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YeshuJah Malikk
Member
since 2000-06-29
Posts 263


0 posted 2001-02-06 04:07 PM



It is the lifeline to a debt
whose obligation I cannot re-pay.
It is closer than my skin,
intimately more related to me
than my next of kin,
a cloud whose vise-like grip
more oft' than not descends upon my brow,
casting and re-casting me
in scenes of death grotesque,
played out in shadows of its night
or on broad strains of trite daylight
as I ascend the throne of God
and sit in awe of me.



© Copyright 2001 YeshuJah Malikk - All Rights Reserved
warmhrt
Senior Member
since 1999-12-18
Posts 1563

1 posted 2001-02-07 09:55 PM


Yesh,

I must admit this one confounds me...

I got an immediate first impression, but after reading and re-reading, I very much doubt if it is about anything I thought it was. I hesitate to even tell you what my first impression was, but I'm sure you'll forgive my mistaken perception. My first impression was that these were words describing depression with delusionary or psychotic features. If a client wrote this, that is what I would glean from it...but hey, what do I know?!!

Kris

"It is wisdom to know others;
It is enlightenment to know one's self" - Lao Tzu

YeshuJah Malikk
Member
since 2000-06-29
Posts 263

2 posted 2001-02-08 11:23 AM


Kris, you are correct. The poem is about that.  Thanks.
warmhrt
Senior Member
since 1999-12-18
Posts 1563

3 posted 2001-02-08 07:56 PM


I'm right!!!??? Wow...

This must then be delusions of the grandiose type which can often be related to religion...these are the types that leaders of cults are often found to have.

This poem, in fact, gives the impression that the narrator is such a person.

Is this what you intended, Yesh?

"It is wisdom to know others;
It is enlightenment to know one's self" - Lao Tzu

YeshuJah Malikk
Member
since 2000-06-29
Posts 263

4 posted 2001-02-08 11:23 PM


Kris, you can say that.  
warmhrt
Senior Member
since 1999-12-18
Posts 1563

5 posted 2001-02-09 07:35 AM


Yesh,

Geez...I know I can say that...but is this what you intended?
Help! I'm getting frustrated here!

Kris  

"It is wisdom to know others;
It is enlightenment to know one's self" - Lao Tzu


[This message has been edited by warmhrt (edited 02-09-2001).]

YeshuJah Malikk
Member
since 2000-06-29
Posts 263

6 posted 2001-02-09 02:29 PM


Kris, I am sorry for the confusion.  You were exactly right.  That is what I intended.
warmhrt
Senior Member
since 1999-12-18
Posts 1563

7 posted 2001-02-09 04:28 PM


I'm sorry, Yesh, but another interpretation came to mind...this could be taken as just depression with suicidal thoughts. The suicidal thoughts, i.e. deciding upon life or death, could be mistakenly construed as acting in a god-like manner.

Won't bug you again on this one, Yesh,  

Kris  

"It is wisdom to know others;
It is enlightenment to know one's self" - Lao Tzu

Stephanos
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since 2000-07-31
Posts 3618
Statesboro, GA, USA
8 posted 2001-02-10 12:35 PM


Yeshujah,

I liked this.  I know the meaning of a poem is often subjective and very different to different readers.  So with the risk of this being not at all what you intended I will tell you what I saw in your words.

To start at the end (of all places) I noted your reference to the "Throne of God" ... which whenever I read this phrase anywhere, I think of the rule or authority or goverment or "will" of God since a throne may represent all of these things.  With that in mind I go back to the beginning.

"It is the lifeline to a debt
whose obligation I cannot re-pay."

I think of the debt really all of humanity owes to God.  Looking at a biblical perspective, this "debt" by grace has already been payed off by the one who demands it.  When you say "it" is the lifeline to a debt, I think you could possibly mean a melancholia of a spiritual type, which always puts us in the position of trying to pay a debt we can really never pay with the paltry sums we have in ourselves... or rather that results from trying to repay.

Since this very struggle is so personal, and so very "me", maybe that could explain the lines ...

"It is closer than my skin,
intimately more related to me
than my next of kin,"

The imagery of clouds also holds scriptural allusions to me.  Clouds are often symbolic of judgement or punishment (though in other places mercy and refreshing).  

Ex) Joel 2:2 " A day of darkness and of gloominess, a day of clouds and of thick darkness, as the morning spread upon the mountains: a great people and a strong; there hath not been ever the like, neither shall be any more after it, even to the years of many generations."

Then your lines that read,

"casting and re-casting me
in scenes of death grotesque,
played out in shadows of its night"

remind me of other symbols of judgement...night... but especially death which runs all through the Hebrew and Christian scriptures.  Ex..in Genesis  "In the day that you eat of it you will surely die"

then you mention

"...or on broad strains of trite daylight
as I ascend the throne of God
and sit in awe of me."

which reminds me of a superficial light, or a light of no special significance, a common light  ...indicated by the word "trite".  Judging from your final two lines, maybe that light is the light of my own rule, my own kingdom, my own will as I "ascend the throne of God".

"For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High." (Isaiah 14:13-14).

Especially the last line about standing in awe of me... reminds me of the serpent's craft in the beginning who promised "Your eyes will be opened and you will be like God".

Perhaps I'm reading an awful lot into it here, but I see the whole titanic struggle of redemtion here in your poem.  Just who is it that I will crown as God?  ...him or myself?  Of course I see that struggle superimposed on alot of things here lately.  (No I'm not a cultist).

I may be stretching things to the extreme but at least some allusions seem to be there.


[This message has been edited by Stephanos (edited 02-10-2001).]

YeshuJah Malikk
Member
since 2000-06-29
Posts 263

9 posted 2001-02-10 09:51 PM


Stephanos, your reflection on this poem is as good as any.  Words are fluid, and dynamic.  They defy any and all attempts to cast their meaning in stone.  Your words here are haunting...haunting. For indeed every soul must inevitably crown itself God, or find a God to crown.  Thank you.

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