The Alley |
Deja Vu? |
Brad Member Ascendant
since 1999-08-20
Posts 5705Jejudo, South Korea |
quote: Lack of cohesion similarities quote: Are we or are we not overextended? Why is Rove being put in charge of the "Reconstruction"? Are these the only companies that can do this kind of thing? Doesn't it bother anyone else that these are the only companies that can do this kind of thing? Uh, does anybody have any good news? |
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© Copyright 2005 Brad - All Rights Reserved | |||
inot2B Member Elite
since 2000-09-18
Posts 2205Arkansas |
I have a question! If all this money has been offered to help the Katrina victims and we now have what is suppose to be Rita entering the Gulf this week, will there be any money to help the next victims? Yes I know you are comparing Iraq w/ Katrina but it just doesn't seem to ever stop. |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
The Enron president? |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
LR, I'm not sure I understand why you are bringing Clinton into this... The bulk of Enron's alleged chicanery happened during the Clinton administration. Source: Fortune Magazine The bad news for those who still worship Mr. Clinton is that Enron not only donated $100,000 to Clinton's 1993 inauguration but, according to the records, also added an additional $25,000 to the Clinton 1993 celebrations. The documented evidence shows that Enron did make it into the Clinton White House by special invitation. Senior Vice President Terrance H. Thorn had coffee with Bill Clinton on March 5, 1996. Many of the other attendees of the Clinton White House coffee sessions also make up a long list of convicted criminals, arms dealers and bagmen for illegal DNC contributions. Enron's association with the Clinton White House comes even closer to home when you consider the many corporate foreign trade trips paid for by your tax dollars. In 1994, Enron's CEO Ken Lay surfaced on a list of attendees wishing to travel to Russia with Ron Brown. One person who did make the trade trip to Russia was Roger Tamraz. Interpol then wanted Tamraz, a Lebanese oil financier, for embezzling nearly $80 million from a Middle Eastern bank. Tamraz, who made most of his money selling Libyan oil, would later give more than $300,000 to the DNC after having coffee with Bill Clinton in the White House. Enron made a $100,000 donation to the DNC just days prior to the trade mission to the former Yugoslav province. Commerce Department documents clearly note that Enron was interested in the "Zagreb" portion of the trip. Even in the last days of Bill Clinton, Enron execs were on the go. Enron traveled to South Korea with Commerce Secretary William Daley in 1999. Daley would go on to run Vice President Al Gore's failed bid for the White House in 2000. The most damning evidence linking Bill Clinton and Enron to corruption is the documentation that shows Enron received U.S. taxpayer monies in order to finance a corrupt deal with Indonesia. http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2002/2/28/12723.shtml The Washington Times reported Thursday that the Clinton administration coughed up more than $1 billion in taxpayer-subsidized loans to Enron Corp. just when the energy giant was kicking in almost $2 million for Democrat causes. And as we have previously reported, to help persuade then-President Bill Clinton to push the disastrous Kyoto Protocol, Enron gave $420,000 to Democrats. Moreover, the Clinton administration, "which lauded Chairman Kenneth L. Lay as an exemplary 'corporate citizen,' granted about $200 million worth of insurance against political risks for nine Enron projects in such politically volatile areas as Argentina, Venezuela and the Gaza Strip, according to documents the agencies provided to the Senate Finance Committee." "These projects obviously were a tremendous benefit to Enron's operations," Sen. Charles Grassley, R-Iowa, ranking minority member of the committee, told the Times. The Reagan and Bush administrations approved not a single loan for Enron between 1985 and 1992 and provided insurance for only one Enron power project in Guatemala in 1992, he noted. On the other hand, the Clinton administration made three loans between 1994 and 1998 to the now-defunct Dabhol power project in India. Ron Brown, Clinton's commerce secretary, bragged about the approval of the Dabhol loans during a trade mission to India in 1995, while Lay stood by his side. http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2002/2/21/153014.shtml Enron's Democrat Pals Documents obtained by TIME show the energy giant enjoyed much closer ties with Clinton Administration regulators than was generally known By MICHAEL WEISSKOPF SUBSCRIBE TO TIMEPRINTE-MAILMORE BY AUTHOR Posted Saturday, Aug. 17, 2002 Before its messy decline and fall, Enron had plenty of clout in George W. Bush's Washington, from the personal ties between chairman Ken Lay and the President to the company's alleged influence on Vice President Dick Cheney's energy task force. But Enron's cozy relationship with Washington didn't start there. Documents obtained by TIME show the energy giant enjoyed much closer ties with Clinton Administration regulators than was generally known. Long before Cheney's task force met with Enron officials and included their ideas in Bush's energy plan, Clinton's energy team was doing much the same thing. Drafting a 1995 plan to help facilitate cash flow and credit for energy producers, it asked for Enron's input—and listened. The staff was directed to "rework the