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Passions in Poetry

"Civilized"

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Essorant
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since 08-10-2002
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Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada


0 posted 06-16-2007 04:27 PM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

Is there anything that is usually considered "civilized" that you don't accept as very civilized at all?
Ron
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since 05-19-99
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1 posted 06-16-2007 05:05 PM       View Profile for Ron   Email Ron   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Ron's Home Page   View IP for Ron

Self-mutilation.

Civilized folk, of course, call them piercings and tattoos.




oceanvu2
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since 02-24-2007
Posts 1007
Santa Monica, California, USA


2 posted 06-16-2007 05:18 PM       View Profile for oceanvu2   Email oceanvu2   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for oceanvu2

Female circumscision, stoning and other honorable modes of killing women, drowning excess female children, empressing children into revolutionary armies, permitting starvation in a world of abundance... Odds and ends like that.

I can live with a ring in my kid's nose.

Best, Jim

[This message has been edited by oceanvu2 (06-16-2007 09:25 PM).]

Local Rebel
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since 12-21-1999
Posts 5742
Southern Abstentia


3 posted 06-16-2007 05:34 PM       View Profile for Local Rebel   Email Local Rebel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Local Rebel

Civilization.

It's a jungle out there.
Drauntz
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since 03-16-2007
Posts 2907
Los Angeles California


4 posted 06-16-2007 07:47 PM       View Profile for Drauntz   Email Drauntz   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Drauntz

Beat around the bush.
Edward Grim
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since 12-18-2005
Posts 1112
Greenville, South Carolina


5 posted 06-16-2007 09:39 PM       View Profile for Edward Grim   Email Edward Grim   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Edward Grim's Home Page   View IP for Edward Grim

quote:
Female circumscision


OUCH! hahaha.




Me? Holy wars, abortion and euthanasia; children on cell phones, homeowners association and Miami.

“Well all the apostles, they’re sittin’ on the swings, sayin’ I’d sell off my savior for a set of new rings.”

Brad
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since 08-20-99
Posts 5896
Jejudo, South Korea


6 posted 06-16-2007 11:14 PM       View Profile for Brad   Email Brad   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Brad

debt
UseTheIllusion
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since 02-06-2006
Posts 223
In a state of limbo


7 posted 06-17-2007 01:20 AM       View Profile for UseTheIllusion   Email UseTheIllusion   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for UseTheIllusion

Capitalism.  
hush
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since 05-27-2001
Posts 1693
Ohio, USA


8 posted 06-17-2007 02:30 AM       View Profile for hush   Email hush   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for hush

'OUCH! hahaha.'

Raising eyebrow- didn;t know it was funny.

To add my two cents- routine male circumcision.
rwood
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since 02-29-2000
Posts 3797
Tennessee


9 posted 06-17-2007 07:44 AM       View Profile for rwood   Email rwood   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for rwood

marriage.
Edward Grim
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since 12-18-2005
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Greenville, South Carolina


10 posted 06-17-2007 05:27 PM       View Profile for Edward Grim   Email Edward Grim   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Edward Grim's Home Page   View IP for Edward Grim

quote:
'OUCH! hahaha.'

Raising eyebrow- didn;t know it was funny.


Well, first off Hush, I didn't even realize that was an actual practice (I'm not as worldly as you). It sounded like an oxymoron seeing as circumcision is usually associated with males. I'm still a little confused as to what exactly it is or what purpose the procedure is done for and quite frankly I don't care to know.
Essorant
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since 08-10-2002
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Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada


11 posted 06-19-2007 06:43 PM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

What about something that almost all homeowners do: mow their lawn.

Why do people have a thing against long grass?  It doesn't harm anyone.  But they try to force it to look like a manmade carpet out of somewhat mechanical attachment to the idea that it ought to be done, and if it is not done then they are being neglectful.  

Yet the deed itself disallows a natural, living and unharmful part of nature to grow naturally, and harms living beings that live, throfare, and find shelter in that part of nature when chance to get caught in the machine's path as well.  

I don't think mowing a lawn is civilized because it involves technology.  To me it seems a mechanical act based on little virtue beyond a superficial aesthetic.

Christopher
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12 posted 06-19-2007 07:26 PM       View Profile for Christopher   Email Christopher   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Christopher

You do realize that you're using a computer to post on the Internet, right Ess?

FWIW - Mowing the lawn is a bit more than just developing a cultivated "machined" look to one's front yard. There are legitimate reasons for keeping one's lawn trimmed. The first thing that comes to mind is that an unkempt lawn becomes home to a number of myriad creatures that could be harmful to humans - rats, for one. Mosquitoes (possibly carrying West Nile), could breed in depressions a home owner couldn't see with long grass. Rocks, toys, etc., could be hidden in the grass, becoming a trip hazard - worse yet, if they had metal pieces on them, could become rusty and cause tetanus.

Add to that the fact that most grasses will die if left untrimmed. Nature has it's own way of maintaining healthy grasslands in the form of grazers... and I'm not really ready to have cows on my lawn, yanno.

My response to the original question: people who fashion themselves civilized (in line with Reb's answer). It's an overrated segregation that, much like religious fanatics, tends to limit more than enhance; any type of group that focuses more on governance than being proactive is nothing more than a false aid.
Essorant
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13 posted 06-19-2007 08:27 PM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

I don't agree.  If you keep your whole yard clean, then long grass may be kept just as clean.  My grass in my backyard has been fulltall for ages, and I never had any unwanted animals in my yard, nor any problem keeping litter out of my yard.

