around here.

It’s not just backwoods people running those types of barbarous games. Some are highly educated & prey on the ignorance of those who are willing to fall into the lure of the ring, just like any gambling table.

I try to do my part for humans/animals. I rescue anything that needs rescuing and have given several strange pets and people TLC and a temporary home, even a 6 foot 100lb Anaconda once! The two men who tried to move the abandoned trailer came out screaming when they discovered the abandoned pet inside! I had to drag it out by myself, put it in a tank and get a vet to care for it cuz I didn't know what to feed it and I didn't want it to get a hankering for me or my cats.

My sis has a Mustang rescue ranch, my mom & I regularly rescue cats, my friend rescues dogs (currently Catahoula swamp dogs which I’ve fallen in love with,) and I even love fish. I’ve got a pet fantailed goldfish named FatBoy. He’s nearly 3lbs now and is 7 years old. He’s made it through freezes, little boys kidnapping him and putting him in a bucket, and a big snake pulled him out by the tail, so he’s been rescued by me several times! He lives with around 30 Koi, who spawn quicker than I can keep up with. I’ve supplied more pet fish to the area than a pet shop.

So yeah, I guess I’m a big softy, but not always. I hit a man once for kicking a dog (she’d wet in the floor and he kicked her in the stomach, repeatedly) Come to find out, he’d kicked her so much her kidneys were damaged and that’s WHY she wet everywhere. He was arrested and charged with animal cruelty, and the dog lived out the rest of her days on a farm, happily herding my Sis’s horses.

LeeJ
Member Patricius
since 2003-06-19
Posts 13296

7 posted 2007-07-24 10:29 AM


I am in agreement with Ron and Rwood, adding, however, please keep in mind, an animal is an animal, that cannot reason...and if by some atrocity, there is a huge catostrophe in the U.S. our animals, our pets, our cute little companions, will do whatever necessary to survive. They will pac together and take down whatever they view as food, be it us or another animal...make no mistake, however, that being said...while they pose no immediate threat, I to loath any one who abuses an animal...but I do eat meat, fish and chicken...while being a vegon is good, I am concerned that you are on a balanced diet that serves every need of your body.


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