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A Way To Fly
| Critical Analysis #1 |
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A Way To Fly |
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Severn Member Rara Avis
since 1999-07-17
Posts 7704
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~Reposted from Open #6 by request~ I storm-fraught defenceless find that in a pace I travel back and gasp for breaths already taken A path of wander peaceful hides just around a corner passed before and so I cry just fly little child already grown see this life with feathered eyes but wings are fallen things and my words soundless on the thermals too high for reach and here I step dragging lived time into a now I can’t quite discern calling for my flight in a silence still of yesterday |
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jbouder Member Elite
since 1999-09-18
Posts 2534Whole Sort Of Genl Mish Mash |
Kamla: I'm glad to see you gracing us with your talent these past few days. "I / storm-fraught / defenceless" In spite of its simplicity, I found this to be a strong opening to me. Small typo on "defenseless", btw. The use of "storm-fraught" immediately gives me the sense of internal turmoil. "[I] find that in a pace / I travel back / and gasp for breaths / already taken" Do you mean "in a pace" as in pacing back and forth? I read this as an indication of the speaker's indecision brought on by nearly overwhelming anxiety. I really liked "gasp for breaths already taken". "A path / of wander peaceful / hides just around / a corner / passed before" Do you mean "wander" or "wonder" or is this intended to have a double meaning? I hope it is meant to be a double meaning because it ends up being a clever one. Again, the sense of anxiety and turmoil that accompany this emotional storm is well communicated in "a corner passed before". There is a sense of being lost here. "and so I cry / just fly" Good transition line. "little child already grown / see this life / with feathered eyes" I'm curious about the seeing life "with feathered eyes" saying. I suspect it has something to do with childlike innocense. "but wings are fallen things / and my words soundless / on the thermals / too high for reach / and here I step" The first line here has biblical connotations to me. I hope I'm not reading too much into it but by your using the word "fallen" I get the impression (from my understanding of the concept of biblical falleness) that the efficacy of those wings is, at the very least, suspect. Good use of "thermals", btw. "dragging lived time / into a now / I can’t quite discern" Ohhhh the duplicity of anxiety! Confusion, inability to process information, feelings of impending panic, depression. Nice work here. "calling / for my flight / in a silence still of yesterday" I'm wondering here if "flight" wasn't intended to have a dual meaning as "to flee"/"to fly". Nice work here Kamla. I enjoyed this. |
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Trevor Senior Member
since 1999-08-12
Posts 700Canada |
Hi Severn, "I storm-fraught defenceless find that in a pace I travel back and gasp for breaths already taken" After the second read I really enjoyed the circular effect this stanza had on me. "A path of wander peaceful hides just around a corner passed before and so I cry just fly" I liked the way you worded this part, "of wander peaceful", it has an eloquent flow to it. To be honest the last two lines read a little too light though it fits the theme. "little child already grown see this life with feathered eyes" Pretty good stanza, but it left me feeling like something else should be in there with it. What that something is...I dunno...could just be the over critical side of me coming out. "but wings are fallen things and my words soundless on the thermals too high for reach and here I step" I really liked the flow and feel of this stanza. It took me a few reads to make sense of it because "here I step" initially gave me an image of you being on a cliff rather than you permanently grounded and the thermal winds being above. "dragging lived time into a now I can’t quite discern calling for my flight in a silence still of yesterday" Pretty decent ending though my suggestion is to lose the last line or perhaps consider changing it. The reader already gets the feeling of a better yesterday throughout the poem. All in all, pretty good poem, thought it could use a little tweaking here and there though. Thanks for the read and take care, Trevor |
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Severn Member Rara Avis
since 1999-07-17
Posts 7704 |