proposal to take into account the specific comments and suggestions you made," Clinton Deputy Energy Secretary Bill White wrote an Enron official. Clinton officials also made efforts to help Enron get business overseas. Clinton Energy Secretary Hazel O'Leary included Enron officials on trade missions to India, China, Pakistan and South Africa. White, returning from a 1994 trip to Mexico, wrote chairman Lay that "much opportunity" existed there for natural gas, and he sent a copy of Mexico's energy plans. To persuade an Enron senior vice president to join a mission to Pakistan, White wrote, "I have strong personal relationships with the existing government." Enron showed its gratitude. At Christmas 1995, documents show, it donated an unknown sum of cash in O'Leary's name to a charity called "I Have a Dream." And when Clinton ran for re-election a year later, the company made its largest single contribution ever—$100,000—to the President's party. http://www.time.com/time/business/article/0,8599,338580,00.html Your comment about Clinton could almost be considered a cheap shot by liberals |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
Well I was merely referring to the largest bankruptcy in history... But if you're going to be silly at least be objective; quote:http://www.opensecrets.org/news/enron/index.asp |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Silly?...it's just that when I see cute insults with little value tossed into a thread for kicks, I suppose, it brings out a little imp.. Objective? hmmm...something like....? -From 1990 to 1994 Enron gave 42% of their donations to Democrats. Source: The Center for Responsive Politics Florida's state pension fund, which lost $325 million on Enron, is examining what role Frank Savage, a major Democratic donor, may have played in the state's loss. The fund's investments were directed by Alliance Capital Management, where Savage was a senior executive and chairman at the same time he sat on Enron's board. He donated $100,000 to Democrats and raised money for New York gubernatorial candidate Carl McCall. Source: Time Magazine Lloyd Bensten, Clinton's first treasury secretary, was a recipient of Enron's money. At the time of his campaign for Senate, he received the second largest donation from Enron. Source: Center for Responsive Politics Robert Rubin, Bensten's successor, was involved with Enron while he worked as an investment banker at Goldman & Sachs. Clinton first hired Rubin to head his National Economic Council. Soon afterwards, Rubin wrote on Goldman Sachs stationery to former clients, including Enron, that he ''looked forward to continuing to work with you in my new capacity.'' Source: WorldNet Daily In the days when Franjo Tudjman was Croatia's dictator and pretending to be both a reformed communist and best friend of America in the Balkans, poor Franjo had a problem. He and some of his very best friends were wanted as war criminals by the Hague's International Court of Justice. Enron wanted a power contract with Croatia. Enron offered a deal to Tudjman. Sign up with us and we will use our gang in Washington to make sure you and your friends don't go to jail. Tudjman signed. Enron made a heap of money. Nobody went to jail. Everyone was happy - until Tudjman died of cancer. Then the lid was off, his Croatian Democratic Union was defeated and the new boys in power in Zagreb could not believe how much of their budget went to pay the electricity bills from Enron. Source: Pittsburg Tribune-Review In August 1993, McLarty, Clinton's former chief of staff, arranged an invitation for Lay, Enron's CEO, to play golf with Clinton in Vail, Colorado. This date irritated Oscar Wyatt, chief executive of Coastal, another natural gas company that had helped the Clinton election campaign raise funds. These connections to the Democratic administration helped Enron considerably. Source: Time Magazine Enron got permission to build a pipeline from Mozambique to South Africa after National Security Adviser Anthony Lake threatened to withhold aid to Mozambique if it didnt approve the project. Source: Mozambique News Agency -Enron Corporation donated $100,000 to the Democratic National Committee. Six days later, Enron executives were on a trade mission with Commerce Secretary Mickey Kantor to Bosnia and Croatia. With Kantor's support, Enron signed a $100 million contract to build a 150-megawatt power plant. Source: The Weekly Standard Democratic Senators Chuck Schumer of New York, John Breaux of Louisiana, and Jeff Bingaman of New Mexico--chair of the Senate Energy Committee--are among the top beneficiaries of Enron's political donations. Source: Fortune Magazine Joe Lieberman and Tom Daschle's Largest Contributor in the 2000 election cycle was Enron's Largest Creditor, Citigroup. Source: Center for Responsive Politics Former Democratic Texas Gov. Ann Richards appointed Ken Lay ,the Enron exec, to the Governor's Business Council and received contributions from Enron. Source: Washington Post Al Gore and Bill Clinton introduced Enron to market managers in Russia, China, Indonesia and India. In India, Enron quickly became involved in one of that country's most massive corruption investigations, contracts were canceled and Enron was out. Source: Pittsburg Tribune-Review -Government records show that, during the Clinton years, Lay and other Enron executives got seats on at least four Energy Department trade missions and at least seven Commerce Department trade trips. Source: WorldNet Daily The congressman who recieved the most money from Enron in the past 12 years