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What is "the good"? . . .

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OwlSA
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since 11-07-2005
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Durban, South Africa


0 posted 01-21-2009 02:28 PM       View Profile for OwlSA   Email OwlSA   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for OwlSA


What is "the good"?  Should it be strived for? And why/why not?

Owl
Essorant
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since 08-10-2002
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1 posted 01-21-2009 07:54 PM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

I think Juvenal describes it well: mens sana in corpore sano.

OwlSA
Member Rara Avis
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2 posted 01-22-2009 01:03 PM       View Profile for OwlSA   Email OwlSA   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for OwlSA

Based on reading previous things you have said, in Discussion forums, Essorant, I would have thought you would have come up with more than "healthy mind, healthy body" to answer the first question.  Is that all you think "the good" is?  And you didn't answer the second and third question.

Owl
Essorant
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3 posted 01-22-2009 05:08 PM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

I don't give all at once.

But if you won't even savour a good crumb, why should I give you a good cookie?  
Bob K
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4 posted 01-22-2009 10:57 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     An interesting thought, again.  A lot of those old Greek guys used to be down on poets.  One of the reasons for that might be the disturbing tendency of poets to want nouns, and to privilege them so often over modifiers.

     "The Good" is supposed to be some sort of archetypal quality, as I understand it.  I find this particular abstraction difficult if not impossible to talk about without a noun that it attempt to be describing.  Thousands of years of philosophers seem to have found this point un-important.  I on the other hand find that a good blue and a good dome are so vastly different that I'm at a loss for finding a common method of talking about the adjective they share.  I think the qualities inhere to the noun, whichever noun that may be, and that to separate the discussion of "The Good" from whichever noun is involved seems pretty much nonsense.

     But then, what do I know, except that my brain stops hurting when I think of things that way, and that it starts to hurt when I try to make an adjective into a noun.

Sincerely, Bob Kaven
Brad
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5 posted 01-25-2009 06:22 PM       View Profile for Brad   Email Brad   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Brad

Bob,

Hey, my thoughts exactly.

I wouldn't blame it on poets though. I blame it on Plato.
Stephanos
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6 posted 01-26-2009 08:30 PM       View Profile for Stephanos   Email Stephanos   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Stephanos's Home Page   View IP for Stephanos

quote:
Thousands of years of philosophers seem to have found this point un-important.


I'm not here to say that the definition of "good" is easy, even with transcendent help ... But since philosophy itself means "the love of wisdom", and since ethics is a major branch (the other two being epistemology and metaphysics), I find this statement a bit ... well, overstated.  


Stephen  
Stephanos
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7 posted 01-26-2009 08:47 PM       View Profile for Stephanos   Email Stephanos   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Stephanos's Home Page   View IP for Stephanos

Brad,

you seem to be stuck on a Platonic/non-Platonic dualism of some kind.  


Stephen
Bob K
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8 posted 01-26-2009 11:00 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



Dear Stephanos,

           Re: your comment to Brad, you might find more than interesting the book by the late I.F.Stone called The Trial of Socrates.  Stone, who was pretty much deaf, was a journalist who found himself at a serious disadvantage when it came to press conferences.  He compensated by paying very close attention to press releases, and tracking down the facts behind them, often coming up with remarkable stories.

     When he retired, he taught himself Greek, and used his research into Platon, and Socrates and the Athens and the Sparta of their time to come up with a remarkable set of propositions that really should be looked at first-hand to be appreciated, and which make the actions of the Athenians much more understandable, if true.  The split between Platonic and non-platonic then becomes a somewhat more interesting matter than before.

     If nothing else, The Trial of Socrates adds considerable richness to ones understanding of the philosophy and the history of the time.

Yours, Bob Kaven
Stephanos
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9 posted 01-27-2009 12:58 AM       View Profile for Stephanos   Email Stephanos   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Stephanos's Home Page   View IP for Stephanos

Bob,

Thanks for the recommendation.
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