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| How to Join | Member's Area | Private Library | Search | Sanctuary | Login | |
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| Main Forums | Discussion | Tech Talk | Mature Content | Archives |
A home without a wall, |
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| Critical Analysis #2 |
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religion |
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sadpoet Junior Member
since 2003-05-29
Posts 10Tx, USA |
The Lost The hearts of lost men are dark, and darker still are the hearts of those who have seen and, knowing the glory turned, and looked no more. The demon-faces of the fiends within their breasts like long-stripped skulls grin their slack-jawed smiles and watch all with hollow eyes full of hells darkest shadows. Of their peril they are aware, and care not, for they are fooled by the gleaming flame of hatred that they mistake for justice and love in the countenance of the Snake. Again the Light reaches down to take hold of them and draw them back to the love of the One who made them, Again they step away from it's cool touch and enter the fires of the Rage to die a thousand deaths. And so I mourn the Lost. |
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| © Copyright 2003 Joe Cook - All Rights Reserved | |||
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Severn Member Rara Avis
since 1999-07-17
Posts 7704 |
Hm. I have a real problem with poetry of this ilk. I remember - with some unease - the last time I gave my true opinion on such a poem, but as this is CA I'll venture out bravely again... Why do I have such a problem? I suppose it's because these poems are in essence - patronising. I suppose your poem has been written from a position of goodwill toward all mankind...and some kind of effusive desire for all to experience the glories of heaven or whatnot... It doesn't work. Honest opinion. That's all I'm willing to say about it right now - if you want to enter into more dialogue about it, let me know. If so, I imagine the thread would end up being better off in Philosophy... At any rate - welcome to CA, and to passions for that matter   K[This message has been edited by Severn (05-30-2003 06:21 AM).] |
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Marge Tindal 
since 1999-11-06
Posts 42384Florida's Foreverly Shores |
Joe~ I'm going to come onboard here and welcome you warmly to Passions' circle of poets and friends~ We have many forums for your reading and posting pleasure. Check them out and find where you're most comfortable. I found your piece to be quite good. 'I mourn the Lost' Works for me ! Hope to see you venture in again~ *Huglets* ~*Marge*~ ~*The pen of the poet never runs out of ink, as long as we breathe.*~ |
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Sunshine
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-25
Posts 63354Listening to every heart |
Sadpoet, Welcome to Passions! I do critique very well, I leave that to the experts. But I'm one of those abord the Welcome-Wagon, so please, enjoy yourself, look forward to your becoming familiar with all aspects of Passions, and please, check your E-mail for a Special Greeting! Karilea - if I whisper, will you listen? |
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Kamala Member
since 2003-04-17
Posts 59CA, USA |
I'm with Severn on this one... It just sounds too much like you think everyone should believe as you do. I think patronizing is a good word for it. and perhaps also preachy? But aside from that, there's no denying (IMO) that there was some careful craft that went into this. For example: The hearts of lost men are dark, and darker still are the hearts I like the music of this section... the repetition of dark and hearts, the wordplay. And the fact that 'dark' and 'hearts' share the same vowel sound. There's a nice resonance to this. The second stanza is a bit much I think. I mean, I wouldn't say that people who turn away from The One necessarily have strip-skulled demon fiend faces in their chest. It's a little too evil-centric for my taste... although I love the phrase "slack-jawed smiles." And the next few stanzas are the ones that really make me lose interest because you're not letting me -- as a reader -- bring anything to it. You're telling me the way it is and, in a sense, what I should believe. Or what you wish I would believe. As for the last line, I'd cut it. It creates to much of a differential between you (as an enlightened speaker) and 'the lost.' It comes across as pretty condescending. Kamala |
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sadpoet Junior Member
since 2003-05-29
Posts 10Tx, USA |
I had no intention of sounding patronizing. By "The Lost" I meant people who are truly evil, not just everyone who isn't like me. Speaking as an aspiring poet, I write what I mean, and I mean what I write. I cannot apologize for or take back my words, and I would not if I could. But, thanks for the critique, I have found it to be usefull. [This message has been edited by sadpoet (05-31-2003 01:11 PM).] |