Christopher
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14 posted 06-19-2007 08:49 PM       View Profile for Christopher   Email Christopher   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Christopher

Let me guess - you've never had a 2 year old son either. (talk about uncivilized... you should see this boy when he gets together and plays with his dogs!)  
Christopher
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15 posted 06-19-2007 08:55 PM       View Profile for Christopher   Email Christopher   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Christopher

I just did some spot research on Regina, Ess - it looks like you live in a fair sized city with a pretty high density. That could make a considerable difference over where I live, where I can throw a rock and hit an orchard or corn field. We have a considerable wildlife population in this area and some fairly dangerous bugs (brown recluse, no end of black widows)... and, sadly, the occassional rattlesnake as well. You are more than welcome to consider it uncivilized, but I'll keep cutting the grass and pruning the shrubs and clipping the flowers... and not just because of potential dangers, but because I'm fond of order. If I wanted to be a naturalist (as it sounds like you're suggesting civilized people to be), I'd move up into the mountains and don my hemp loincloth.
rwood
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since 02-29-2000
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Tennessee


16 posted 06-19-2007 09:00 PM       View Profile for rwood   Email rwood   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for rwood

well Ess~

it's like this.

Snakes can't live with me, and they would if I didn't mow, and trust me I hate to mow.

and then there's the dreaded home owner's association that Ed mentioned. It's a pact you make with them devils just to be able to live in a quiet neighborhood with low light, less noise, protection of trees, and domestic animals, etc.

though I do understand your view of nature in its truest form. Grass plains are beautiful and my sis and I used to play hide and seek in them.
rwood
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17 posted 06-19-2007 09:23 PM       View Profile for rwood   Email rwood   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for rwood

Laugh.

I thought Christopher was talkin' bout me at first glance.

What did he find about me? My grass needs mowin'??? Hahaha.

anywho, You have Regina's vote on long grass in Regina.
Essorant
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18 posted 06-19-2007 09:37 PM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

Christopher

And yet I imagine you probably drive a car at least everyday, or go where others drive cars.  

You won't let grass grow long because it puts life at some risk, yet you will drive a car that puts life at an even bigger risk, among mechanical traffic, and the kind of statistics of injuries and death, and pollution that come from man's fancy for the automobile every year?  

I would rather let the grass grow every day, and be a little closer to meeting my wilder relatives than risk life everyday in the haste and violence of machines.

Essorant
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19 posted 06-19-2007 10:52 PM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

Reg,

"Snakes can't live with me, and they would if I didn't mow, and trust me I hate to mow."

I think it is likelier that you kill a hundred innocent insects every mowing than that you would ever be injured by a snake for not mowing your lawn.  

rwood
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Tennessee


20 posted 06-20-2007 05:25 AM       View Profile for rwood   Email rwood   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for rwood

you're probably right

and I love dragonflies

Christopher
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21 posted 06-20-2007 01:40 PM       View Profile for Christopher   Email Christopher   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Christopher

I'm more than happy to kill as many insects as I can, Ess. I have a flyswatter that gets used consistently during the summer here. I spray the entire perimeter of my house and property with bug killer once a month or so. I place "snail bait" around my garden. I set rat traps if/when there is a problem. I shoot "critters" that try to get into my garbage and run along the roof.

While I don't condone "gratuitous" slaying of animals (and I don't count insects in there with animals, they're fair game any time), I am at the top of the food chain and will freely develop my immediate surroundings to fit my needs and desires. I have a swimming pool and a spa, both filled with chlorine that prevents algae from growing. I have cleansers that prevent bacteria from growing on the surfaces in my house. I have a vacuum with a HEPA filter that eliminates some of the germs in my house. I have toothpaste that kills bacteria there. I eat beef, chicken, fish, pork (bacon, yum  yum), wear leather tennis shoes and live in a house built out of wood.

The best part of all this? I am ok with it. If the "innocent" (hahah) insects want to secure their future, they can develop opposable thumbs and climb a bit higher on the food chain. Otherwise… they’re toast.
Christopher
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22 posted 06-20-2007 01:53 PM       View Profile for Christopher   Email Christopher   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Christopher

quote:
Christopher

And yet I imagine you probably drive a car at least everyday, or go where others drive cars.  

You won't let grass grow long because it puts life at some risk, yet you will drive a car that puts life at an even bigger risk, among mechanical traffic, and the kind of statistics of injuries and death, and pollution that come from man's fancy for the automobile every year?  

I would rather let the grass grow every day, and be a little closer to meeting my wilder relatives than risk life everyday in the haste and violence of machines.
I do drive a car everyday. It has safety features built in, such as struts to minimize damage in an impact, safety belts, and shatter-proof glass to name a few.

Mowing my lawn could be considered relative to the safety measures they put in cars.

But, really - I was just providing some potential reasons that mowing your lawn might be good. My lawns are relatively healthy, considering the heat and I like them.
Christopher
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23 posted 06-20-2007 01:54 PM       View Profile for Christopher   Email Christopher   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Christopher

one final thing for now - if it's any consolation, Ess, all my power tools at home are electric... I don't pollute the atmosphere while cutting the grass.
Essorant
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Posts 4689
Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada


24 posted 06-23-2007 03:15 PM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

I guess many a man wouldn't feel like much of a man anymore if he didn't pick on creatures much smaller than himself.
 
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