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Dialog With My Wife (A sestina from Nan's workshop)
| Critical Analysis #1 |
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Dialog With My Wife (A sestina from Nan's workshop) |
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Not A Poet Member Elite
since 1999-11-03
Posts 3885Oklahoma, USA |
Dialog with My Wife Oh lest I speak from drink or say too much, Pray stop my mouth, my dear, with just a kiss; We have more wine and still it's not too late, The sunset's great, the wind is blowing free, So let's get naked now and sail away ... Unless there's something else you'd rather do. I'd like to go but that I cannot do; It would be fun, but still, I have so much To do I dare not take the time away, So go alone but take this goodbye kiss, And then the next time maybe I'll be free ... Unless, of course, by then it is too late. But then, my love, it well may be too late, For I, as well, have pressing things to do And don't know when again I may be free To take you, though I'd love to very much, So guess I'll go alone, but take that kiss To stave me over while I am away. But do remember while you are away, I'll be alone so don't come back too late, Unless you think you'll need no further kiss For quite a while, and nothing else I'll do For you, and dear, you know you'll miss so much Those loving things I do to keep you free. Ah yes, my love, I'll sail alone and free To gaze at stars as clouds are borne away; I'll miss your charming presence there so much I'm sure I won't be coming back too late To take your sweetest offer so to do Those lovely things ... Yes, let me have that kiss. Too willing, dear, to leave with just a kiss, I hesitate to see you go so free, Instead, I think the better thing to do: Get naked and together sail away; So hurry now before it is too late, I'm sure we will enjoy it very much. So with a kiss, in love, we'll sail away, And so be free to come back very late, Enjoying all we do so very much. Pete What terms shall I find sufficiently simple in their sublimity -- sufficiently sublime in their simplicity -- for the mere enunciation of my theme? Edgar Allan Poe |
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jbouder Member Elite
since 1999-09-18
Posts 2534Whole Sort Of Genl Mish Mash |
Pete: This is an incredibly difficult format and you pulled it off nicely. I liked the sense of playfulness I got from a combination of the alternating voices and the iambic rhythm. Your theme also develops well throughout. Dialog has often been difficult for me because I have trouble making two different people sound like two different people. This poem doesn't have this problem at all. The alternating voices don't even need the italics to set them apart. Just curious ... how long did this take you to write? Good job on this Pete. Jim [This message has been edited by jbouder (edited 02-29-2000).] |
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Not A Poet Member Elite
since 1999-11-03
Posts 3885Oklahoma, USA |
Thanks Jim, To answer your question, I'm usually a pretty slow writer, left-brainer and all, remember. In building a sonnet, for instance, I may get an outline of 4 or 5 lines then work on it several times over several days before getting the final result I want. For some reason this one came quickly. The first 2 lines came to me in sort of a vision or something and I had no idea of what else was coming or even what the theme would be, except that they seemed like a good beginning for a sonnet. The next morning I wrote those 2 lines down, as the beginning of a sonnet but before I even saved it, the rest of the first stanza just started coming, and it obviously was not going to be a sonnet. Then the second and third followed. I saved that and came back to it the next day and the rest just poured out. That is, except for the tercet, which required some thought. I really wish they would all come so easily. Thanks. Oops, had to go back and fix a typo.  < !signature--> Pete What terms shall I find sufficiently simple in their sublimity -- sufficiently sublime in their simplicity -- for the mere enunciation of my theme? Edgar Allan Poe [This message has been edited by Not A Poet (edited 02-29-2000).] |
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warmhrt Senior Member
since 1999-12-18
Posts 1563 |
Pete, This is genuinely unique; very well done. I, too, like the two voices...you pulled that off without a hitch. It must be a different sort of sestina than the type I learned to do (not here). To me, and I pray I'm not wrong, this was a tongue-in-cheek piece ... made me chuckle, but it's also very sentimental. Nice work, Pete. Kris All that we see or seem - Is but a dream within a dream ~ Edgar Allan Poe |