Hey guys - thankyes....I appreciate your replies! I don't have time (what's new  ) to give your replies the credit they deserve just yet, but will soon...Two short things: Jim - defenceless is correct for NZ English my friend and I stand by my rights as a Non-American to spell Non-Americanly!!! (hehe - seriously, check it out in the dict.) I acutally prefer your way for it makes no sense to turn defense into defence - but hey, we have our quirks... but just to be mean and nasty - you have a typo in 'innocence' (here K sticks out tongue gleefully). Trevor - LOL - here you might think I am a neurotic writer who can't handle criticism, not true though I am about to jump into defense of my last line...  I just want you to be aware that the one thing I do most often is deliberately leave much unsaid and involve many paradoxes and dual meanings in my poems- this is such a one! This is all paradox - so the yesterday isn't about an actual yesterday at all. I don't know if that comes through in the piece - it actually depends on how one reads the 'still'...this line is vital for it creates the shape of the poem each reader forms. So, it might still be yesterday it may refer to quiet. OK -now you are thinking what the hell is the difference, and jusitifiably, but there is one! Now I am feeling all in all too obscure...sigh...would you read it please and tell me if given those two different connotations it makes any difference to how you read the whole piece? Thanks...  K'Writing sharpens life; life enriches writing' Sylvia Plath |
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jbouder Member Elite
since 1999-09-18
Posts 2534Whole Sort Of Genl Mish Mash |
That's how we spell innocence in urban America ... and what we plea when the cops catch us before we can jump over defence and get away.  Jim P.S. I know where New Zealand is but where is Old Zealand? Must have been a British idea to name it that way ... I can never figure those people out. [This message has been edited by jbouder (edited 03-17-2000).] |
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Tony Di Bart Member
since 2000-01-26
Posts 160Toronto, Canada |
Hello There are some wonderful lines in this poem and the poem as a whole is also very good. Some lines that I really like are. "and gasp for breaths already taken" I really like this. the whole idea og gasping for breath already taken, to me communicates a hoplessness. see this life with feathered eyes I like how this fits with the rest of the poem. That's it. Not as indepeth as the other two gentleman here but thanks for the read. See ya |
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warmhrt Senior Member
since 1999-12-18
Posts 1563 |
Hi Kamla, Well, since the guys have done their jobs so enthusiastically, I would just like to tell you that I enjoyed this poem immensely. I interpret it as the speaker telling of ravaged feelings, and of wanting to escape them, to find peace. The inner child speaks of flight as a means of accomplishing this, but the adult mind realizes the child is no more, and childish wishes won't get her where she needs to go. The speaker appears stuck in time, though, without the ability to move forward. "I storm-fraught defenceless" was so few words, but so much said. Excellent choices, Kamla, and the perfect beginning lines for this work. Thanks for the read...very, very good. Kristine Jimteach...I think it means to remove the enclosure around a piece of property, as in, "Before we move in, we're going to have to defence, since we like open space." < !signature--> Let compassion breathe in and out of you filling you with poems. ~ Jane Cooper [This message has been edited by warmhrt (edited 03-17-2000).] |
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Trevor Senior Member
since 1999-08-12
Posts 700Canada |
Hi Kamla, "This is all paradox - so the yesterday isn't about an actual yesterday at all. I don't know if that comes through in the piece - it actually depends on how one reads the 'still'...this line is vital for it creates the shape of the poem each reader forms. So, it might still be yesterday it may refer to quiet. OK -now you are thinking what the hell is the difference, and jusitifiably, but there is one! Now I am feeling all in all too obscure...sigh...would you read it please and tell me if given those two different connotations it makes any difference to how you read the whole piece?" Okay the way you worded this was more obscure than any reference you made to yesterday...took me about thirteen hours and three translators, they kept quitting and yelling "You're on your own Trev!" I re-read the whole poem again and perhaps "of yesterday" does fit in better than I initially thought....plus it does provide a good wrap up. So your dee-fenze of your poem worked Thanks, take care, Trevor |
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Elizabeth Santos Member Rara Avis
since 1999-11-08
Posts 9269Pennsylvania |
