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Passions in Poetry

Bad American...

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Edward Grim
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since 12-18-2005
Posts 1112
Greenville, South Carolina


0 posted 03-22-2007 07:09 PM       View Profile for Edward Grim   Email Edward Grim   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Edward Grim's Home Page   View IP for Edward Grim

Inspired by yet another email I received today. (Perhaps I should switch to snail-mail; what do ya think?) This post is a companion to my other thread. I basically want to delve into the pool that is the "American attitude." Again, this isn't to suggest that all Americans or even a high percent of Americans think this way; but I feel there are enough (that I know of)  to be able to discuss it.

The email is titled "Bad American" and is referring to George Carlin. Here it is:


I Am Your Worst Nightmare. I am a BAD American. I am George Carlin.


I believe the money I make belongs to me and my family, not some mid level governmental functionary be it Democratic or Republican!

I'm in touch with my feelings and I like it that way!


I think owning a gun doesn't make you a killer, it makes you a smart American.


I think being a minority does not make you noble or victimized, and does not entitle you to anything.

I believe that if you are selling me a Big Mac, do it in English.


I believe everyone has a right to pray to his or her God when and where they want to.


My heroes are John Wayne, Babe Ruth, Roy Rogers, and whoever canceled Jerry Springer.

I don't hate the rich. I don't pity the poor.


I know wrestling is fake and I don't waste my time watching or arguing about it.


I've never owned a slave, or was a slave! I haven't burned any witches or been persecuted by the Turks and neither have you! So, shut up already.

I believe if you don't like the way things are here, go back to where you came from and change your own country! This is AMERICA.


I want to know which church it is exactly where the Reverend Jesse Jackson preaches, where he gets his money, and why he is always part of the problem and not the solution. Can I get an AMEN on that one?
I think the cops have every right to shoot your sorry rear if you're running from them..


I also think they have the right to pull you over if you're breaking the law, regardless of what color you are.

And, no, I don't mind having my face shown on my drivers license. I think it's good.....and I'm proud that "God" is written on my money.

I think if you are too stupid to know how a ballot works, I don't want you deciding who should be running the most powerful nation in the world for the next four years.

I dislike those people standing in the intersections trying to sell me stuff or trying to guilt me into making "donations" to their cause.


I believe that it doesn't take a village to raise a child, it takes two parents.


And what is going on with gas prices...again?


I believe "illegal" is illegal no matter what the lawyers think.

I believe the American flag should be the only one allowed in AMERICA!


If this makes me a BAD American, then yes, I'm a BAD American.


If you are a BAD American too, please forward this to everyone you know.
We want our country back!


________________________________

First off, I do agree with a few points. But would you consider this a "Bad American" or possibly a typical American? I feel as if certain people are turning this country into an 8-year-old boy's tree house where no girls are allowed. (Just replace "girls" with foreigners.) Is this country, for the most part xenophobic? Has patriotism turned into hatred of outsiders?

Head Cheese & Chicken Feet

Balladeer
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Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA


1 posted 03-23-2007 11:49 AM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

* deleted *

[This message has been edited by Balladeer (03-24-2007 12:18 PM).]

Local Rebel
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since 12-21-1999
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Southern Abstentia


2 posted 03-23-2007 02:32 PM       View Profile for Local Rebel   Email Local Rebel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Local Rebel

http://www.georgecarlin.com/home/home.html
Edward Grim
Senior Member
since 12-18-2005
Posts 1112
Greenville, South Carolina


3 posted 03-23-2007 03:40 PM       View Profile for Edward Grim   Email Edward Grim   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Edward Grim's Home Page   View IP for Edward Grim

Oh deer,

  I suppose comprehension is at an all-time low.

"The 'American attitude' or yours, Ed?"

Let's think real hard now; I mean really try hard to think about this (I'll go slow). If I am criticizing this particular way of thinking... why would I, myself, have the same views I am criticizing? I am not Ouroboros; I'm not trying to swallow my other end. So to answer your painful question: No, this is not my attitude.