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Not A Poet Member Elite
since 1999-11-03
Posts 3885Oklahoma, USA |
Hi Kris, Thanks for your comments. Not sure though what you mean by "tongue-in-cheek." I don't think I would classify it that way but it is intended to be light and maybe a little whimsical. I think your last remark "made me chuckle, but it's also very sentimental" is exactly the response I wanted. Possibly the premise of a naked sailboat ride with a dear partner is whimsical but don't scorn it if you haven't tried it (at night of course)  Also don't understand what sort of sestina you may have learned; surely not that daunting double that JB tried to get started. Well, thanks again. This was so much fun to write that I really would like to try a sequel but haven't done anything yet. I suppose I'm afraid the next one won't come so easily. Pete What terms shall I find sufficiently simple in their sublimity -- sufficiently sublime in their simplicity -- for the mere enunciation of my theme? Edgar Allan Poe |
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jbouder Member Elite
since 1999-09-18
Posts 2534Whole Sort Of Genl Mish Mash |
Pete: I'm still working on that cursed double-sestina, btw. I really don't know how Kess wrote two of those beasts. Thanks for the reminder that I need to buckle down on that project. Jim P.S. Don't forget that you contributed to perfecting our double-sestina format so don't give me all the credit. |
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Not A Poet Member Elite
since 1999-11-03
Posts 3885Oklahoma, USA |
Speaking of Kess and her TWO double sestinas, I'm sure you noticed how much better both of them were than the more well known one written by Mr. Swinburne. I mean, it was only with concentrated effort that I was able to wade all the way through his. But with both of hers, after reading the first couple of lines I could not put them down until absorbing every word. Can that girl write or what? If you really are still working on it, you surely do have that proverbial tough act to follow. Pete What terms shall I find sufficiently simple in their sublimity -- sufficiently sublime in their simplicity -- for the mere enunciation of my theme? Edgar Allan Poe |
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Ted Reynolds Member
since 1999-12-15
Posts 331 |
This is a lovely sestina, and the light breath of love working its way through the real world is charmingly sustained throughout. I'd say submit it for publication to Editors Who Pay Money (though never nearly enough.) |
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Brad Member Ascendant
since 1999-08-20
Posts 5705Jejudo, South Korea |
Pete, Very enjoyable sestina. Okay, I hated the part about sailing -- reminded my of Styx too much -- but over all well written and the form didn't seem to get in the way too much (it did a little). Okay, but here's my question: I see aesthetic value in the sonnet, in the villanelle or in the pantoum but I don't see what sestina format actually gives to a poem? They're hard to write. Sure, but should that be the sole determination for a form poem. Any ideas by anybody would probably help me on this. Brad |
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jbouder Member Elite
since 1999-09-18
Posts 2534Whole Sort Of Genl Mish Mash |
Brad: The sestina has traditionally been more of a poetic exercise than an aesthetic form. Kinda like doing push-ups. So what you get from a sestina is not aesthetics (although a sestina can certainly be aesthetically pleasing) but, rather, good practice. Just my opinion. Jim |
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Ted Reynolds Member
since 1999-12-15
Posts 331 |
Dante wrote one sestina in his later years which is one of the most perfect and moving poems ever (at least in Rosseti's English translation.) Every time the line returns to "grass," for instance, it brings up a different aspect (green or short-lived or fruitful) and the same for "stone" or "lady." It moves you through moods and images, each one clicking into place at the end of a line. Emotional *and* intellectual. So it *can* be done! But I don't ever expect to see a second such. |
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jbouder Member Elite
since 1999-09-18
Posts 2534Whole Sort Of Genl Mish Mash |
Hey guys: "The Metamorphosis" by ... shoot, a brain cramp ... is also a sestina but it's end words change slightly from line to line. It is also a tremendously well written poem. To right a good one I think the poet needs to consider the possible differences in word meanings and, somehow, use them in a way that is consistent with the theme. Hey ... I think I smell a challenge coming on ... what do you say I track down the end-word format and we all give the sestina a try? Jim |