is Ken Bentsen (D-Texas) who received $42,750. The second largest receiver was Sheila Jackson Lee (D-Texas) who received $38,000 Source: Center for Responsive Politics According to internal Enron documents and the recollections of former employees, Chairman Kenneth L. Lay had the ear of top Democrats in the 1980s and '90s. He and his colleagues used that access to promote the company's interests with the Clinton administration and key congressional Democrats. Source: Washington Post Enron's political action committee gave $10,000 in 2000 to the New Democrat Network, which was co-founded by Sen. Joseph I. Lieberman (D-Conn.). Lieberman, the Democratic vice presidential nominee that year, now chairs the Senate Government Affairs Committee, which is leading an inquiry into Enron's collapse. Source: Washington Post Feel free to ignore any or all of the above articles as you wish. Objective, LR? Bush happened to be the one sitting in the White House at the time the dam burst but Enron was Clinton's child for many years. I daresay, that if the personalities were reversed along with your preferences, you could build an equally damning case against Clinton. The Enron president? He's right up there in those paragraphs... |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
Well if your goal is to prove that Democrats are only 42% dirty and Republicans are 58% dirty then your case is closed. Objective -- that would be to represent ALL the facts: http://www.opensecrets.org/news/enron/enron_totals.asp http://www.opensecrets.org/news/enron/enron_pres.asp And by the 2000 campaign 72% of Enron contributions were going to Republicans and only 28% to Democrats -- and we know who Ken Lay's best bud was? Hmmm? Oh.. and -- lets not leave out that Repubilcans in the Congress (who held the purse strings) were the ones that authorized those funds Mike. Of course most of it happened before the Bush administration -- they went bankrupt in 2001... how bad would it be if they hadn't? But he still has Haliburton. |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
LOL! Congrats, Reb. I thought I had the lead in the cheap shots dept but you're taking the title away from me! Sorry to hijack your thread, Brad. LR started it!! |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
I'm afraid there's nothing cheap about it Mike. You and I are footing the bill as the wealth is redistributed from the working class to the Oligarchy. |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
or should I say Plutocracy? |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
And I think this may be what Brad is getting at? quote: http://www.commondreams.org/news2004/0803-02.htm |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Good thing the Democratic leaders aren't wealthy.... Just go ahead and say Bushocracy and put it to bed |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
Exactly my point Mike... you can vote for a wealthy Democrat, or a wealthy Republican. Plutocracy. But, under Republican ideology poverty keeps increasing. Why is that when oil companies are posting $35 billion dollar profits per quarter (pre-Katrina hikes)? While real wages are falling. |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
quote: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/09/16/AR2005091601282.html |
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Alicat Member Elite
since 1999-05-23
Posts 4094Coastal Texas |
While wages are falling? Ever hear of NAFTA, the brainchild of Perot, signed into law very shortly after Clinton first gained office? It's a common corporate practice now, and has been for some time, to keep the corporate offices in the US, then to send manufacturing facilities into Mexico. Canada has far too many taxes to entice most US corporations except for the sado-masochistic. Since Mexican employees accept much lower wages, compensation and perks than their US counterparts, of course wages will fall in the US, as the skilled unionized workers demanding higher wages can be easily denied, moving the jobs south of the border. President HW Bush didn't sign this into law, neither did GW Bush. Look to President Clinton, the lying under oath before a Federal Grand Jury hero, right around 1992 or 1993. As far as Watts, though I support whistleblowing, she broke a very common business practice of insuboriniation by going over the heads of her superiors instead of following the Chain of Command. She didn't go through the Chain without redress, she went directly over all their heads at go, which is my assumption lacking any other contradicting evidence. I already can sense the response, so I'll go ahead and save time and energy with saying 'actions and consequences', that most despided saying among liberals. She chose to usurp her superiors, and paid the consequences. You go through the Chain, and if no satisfaction is found, then you go higher. You don't start at higher then bemoan the fact that superiors and coworkers don't trust you. |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