"Once again, disclaimer not withstanding, all you are capable of giving is your own opinion, without being able to label something an "American" problem."

Are we not in the Philosophy forum? Is a philosophy not one's investigation of truths as they see it? Is a philosophy not based entirely off one's opinions? Philosophies are not facts; they are opinions. If they were facts, we wouldn't have so many conflicting philosophies in this world would we? Who knows, maybe it'd be a happier place.

"I would be inclined to think that those points WOULD be the thinking of a "typical" American if I were so inclined as to attempt to speak for so many people."

Hold your horses chief. Didn't you chastise me for generalizing in my other thread? Wait, I think you did:

[speaking "in general" about the feelings of Americans.]

Don't be a hypocrite now. It's not very good for your argument (well I wouldn't call it an argument, more of a mini tirade).

I will tell you the ones I have a problem with:

1. I believe that if you are selling me a Big Mac, do it in English.

2. I don't hate the rich. I don't pity the poor.

3. I've never owned a slave, or was a slave! I haven't burned any witches or been persecuted by the Turks and neither have you! So, shut up already.

4. I believe if you don't like the way things are here, go back to where you came from and change your own country! This is AMERICA.

5. I think the cops have every right to shoot your sorry rear if you're running from them.

6. I believe the American flag should be the only one allowed in AMERICA!

Yes, I suppose I agree with the majority but these few were enough for me to mention it.

I'll go through it with you.

1. Is English the official language of America? No. Does America have an official language? NO.

2. Maybe he's right; #2 doesn't sound pompous at all. I guess charities are just scams. I'm glad to know he doesn't care about those less fortunate than him.

3. So we just ignore the problems of other people? Are we not obligated to help fellow humans?

4. So nothing is wrong with America? We have no problems here? So America can't be improved? I beg to differ.

5. Sounds like instructions from the Gestapo.

6. This point can even be related to my V.I.P. post. No flags means no other countries are "allowed" in.

I enjoyed your paragraph on the fall of Rome. But tell me Balla, how did America come to be? Did a bunch of people from the same place hop on a boat and land here? No, people from pretty much every country came here. This country was built on "the assimilation of so many different peoples and cultures." People tend to forget that.

"but it's certainly not the country's"

There you go speaking for the entire country again. See, all I did was ask the question. You however answered for the entire nation. tsk tsk tsk.


_____________________

Reb,

Thanks for pointing that out that it wasn't Carlin's email. In my mind, it doesn't really matter who wrote it but just the fact that it was written. Thanks again.

Head Cheese & Chicken Feet

Balladeer
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since 06-05-99
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Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA


4 posted 03-24-2007 11:02 AM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Typical, I suppose, for a response from you. Why am I not surprised? Thanks for going slow...which tells me about as much as your personality as I care to know.

Have a good life...

[This message has been edited by Balladeer (03-24-2007 11:45 AM).]

Essorant
Member Elite
since 08-10-2002
Posts 4689
Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada


5 posted 03-24-2007 12:52 PM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

Despite popular usage, "American" is a continental word, not a national word, that literally means and belongs not specifically to any nation, but to all nations and people in and of America/Americas just as "Canadian" literally means and belongs to anyone in or of Canada, not just someone in or of the province of Alberta.  It is logical:  Europe = European, America(s) = American, Canada = Canadian.  

When is United States going to get a national word for their people instead of usurping our continental word?

Ron
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Member Rara Avis
since 05-19-99
Posts 9708
Michigan, US


6 posted 03-24-2007 01:48 PM       View Profile for Ron   Email Ron   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Ron's Home Page   View IP for Ron

quote:
In my mind, it doesn't really matter who wrote it but just the fact that it was written.

That's sloppy thinking again, Edward. If it doesn't matter, then let's just all agree, since you posted it, you must have written it. Oops. That makes your subsequent points a little awkward, though?

Of course it matters who wrote it. It certainly matters to George Carlin. And the very fact that the author didn't want his own name associated with it tells us a lot about the writer AND more than a little about what he wrote. You might as well be arguing about something written on a bathroom wall.

