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Honor Thy Father
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Honor Thy Father |
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Huan Yi Member Ascendant
since 2004-10-12
Posts 6688Waukegan 
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. In the past 24 hours I have read of men who killed their own daughters because they disobeyed their expressed wishes concerning their social behavior. Both fathers came from cultures where such would be considered “honor killings”. Now let us assume that these men devoted their lives, making sacrifices, to raise their families only in their and the eyes of their home culture to be humiliated. Is that a mitigation to be considered at trial? And just to make it difficult, (though having nothing to do with the facts), let’s say the daughters went willingly into pornography. . |
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TomMark Member Elite
since 2007-07-27
Posts 2133LA,CA |
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rwood Member Elite
since 2000-02-29
Posts 3793Tennessee |
who buys it? |
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SEA 
Moderator
Member Seraphic
since 2000-01-18
Posts 22676with you |
I don't see how their culture could possibly come into play here, in today's world how can anyone say that kind of behavior is ok, and since when does a mans honnor come before his child's life?! It's garbage. |
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Huan Yi Member Ascendant
since 2004-10-12
Posts 6688Waukegan |
. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,320325,00.html . There's a question here: if the children do not strive, if not become, what their self denial desired, what is it then that the parents gain in exchange for their sacrifice? To be harshly simple, what is the point of parenting? It strikes some that much of Europe is at a loss for an answer which is why, absent immigration from cultures that have no sympathy for their own, the continent is in decline. . [This message has been edited by Huan Yi (01-04-2008 09:05 PM).] |
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TomMark Member Elite
since 2007-07-27
Posts 2133LA,CA |
The father obviously has mental disorder. One of my dearest friend whose son did drug in high school. One day he told her that he was going to a friend's home to party. She called his parents to make sure that there were adults but got the information that those boys were going to another boy's home where my friend was quite sure that the parents had been out of town. At about 11pm she called police. Those police were very excited and sent out some 6 cars and made a show and all but her son were taken into custody and each parents got a call. about 10-12 some boys. The son has not knowledge that it was his mother who called police. He continued on doing drugs so my friend kicked him out of home. One of his friend/classmate received him. His friend's father is a medical doctor. They have a in-house servant to take care of the children and they bought him 100 dollar+ shoes and wanted to take him out of US for traveling (my friend did not give out the passport). Half years later, the boy surrendered to her mom. He learned what a real home was and what true love was. Now he is in college and doing very well and helps other students. He does regret his misbehave in high school. But , each child has his own way of growth and parents shall never give up. |
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SEA
Moderator
Member Seraphic
since 2000-01-18
Posts 22676with you |
I have three kids. I would not kick them out(have them live with someone, anyone else) while they were still under age. My oldest, is 18 and shortly after turning 18, she joined the Air Force. The best part? She is finding out that the things I told her were true. She is learning and that is what matters most to me. I would never leave the raising of my children to anyone else....that to me, is giving up. My kids are all teens and they challenge me on a daily basis. That is part of growing up, you get to 17 and think you know everything, and eventually, (as I did) you realize that couldn't be further from the truth. More than a dozen times I've called my parents and apologized to them for the kid I was. LOL I can not wrap my head around a parent killing their child. I think those who do it should be shot. |
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Huan Yi Member Ascendant
since 2004-10-12
Posts 6688Waukegan |
"I can not wrap my head around a parent killing their child. I think those who do it should be shot." And yet there are cultures that immigrants come from that . . . I also seem to remember a true story of a father centuries ago who, before the public with his own hands, hanged a son who had been convicted of murder. And in a movie didn’t Yul Brynner portraying a father execute his own son, (Tony Curtis), for betraying his own people for love in a war against the Poles? And: "Genesis 22, is narration from the Hebrew Bible in which God asks Abraham to sacrifice his son Isaac on Mount Moriah . . ." And we can easily get into a discussion as to when one becomes a son or daughter rather than an inconvenience. Nothing's simple. . |
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Huan Yi Member Ascendant
since 2004-10-12
Posts 6688Waukegan |
. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,320954,00.html . |
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TomMark Member Elite
since 2007-07-27
Posts 2133LA,CA |
Good news. Murder never means love in any culture. |
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joe86s Junior Member
since 2008-01-07
Posts 10 |
Aren't we all just a bit too quick off the trigger in condemning another's actions? I'm not saying what the guy did was right--but i don't think they had 'mental problems' thing is, love is different in different places. our ideas of love are quite innovative--ours is a Shakespearean invented love, one reinforced through sit-coms and decades of dramatization. Before that, most marriages were made out of convenience and the romantic love we expect between husband and wife was rare. Also, people had many more children--these were usually assets to the subsistence farming people were doing as a Chinese American, I also have a very different idea of love for family--because of the one child policy, many of us didn't grow up with brothers and sisters; therefore, my generation often think of our cousins as brothers and sisters. To me, they are as close as my own right hand, and I would sacrifice as much for them as I would for my parents--does that mean families who rarely speak to their cousins are devoid of love? We must keep clear that our mindset is not a universal constant but a phenomenon of our culture and upbringing. To that man, he was practicing what was considered the 'right thing' in his culture, just as kosher Jews are doing what they think is right by following methods of food preparation thousands of years out of date and Aztecs were 'doing the right thing' by practicing ritual cannibalism for their gods. it's easy to judge by raising our noses and hard to step outside of the box and look at our culture as one color within an endless spectrum. but is it any better that we still allow people to drive cars which aren't fuel efficient? that we don't provide free health care for the indigent, as all other western countries are doing? maybe in a hundred years our grandchildren will look at us and consign the bunch of us to the 'crazy lunatics' drawer |
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TomMark Member Elite
since 2007-07-27
Posts 2133LA,CA |
A warm welcome to this wonderful place,joe86s. "to the love is different in different places" The father's action was not love. It is face-saving for the disgraceful behave of the child, in fearing of other people's opinions. His action has shown that he has lost his conscience and humanity. joe86s, can you define love for me? if there is not a universal one, then how come every body is talking about the same contents? And I believe that child killing is not general culture of that area though media may have said everything about it. |
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Huan Yi Member Ascendant
since 2004-10-12
Posts 6688Waukegan |
“His action has shown that he has lost his conscience and humanity.” I also seem to remember a true story of a father centuries ago who, before the public with his own hands, hanged a son who had been convicted of murder. Can you reconcile the two? Does all fall before the life of one’s own child? . |
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TomMark Member Elite
since 2007-07-27
Posts 2133LA,CA |
I will say that it was out of his self-righteousness. |
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joe86s Junior Member
since 2008-01-07
Posts 10 |
thanks for the welcome! i love places like this which let people discuss and broaden their minds. i also love puppies. and my father and mother. and my sister. and my friends and my various ex-girlfriends (ehh... to an extent) and my (as of now) non-existent girlfriend all very different kinds of love, no? just as love for your first fling is very different for your wife of forty years. what i guess i'm saying is--there's all different kinds of shades of love, and it can be a very wonderful thing. but, just as even colors are not a universal among humans (did you know that cultures which have only three words to describe colors, ie blue, red, green, cannot differentiate between, say, blue and purple?) love is not either. so, no, that man didn't love his child the way we love ours. but people of his culture might say he had great love for his family (their honor) and his forefathers. i don't think it's right to label him as evil--he is a product of his times, and not a deranged mind. |
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TomMark Member Elite
since 2007-07-27
Posts 2133LA,CA |
joe86s You have not give me your definition of love yet. " but people of his culture might say he had great love for his family (their honor) and his forefathers." Prove it!!! can't use "might" to say that you were saying the right thing.  |
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