Severn, I'm not one to critique poetry, for I am new to writing, having only written my first poem last July, and I've never studied poetry. The responses in this forum are over my head, to say the least. And so I don't read your poetry with a critical eye, but rather with a passionate eye, and I bathe in the beauty of your words. I felt I understood the poem, and perhaps my understanding of it is not even in the realm of your paradox. I felt you moving on, but within the culture of your past, not as a child, but within the comfort of past experiences. Afraid to venture to new heights, you continue, not looking to the past, but in the essence of the past, in footsteps not yet taken, but already marked. Perhaps my translation of your words is foreign to your language, but it sits well with my spirit. No matter the true meaning, the lines are "classic Severn", with a point of reference unlike any other. You look at life from a different corner of the room and it always amazes me. The path "hides just around the corner passed before". I "gasp for breaths already taken". As a reader, I am in amazement of a youthful mind already aged. Sorry, I am not competent to give an intelligent analysis, but I only know what I feel. Liz |
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Poertree Senior Member
since 1999-11-05
Posts 1359UK |
Lady K ....and about time too .. took you long enough to follow orders didn't it ..ha ha Brad instructs me to critique the critiques .. "I hear and obey" ~said in robotic voice~ ..lol. Jim and Trevor have done their excellent slice and dice - cold, analytical and always helpful.Tony points out the great bits. Kris as usual offers excellent and feeling insight into what the speaker may be trying to say, and Liz, well I'll come back to Liz in a moment. I read and read this piece trying to see "what it meant to me"! I finally came to the conclusion that this was a beautiful way of suggesting the vulnerability of a person, grown, but still a child, trying to "take flight" into the world (well it doesn't have to be the world - just any unknown), sensing the turbulence and seeking refuge in the comfort of the familiar past. Trying to drag the familiarities and security of "lived time" with her into the "now". I like the way the italicised words read together simply read : "{I'm} defenceless {but} just fly and here I step for my flight" this is the courage of the nestling on the brink. As before my favourite (with a "u" Jim) is: "but wings are fallen things" A really really arctic (sorry antarctic ...lol) job, great to see this here at last K. And now on with the critique of the critiques: Jim ... you'll learn better than to query K's competence soon ..lol and Liz: you should read Brad's recent post on critiquing. "I'm not one to critique poetry, for I am new to writing, having only written my first poem last July, and I've never studied poetry." >>> so what? That is exactly my position as well, doesn't mean you can't critique. The responses in this forum are over my head, to say the least. >>> yet a few lines later you prove that not to be true. And so I don't read your poetry with a critical eye, but rather with a passionate eye, and I bathe in the beauty of your words. I felt I understood the poem, and perhaps my understanding of it is not even in the realm of your paradox. I felt you moving on, but within the culture of your past, not as a child, but within the comfort of past experiences. Afraid to venture to new heights, you continue, not looking to the past, but in the essence of the past, in footsteps not yet taken, but already marked. Perhaps my translation of your words is foreign to your language, but it sits well with my spirit. No matter the true meaning, the lines are "classic Severn", with a point of reference unlike any other. You look at life from a different corner of the room and it always amazes me. The path "hides just around the corner passed before". I "gasp for breaths already taken". As a reader, I am in amazement of a youthful mind already aged. >>> yeah well Liz you just wrote one of the best critiques of its kind I've read for a while.. Sure this is not the style of "the guys" .. this is not "slice and dice" or an objective analysis, but if everyone did that wouldn't it be boring? You have said what you as the reader feel from the poem - in my book its often far harder to put that kind of commentary into words than it is to cut and paste and dissect each line (no offence guys you do a great job as well ) .. not only that but i think that readers of your critique then go back to the poem as I did and re-read with new insight which can only add to the experience.Sorry, I am not competent to give an intelligent analysis, but I only know what I feel. >>> I guess you know what I'm going to say ...lol .. This was a really great critique Liz, both intelligent and insightful and apologies are quite out of order ..... >>> Well done indeed!! Philip [This message has been edited by Poertree (edited 03-18-2000).] |
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Elizabeth Santos Member Rara Avis
since 1999-11-08
Posts 9269Pennsylvania |