Oh, and Essorant? You really need to start using a good dictionary. It's the authority on what words mean, you know?  Not Essorant.
Essorant
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since 08-10-2002
Posts 4689
Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada


7 posted 03-24-2007 03:06 PM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

I find myself a better "tool"
When Webster makes itself a fool!

Stephanos
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since 07-31-2000
Posts 3496
Statesboro, GA, USA


8 posted 03-24-2007 08:32 PM       View Profile for Stephanos   Email Stephanos   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Stephanos's Home Page   View IP for Stephanos

That's a tad conceited don't you think?  Webster's tends to list ALL popular usages of a word.  The fact that they don't list private modifications of language, doesn't make them foolish.  Nor does it justify you using such inventions and expecting others to accept "new" meanings.  


Of course the origin itself may have been just as arbitary ... only probably not as consciously executed.  


Stephen.
Edward Grim
Senior Member
since 12-18-2005
Posts 1112
Greenville, South Carolina


9 posted 03-24-2007 08:37 PM       View Profile for Edward Grim   Email Edward Grim   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Edward Grim's Home Page   View IP for Edward Grim

Dear Deer,

Sorry I proved you wrong. I'm not gonna say I didn't mean to because I did. I was looking to discuss it but I think you had other ideas. Interesting that you deleted your post though. I guess I could say that that is typical for someone who doesn't want to admit when they're wrong. And that my friend "tells me about as much as your personality as I care to know."

And danke, I shall have a good life. You too.

______________________


Ron I see your point. When I said it didn't matter, I meant that I didn't care if George Carlin, George Lopez, George Bush or George Washington wrote it; but that someone did write it. I do see the flaw in that though and no mate, I didn't pen this. Thanks

Head Cheese & Chicken Feet

Essorant
Member Elite
since 08-10-2002
Posts 4689
Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada


10 posted 03-25-2007 04:19 AM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

"The fact that they don't list private modifications of language, doesn't make them foolish. "

Actually I meant the inclusion of this usage in Webster's.  I would say the same too about my countrymen if they were saying "American" selfcenteredly to mean "of Canada/Canadian" instead of "of America/Americas (including Canada and all other American nations.) American literally betokens of America/Americas, not just of Canada or United States.  This is fastened in the literary aspect of the word.  It says "America" not "United States"  "America" doesn't literally mean "United States", otherwise United States of America would mean "United States of United States".

Ringo
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Saluting with misty eyes


11 posted 03-25-2007 10:09 AM       View Profile for Ringo   Email Ringo   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Ringo

There are a few of these "bad American" Traits that I agree with, and a few that I disagree with.
Let's look at them in turn, and my reasonings why:
Agreed:
I believe the money I make belongs to me and my family, not some mid level governmental functionary be it Democratic or Republican!
I am willing to pay some in taxes.. you don't kill the goose that laid the Golden Egg, and America is just that goose (imho)

I think owning a gun doesn't make you a killer, it makes you a smart American.
I agree and disagree with this. I do own a weapon, and I dag-gone sure know how to use it; however, no one else in this house knows where it is, and if they were to find it, would have to get through the security system in place to get to it, and then would have to find the rounds for it (also secured) in order to use it on me, themselves, or someone else. Owning a weapon does not make you smart, if you aren't a smart owner.

I think being a minority does not make you noble or victimized, and does not entitle you to anything.
How loud can I cheer for this one? We are ALL minorities in some manner. Although, individually, a given "minority" might not be that large a percentage of the population, the "minorities" make up the bulk of the population. That makes the caucasions in this country a minority.. where is my money/college grants/special programs/jobs for me being a minority?

I believe that if you are selling me a Big Mac, do it in English.
While there might not be an "official" language, the language of the people is the language spoken by most of the people. If I were to immigrate to, say, Sweden, which has no official language, I would be expected to learn to speak the language of the people as to more efficiently communicate with the majoority of the population, and so I might secure employment to feed myself and my family. The same should be expected from everyone who comes here, whether it is with our permission or as a criminal.