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Brad Member Ascendant
since 1999-08-20
Posts 5705Jejudo, South Korea |
And I had to open my big mouth!  |
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Not A Poet Member Elite
since 1999-11-03
Posts 3885Oklahoma, USA |
OK guys, here is the format for the end word rotation: First stanza, 1- 2 - 3 - 4 - 5 - 6 Second stanza, 6 - 1 - 5 - 2 - 4 - 3 Third stanza, 3 - 6 - 4 - 1 - 2 - 5 Fourth stanza, 5 - 3 - 2 - 6 - 1 - 4 Fifth stanza, 4 - 5 - 1 - 3 - 6 - 2 Sixth stanza, 2 - 4 - 6 - 5 - 3 - 1 Concluding tercet: middle of first line - 2, end of first line - 5 middle of second line - 4, end of second line - 3 middle if third line - 6, end of third line - 1 BTW Brad, Jim and I have already written one each so you are now behind. Pete What terms shall I find sufficiently simple in their sublimity -- sufficiently sublime in their simplicity -- for the mere enunciation of my theme? Edgar Allan Poe |
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Elyse Member
since 2000-04-16
Posts 414Apex (think raleigh) NC |
pete, what a cute little sestina! although, i have to argue with you on the tercet thing, i thought the words could be arranged in any order so long as you used them all and ended each line with one. oh well.luv Elyse |
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Elilas Junior Member
since 2000-03-15
Posts 20The Dalles, Oregon, USA |
Vary nice i'm glade you have such a great relashionship |
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warmhrt Senior Member
since 1999-12-18
Posts 1563 |
Pete, I enjoyed reading this again. You are very lucky to have sustained such a relationship. Rare these days, it seems. Delightful, Pete, Kris the poet's pen...gives to airy nothing A local habitation and a name ~ Shakespeare |
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Tim Gouldthorp Member
since 2000-01-03
Posts 170 |
Pete, I'm not going to make any suggestions about this becuase I don't know anything about the form. Not that I could see anything at all to suggest. I think you have done an excellent job with an exceedingly difficult form. If nothing else, I think the competency aquired in using such a hard form allows enchanced spontanuity when using less fixed verse ie blank verse, ballad, etc. Very good work. -Tim |
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Not A Poet Member Elite
since 1999-11-03
Posts 3885Oklahoma, USA |
Well, Elyse, you ask and you receive Actually I found the word order in a poetic glossary, shown exactly as I copied above. Then jbouder found a formula somewhere for calculating the word order. It produced the same order. That's all I know for sure about it.And thanks for popping this one back to the top. It was fun to write and a fun discussion followed. Elilas, Kris and Tim, thanks for reading and commenting. It's always good to hear from one's friends. Thanks all, Pete |
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Trevor Senior Member
since 1999-08-12
Posts 700Canada |
Hi Pete, Everything has pretty much been said about this poem so I'll just reverb the majority by saying excellent poem. I too loved the playfullness of it and the two distinct voices that meld at the end really comes through well. But I have to agree with Brad's Styxx comment . One suggestion I have is to change "Get naked". I liked the naked part but "get" seemed out of place for some reason. Maybe use "be". Dunno, mind isn't all that clear right now, kinda nursing a hangover. Anyways, I really enjoyed this poem, thanks for the read, Trevor |
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Elilas Junior Member
since 2000-03-15
Posts 20The Dalles, Oregon, USA |
hay not a poet you seem vary nowledgble about poetty so if you could take a look at mine "I never feel in love with you" that would be great. loved this dialog/pome. Steven |
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Not A Poet Member Elite
since 1999-11-03
Posts 3885Oklahoma, USA |
Hi Trev, Thanks for the critique. The sailing part obviously stays but I see what you mean on the "get naked." It really does sound just a little off. I'm not sure "be naked" fixes it though. But I'll study it and see what I can come up with. Also, I hope your hangover goes away and that you enjoyed whatever caused it Steven, Don't think of me as knowledgeable about poetry, or anything else for that matter. I have looked at you poem but haven't commented because it is a fairly difficult one to analyze. I will try to get to it sometime yet today And thanks for commenting on mine BTW.Thanks, Pete |
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