I think you're mistaken or misinformed. Perot was vehemently opposed to NAFTA. Do you remember the phrase 'Giant Sucking Sound'? NAFTA was a conservative agenda item that was actually an expansion of the US/Canada Free Trade agreement that went into effect in 1989 and was heavily pushed by both the Bush41 White House and Clinton campaigns. Perot was trying to differentiate himself from the Plutocracy by opposing it. I used to have 3 Maquiladora plants under my responsibilities and I can tell you from first hand experience that NAFTA did nothing to enhance the lives of average Mexican labor. I can also tell you that even though Clinton did make NAFTA his major legislative push in 1993 real wages grew under the Clinton years and people rolled out of poverty and off the welfare rolls. But, where I agree with you Cat, and I've written extensively about it here, and professionally, is that it is the folly of our time to chase cheap labor around the globe. Not only do we endanger our economic viability but we create a security threat as well -- which would be a good topic for another thread. I also fought with the UAW every day as I was management and worked with people who got up in the morning every day to try to figure out how to screw the Union. Of course the Union did the same thing. It was like the old cartoon of the sheepdog and the coyote -- except when it was time to punch out nobody was friends. True to form though -- as soon as there is an opportunity the Bushies look for a way to do more Union busting. It's funny I didn't hear any of them say it would expedite the rebuilding effort if Haliburton would agree to reduce its profit margins. |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
reference /pip/Forum6/HTML/000685.html |
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Alicat Member Elite
since 1999-05-23
Posts 4094Coastal Texas |
Well, if I'm mistaken, then I rescind the Perot comment. I could've sworn it was a very popular pro-campaign issue for Perot, which helped to split the Republicans for a slim victory for Clinton in 1992, since if Perot had not run, HW Bush would've had a very strong majority popular vote. Edit: On a google search for 'nafta perot', a wikipedia article cleared up my addlepated mind. NAFTA was never about raising up the Mexican workers, it was about increasing US corporate profits while making US labor costs decrease. That's it in a nutshell, since Mexican semi's aren't allowed to penetrate very far at all in the US, due to US emission rules, which was known at the time of signing. Well, known by the US, not necessarily by Mexico. |
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Brad Member Ascendant
since 1999-08-20
Posts 5705Jejudo, South Korea |
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9379241/ quote: quote: In the video of "Type" by Living Color, you have the fat cats eating a cake in the form of an earth. That image keeps looping inside my head right now. |
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Brad Member Ascendant
since 1999-08-20
Posts 5705Jejudo, South Korea |
I don't know. Can you make this stuff up? Clinton's fault quote: And when did the House become Republican? |
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Juju Member Elite
since 2003-12-29
Posts 3429In your dreams |
I am amused by this thread. Juju - 1.) a magic charm or fetish 2.)Magic 3.)A taboo connected woth the use of magic |
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Brad Member Ascendant
since 1999-08-20
Posts 5705Jejudo, South Korea |
To be honest, I have some sympathy for Rush. He works hard and can be genuinely funny occasionally, it seems inevitable that he's going to screw up given the sheer amount of air time that he has. But he offers a completely different interpretation of Bush's speech: quote: Is this an admission that the current Congress and administration are not conservative? Is this an admission that nothing has worked for that last five years, the last ten? Is this an admission that they're going to be conservative starting from last week? Or is it simply a sign of the vacuousness of the speech itself? |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
It's a sign that Rush recognizes that his main gig is to preach to the choir and make them feel good -- especially when the President's numbers are tanking like they are. |
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Midnitesun
since 2001-05-18
Posts 28647Gaia |
speaking of tanking the President google the word 'failure' see what comes up first LOL OK, so here is Googles explanation: Googlebombing 'failure' 9/16/2005 12:54:00 PM Posted by Marissa Mayer, Director of Consumer Web Products If you do a Google search on the word [failure] or the phrase [miserable failure], the top result is currently the White House’s official biographical page for President Bush. We've received some complaints recently from users who assume that this reflects a political bias on our part. I'd like to explain how these results come up in order to allay these concerns. Google's search results are generated by computer programs that rank web pages in large part by examining the number and relative popularity of the sites that link to them. By using a practice called googlebombing, however, determined pranksters can occasionally produce odd results. In this case, a number of webmasters use the phrases [failure] and [miserable failure] to describe and link to President Bush's website, thus pushing it to the top of searches for those phrases. We don't condone the practice of googlebombing, or any other action that seeks to affect the integrity of our search results, but we're also reluctant to alter our results by hand in order to prevent such items from showing up. Pranks like this may be distracting to some, but they don't affect the overall quality of our search service, whose objectivity, as always, remains the core of our mission. Sorry for interjecting this bit of humor into a serious thread, but sometimes, ya just gotta laugh at what's going on. |
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