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Severn Member Rara Avis
since 1999-07-17
Posts 7704 |
And as an aspiring poet - part of the learning process is acknowledging that sometimes what you say might not come across exactly as you mean it to... K |
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Stephanos
since 2000-07-31
Posts 3618Statesboro, GA, USA |
Sadpoet, I enjoyed this poem. Criticism first ... I like your use of occasional enjambment (breaking lines in the middle of thoughts). But several of these runover lines ended with "and" or "of". Nothing wrong with that. It's just that I think doing the same thing with other, more essential words might be more interesting. Praise: This stanza (or whatever) was striking "Of their peril they are aware, and care not, for they are fooled by the gleaming flame of hatred that they mistake for justice and love in the countenance of the Snake." I enjoyed the metaphysical / spiritual aspect as well. My advice, don't sweat criticism concerning that, especially if that is what is in your heart to write. It's not fashionable in a postmodern age, and if you write as if you really believe anything definite you'll likely be sneered at. But if we use that criterea to judge poetry we will have to dump about half (or perhaps much more) of all the poetry of the past. Thanks, Stephen. |
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Severn Member Rara Avis
since 1999-07-17
Posts 7704 |
'if you write as if you really believe anything definite you'll likely be sneered at.' Stephanos - I think that might well be one of the most unfounded statements I have come across...speaking from personal experience at all? K |
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Stephanos
since 2000-07-31
Posts 3618Statesboro, GA, USA |
Severn, Actually, yes. In a time in history when it is often looked down upon to believe anything definite ... anything exclusive, it is not uncommon to find certain people unnerved that you believe something strong enough to share it. I do not see how my statement is unfounded at all, and would be glad to discuss my reasons. But as you said earlier, this is not a "Discussion" forum, like phil 101. So maybe more appropriate to discuss it there? (interestingly enought there is a semi-related thread there right now called "cornering the market") Or even by Email? Though I don't mind discussion, my response was to sadpoet. I just wanted to share my view that though definitive belief expressed in poetry may be looked at by some as priggish or pedantic, this is no good reason why it should be suppressed. Many poets of other ages and times were not made to feel ashamed for expressing their beliefs or the deepest convictions of their hearts. And remember I'm not even talking about defined dogma, just convictions and what is percieved as truth. It's just another view to counter the (unneedful) swats on the wrist that sometimes come. And I think that my statement was not all that innappropriate for this forum, since it does deal with criticism of certain poetry, like sadpoet's as well as others. Stephen. [This message has been edited by Stephanos (06-03-2003 12:09 PM).] |
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hush Senior Member
since 2001-05-27
Posts 1653Ohio, USA |
Are you writing about the lost men, or 'those who are sadder still?' How are the lost truly evil? Being lost and being evil seem like two different things to me. This isn't an idealogical qualm, but a communications one. How am I supposed to know that by lost you meant evil? And what, exactly, do you mean by evil? It's fine to have definite views and all... but at least be clear about them. Don't assume that what you mean by 'lost' is the same thing that I will interpret. Other than that, I agree that there are some well crafted lined here, such as the first three, and also that the skull-and-hell imagery in stanza two is a bit two much. Perhaps if you used that space to actually elaborate on the 'lost' in a less polarizing dynamic and with a little more detail, your message would come through a little more clearly? Hope I've helped. |
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V. Tomir Junior Member
since 2003-06-08
Posts 20 |
Mr. Sadpoet I don't think you could cram another cliche into this poem. Dark this - dark that - dark, dark, dark hearts, dark perils, darkness - light, flames and let us not forget the classic skulls. For the 150 or so words you have here, I can't find one original line. It's such a dull poem that its borderline insulting to a reader. Could you baby us more? Either you think we are all as dim witted as the lackluster metaphors and analogies in this poem or you just don't care what the hell the reader thinks because you're too damn busy rifling off dismal poems instead of taking the time to learn the art of poetry. Regards. |
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