How to Join Member's Area Private Library Search Today's Topics p Login
Main Forums Discussion Tech Talk Mature Content Archives
   Nav Win
 Discussion
 Philosophy 101
 Honor
 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
Follow us on Facebook

 Moderated by: Ron   (Admins )

 
User Options
Format for Better Printing EMail to a Friend Not Available
Admin Print Send ECard
Passions in Poetry

Honor

 Post A Reply Post New Topic   Go to the Next Oldest/Previous Topic Return to Topic Page Go to the Next Newest Topic 
Huan Yi
Member Ascendant
since 10-12-2004
Posts 6334
Waukegan


0 posted 01-10-2008 08:29 PM       View Profile for Huan Yi   Email Huan Yi   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Huan Yi

.


“Can a man live without honor?”


Charlton Heston as
Rodrigo Díaz de Vivar
in “El Cid” (1961)

What is honor,
and can a man live, in the context
intended in the movie, without it?

(PS:

“Strength and honor”

From the movie:  “Gladiator” (2000),
so the word hasn’t gone away.)


.
TomMark
Member Elite
since 07-27-2007
Posts 2111
LA,CA


1 posted 01-10-2008 10:07 PM       View Profile for TomMark   Email TomMark   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for TomMark

If the definition is "honesty, fairness, or integrity in one's beliefs and actions".

Then I say, many living ones don't have any of them.
Essorant
Member Elite
since 08-10-2002
Posts 4689
Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada


2 posted 01-11-2008 12:35 AM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

I think the best translation is our English word worship.  I mean as it was originally used:

Worship (n.)
O.E. worđscip, wurđscip (Anglian), weorđscipe (W.Saxon) "condition of being worthy, honor, renown," from weorđ "worthy" (see worth) + -scipe (see -ship). Sense of "reverence paid to a supernatural or divine being" is first recorded c.1300. The original sense is preserved in the title worshipful (c.1300). The verb is recorded from c.1200.
[from etymonline.com]

TomMark
Member Elite
since 07-27-2007
Posts 2111
LA,CA


3 posted 01-11-2008 12:46 AM       View Profile for TomMark   Email TomMark   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for TomMark

Sir Essorant, where were you when we tried to tell Sir Balladeer that war did not rhyme with far?

Now "worship"

Man can not live without worship. Each time man looks into a mirror, that is the time for  self-worship. And if there is no mirror, he will manage to find water to look at himself. Am I included? huh?
Essorant
Member Elite
since 08-10-2002
Posts 4689
Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada


4 posted 01-11-2008 07:16 PM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant


Sir Essorant, where were you when we tried to tell Sir Balladeer that war did not rhyme with far?


I don't know.  Does he speak an unstandard dialect?  In standard English words with war have an "ore"-like sound: war (w"ore"), warden (w"ore"den), toward (tow("ore")d).Therefore war rhymes with lore, instead of far.  Just like worth rhymes with earth, instead of north.  


Man can not live without worship. Each time man looks into a mirror, that is the time for  self-worship. And if there is no mirror, he will manage to find water to look at himself. Am I included? huh?


I agree.  No man is ever without honor at all.  No matter how low a man becomes, he still has honour.  It may be ignored and neglected, but I don't think honor may ever be removed from a man.  


Huan Yi
Member Ascendant
since 10-12-2004
Posts 6334
Waukegan


5 posted 01-11-2008 08:29 PM       View Profile for Huan Yi   Email Huan Yi   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Huan Yi

.


"It may be ignored and neglected, but I don't think honor may ever be removed from a man."


Then no man need do anything
to maintain it.  So what was all
the trouble about before?  

.
Essorant
Member Elite
since 08-10-2002
Posts 4689
Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada


6 posted 01-11-2008 09:23 PM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

You are right.
It is not about having honour.  We all have honor.  But it is about acknowledging that we still have honor and standing up for it, even when we are fallen to the lowest.
TomMark
Member Elite
since 07-27-2007
Posts 2111
LA,CA


7 posted 01-11-2008 09:29 PM       View Profile for TomMark   Email TomMark   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for TomMark

It is about keep dusting!!!!
Bob K
Member Elite
since 11-03-2007
Posts 3860


8 posted 01-18-2008 03:48 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K

    

     Actually, I think the concept itself conceptually and linguistically may be at a crossroads as we speak.  I think the Founders thought the concept central to the United States.
I am not a scholar on the subject, so I'd like to toss the notion out to get people's thoughts on the matter, but the notion of "impeachment" seems to me likely intimately ties up with honor.

     We tend to think today of impeachment as removal of an official from office, but that doesn't see to be the case, does it?  I suspect that the original idea behind impeachment may have, sadly, feel a bit foreign to us today.  What has been impeached may not have been the official, but the official's HONOR, with general agreement by the officials peers and superiors, depending of the official's rank.

     Duels were fought at that time over honor.  Such a stunning mass indictment would probably at a minimum force an official to leave office with a shocking loss of face.  Suicides have been known to happen over less.  Such a punishment could hardly have been more severe.  

     Thoughts today about the notion of honor itself, the honor of specific government officials, and the honor of the government as a whole seem to have shifted enormously over this time.  I don't know if it's for the better or for the worse overall.  What Auden said—was it about the '50's—about it being "a lowdown dishonest decade" are as chilling today as they were then, aren't they?

     BobK.
 
 Post A Reply Post New Topic   Go to the Next Oldest/Previous Topic Return to Topic Page Go to the Next Newest Topic 
All times are ET (US) Top
  User Options
>> Discussion >> Philosophy 101 >> Honor Format for Better Printing EMail to a Friend Not Available
Print Send ECard

 

pipTalk Home Page | Main Poetry Forums

How to Join | Member's Area / Help | Private Library | Search | Contact Us | Today's Topics | Login
Discussion | Tech Talk | Archives | Sanctuary



© Passions in Poetry and netpoets.com 1998-2013
All Poetry and Prose is copyrighted by the individual authors