Poertree, You are quite complimentary in your critique of my critique and I thank you. Now let us see what the poet has to say about her poem. I would like to know, Severn, what was in your mind when you wrote it. I know you are going to say that you're leaving it up to the reader's interpretation, but just tell us anyway. Liz |
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Poertree Senior Member
since 1999-11-05
Posts 1359UK |
Liz ... you just made an error ..lol Asking K to do anything seems like a bad idea! Look how long she took to post the thing in the first place and btw .. it's Philip Take care |
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Elizabeth Santos Member Rara Avis
since 1999-11-08
Posts 9269Pennsylvania |
Philip, I'll give her time to do her homework and then bribe her with a Reeses Peanut Butter Cup. Liz |
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Severn Member Rara Avis
since 1999-07-17
Posts 7704 |
Lizzy - since I have never heard of such a thing that may prove difficult... Everyone - I just have a test to sit tomorrow and after that hideous thing is over I'm a-coming! Pooey to you to Phillip...humph! K |
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Severn Member Rara Avis
since 1999-07-17
Posts 7704 |
Hey thanks guys!! I'm not sure what to do here - I guess to reply to this I will go all methodical...I'll tell you how I saw the poem as I wrote it in its most basic form, and then reply individually... OK. Well. The speaker is trapped in a timeless place...there is no today, yesterday (A for Trevor) or tomorrow, no, there is just an existence - kind of metaphysical. The narrator is everything - child, adult, near death, just born...but principally lost. Just lost in a frightening world. Looking for a peace that is not possible. There it is in its basic form.Jim - Wow. Thanks! The simplicity thing - totally deliberate....as I said earlier to Trevor I work with sparity quite often. And I am glad that 'storm-fraught' gave you that sense for that was the aim - I wanted one word to capture it all. Yay! (Bouncing) The 'pace' is indeed pacing back and forth. And that is the part that sets the scene for being caught in a timeless space - what I depict there is impossible, so I suppose the action of pacing illustrates being trapped - not going anywhere for there is nowhere to go. So while I am thrilled that you read 'wander' as possibly having two meanings it in fact does not. Wander relates to the ability the speaker wishes to have to actually move - an ability declined to she/he in this nowhere land. BUT, having said that - you have given me a new way to look at his line and perhaps I was thinking of it subconciously and forgot! (Yes - I have been known to do that...) The feathered eyes - hmmmm, well - it links directly to 'wings are fallen things'. Biblical? Yeah, it hovered there when I wrote it, but was not the true motivation for using the line...I am hard pressed to come up with a concrete reason...innocence perhaps, freedom most definitely. The lived time thing (thanks btw) - the crux of my paradox...THE central line for the piece. This line expresses the full measure of the speaker’s confusion. And, I the one obsessed with dual meanings (aside from wonder hehe), must concede to you that flight indeed has a dual meaning - good spotting! (Did you get the one on ‘And so I cry/just fly?) I must thankyou, Jim, for your in depth response and well, over here we merely climb over defence to get away from rabid sheep...(oh yeah - Zealand is somewhere around - shames me to admit I have quite forgotten where...) Trevor - The chastened one says I apologise that my first reply to you was so damn obscure...hehe. Now the main thing with you that I wish to focus on is how you feel that the piece is perhaps too light...(such as in ‘And so I fly/just cry’) Now - what I am interested to know is - do you find it shallow or just light? I designed it deliberately light to illustrate the flight elements, which you picked up on, and also to underscore - solely by contrast - the depth of confusion the speaker is in. “I really liked the flow and feel of this stanza. It took me a few reads to make sense of it because "here I step" initially gave me an image of you being on a cliff rather than you permanently grounded and the thermal winds being above. “ And that makes me feel rather happy as that was of course my intent - I guess I like to bring a reader in and make them feel what the speaker is feeling...in this case, lost. Thanks! But seriously - if you have time I would like to know if, in your opinion, my lightness became too weak and ended up rendered as shallow - that possibility intrigues me... Cheers! Tony - Hey - thankyou so much for reading - you gave me some respite from the intense Trevor and Jim team...