I believe everyone has a right to pray to his or her God when and where they want to.
Then, again, there are people who will fully support my right to this, as long as I am exercising that right with the diety of their choice in the manner in which they believe is best.

My heroes are John Wayne, Babe Ruth, Roy Rogers, and whoever canceled Jerry Springer.
Well, John Wayne, Clint Eastwood, those ho lead knowing they will be slaughtered in the press, those who stand up for the rights of themselves and others- even when they know they are going to get massacred by the liberals who feel they are being mean-spirited and cruel (no, not all liberals), and anyone who puts themselves into harms way for someone else.

I don't hate the rich. I don't pity the poor.
I pity the poor children who are there for no reason of their own, and those who continually try to relieve themselves of being poor, yet somehow cannot seem to get beyond.

I've never owned a slave, or was a slave! I haven't burned any witches or been persecuted by the Turks and neither have you!
And I don't owe you a damned thing because you're ancestors were affected.

I want to know which church it is exactly where the Reverend Jesse Jackson (and Al Sharpton)preaches, where he gets his money, and why he is always part of the problem and not the solution. Can I get an AMEN on that one?
AMEN

I also think they have the right to pull you over if you're breaking the law, regardless of what color you are.

And, no, I don't mind having my face shown on my drivers license. I think it's good.....and I'm proud that "God" is written on my money.

I think if you are too stupid to know how a ballot works, I don't want you deciding who should be running the most powerful nation in the world for the next four years.


I believe "illegal" is illegal no matter what the lawyers think.

I believe the American flag should be the only one allowed in AMERICA!


Disagree:
I know wrestling is fake and I don't waste my time watching or arguing about it.
I actually participate as a professional wrestling manager, and have been hit with chairs, and have been injured, and all of that. It is phoney, but the injuries these entertainers sustain is not fake.

I believe if you don't like the way things are here, go back to where you came from and change your own country! This is AMERICA.
Change is the meaning of life. If you are not changing, then you are not growing. If you are wanting to make a change for the betterment of the entire population, and not just your little selfishness, then it doesn't matter who you are, or where you are from. If you are tearing down an American flag flying oiver and American Post Office to burn it and fly your Mexican flag over it, and then beat any white folks you see to prove your point, then take your ignorant backside back South.

I dislike those people standing in the intersections trying to sell me stuff or trying to guilt me into making "donations" to their cause.
The local fire and ambulance companies are ALL volunteer and do this to help raise funds for their stations. I figure that if I give them a buck or two to keep them solvent, and they rescue my son and daughter one night, then I got more than my money's worth.

I believe that it doesn't take a village to raise a child, it takes two parents.
And what happens when those two parents cannot be there? Yes, my parents raised me, and did a fine job according to most sources... however, they had every adult in the neighborhood acting as their intelligence agents, and acting as their surrogates when they weren't at the exact place I was screwing up at the exact moment I was doing it.

And what is going on with gas prices...again?
Capitalism. That is what this country was founded on.


Anynow... just my thoughts, you are welkcome to agree or disagree... that is what is great about a democratic republic.


What would you attempt to do...if you knew you could not fail?.
www.myspace.com/mindlesspoet

Susan Caldwell
Member Rara Avis
since 12-27-2002
Posts 8464
Florida


12 posted 03-25-2007 11:52 AM       View Profile for Susan Caldwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Susan Caldwell

wow....what Ringo said..

"too bad ignorance isn't painful"
~Unknown~

Huan Yi
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since 10-12-2004
Posts 6334
Waukegan


13 posted 03-25-2007 04:12 PM       View Profile for Huan Yi   Email Huan Yi   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Huan Yi

.


Someone once said that there could be no America
without Americans, and if it was such a bad place
versus anywhere else there wouldnít be so many
wanting and trying to get and stay here.

Americans seem so susceptible to guilt
itís sometimes surprising the Pope isnít President.


.
 
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