(j/k guys). I appreciate your input. Kristine - Thankyou!! You certainly read that correctly - especially the part about time. The part about adult versus child - I guess the speaker is lost there; there isn’t quite a realisation yet that the child is no more. Thanks for your support and approval of this piece - I admit to being a little nervous about posting - Phillip can tell you of how he nagged me to get it here... Lizzy - Hello my friend. So nice to see you here! Your response is lovely and informed - as are most things you say. I feel everyone has different things to offer, and you speak from the heart, but go beyond a mere descriptive word. I think a writer needs to know not just how others perceive the structure of a piece, or interpret it, or have advice from an objective eye about how to clarify or tighten a work, but also how the poem in its purest form affects a person. Everything in the above list (which is of course not a complete one) combines to form a balance to aid a writer in their search for perfection. You provide the balance by giving a response from the heart - and I think many appreciate that. I know I do. I love the way you saw this: ‘not looking to the past, but in the essence of the past, in footsteps not yet taken, but already marked.’ Most accurate. Your reply just boosts my confidence - and the label ‘Classic Severn’ is humbling. Thankyou. You can come share my corner of the room anytime Lizzy...and keep on doing just as you are. Sir P - Orders? What? Meek Sir P giving the bossy Lady K orders? In what dimension? And what will I say to you? I like the way you summed up what everyone has said...hehe, a curious mix of audicity and pondering. What you said here: this is the courage of the nestling on the brink I think you rather subjectively see this as a poem of courage. That doesn’t surprise me! I don’t see this as much to do with strength. The speaker is completely at a loss and there is no resolution, no way out offered. The person is just stuck in the last lines hearing the no-sounds of a yesterday that didn’t even exist! Now you tell me, if you can understand it how that gives an idea of strength????Thanks all...K < !signature--> 'Writing sharpens life; life enriches writing' Sylvia Plath [This message has been edited by Severn (edited 03-21-2000).] |
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Trevor Senior Member
since 1999-08-12
Posts 700Canada |
Hey Special K...Big K....Oh K...Kamla , sorry I haven't slept yet....mind is a little dizzy?"hehe. Now the main thing with you that I wish to focus on is how you feel that the piece is perhaps too light...(such as in ‘And so I fly/just cry’) Now - what I am interested to know is - do you find it shallow or just light?" Well aren't you the neurotic one To be completely honest I found it too light. The meaning is there, therefore not shallow but it does seem light because it seemed like ya kinda put it in there for the sake of the sound more so then the impact of the statement....and I thought that should have been more of a bold statement for the meaning you might have been trying to communicate....though I don't know what that meaning might be...J/K lol ANyways, that's my honest opinon on the whole loop-de-do-da thingy, anyways, thanks for the more articulate explanation of the poem Take care,Trevor |
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Severn Member Rara Avis
since 1999-07-17
Posts 7704 |
Well Mr T...Picky T...Trevor... Hmmmmmmmmmm...a long drawn out hmmmmmmmm from K. Neurotic??? HUMPH! (Ask Phillip for an exact translation...). Not at all - merely curious...sniff. 'The meaning is there, therefore not shallow but it does seem light because it seemed like ya kinda put it in there for the sake of the sound more so then the impact of the statement....and I thought that should have been more of a bold statement for the meaning you might have been trying to communicate' I assume you mean the fly/cry thing? Right...I sense a good debate! Wahoo! OK OK - it is MEANT to be light - solely to illustrate the need to fly...get away and also become airborne out of the trap. How do you think that its being heavier could better illustrate that point? |
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Tess Member
since 2000-03-22
Posts 288Australia |
Hi, I'm new to all this, but I am enjoying reading the many different forms of poetry that i am seeing I like the way that you broken the ideas of the poem up by the spacing, and even the change to italics for some words...sometimes the presentation has as much effect as the words in developing the feeling of the poem, and I think you have chosen the best way for your poem here I really enjoyed it and will be looking out for more of your work Tess |
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Severn Member Rara Avis
since 1999-07-17
Posts 7704 |
Tess - thankyou so much for your reply, I appreciate that! You're most welcome here...  K |
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