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Passions in Poetry

Life in Material Objects

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Essorant
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since 08-10-2002
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Regina, Saskatchewan; Canada


0 posted 09-10-2006 08:45 PM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

Do you think material objects or "phenomena" may be alive in a certain way?  Does a special heirloom have a certain kind of life in it?  Does a poem itself have some life?  An engagement ring?  The sky? A storm in the sky?  A cloud?  What do you think?

iliana
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since 12-05-2003
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USA


1 posted 09-10-2006 09:06 PM       View Profile for iliana   Email iliana   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for iliana

Baruch Spinoza (1632-1677) - http://www.philosophypages.com/hy/4h.htm#god

"What is more, god is a being with infinitely many attributes, each of which is itself infinite, upon which no limits of any kind can be imposed. So Spinoza argued that infinite substance must be indivisible, eternal, and unitary. There can be only one such substance, "god or nature," in which everything else is wholly contained. Thus, Spinoza is an extreme monist, for whom "Whatever is, is in god." Every mind and every body, every thought and every movement, all are nothing more than aspects of the one true being. Thus, god is an extended as well as a thinking substance."

If Spinoza's philosophy is true, then I would say, Yes.  
JesusChristPose
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since 06-21-2005
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2 posted 09-10-2006 11:10 PM       View Profile for JesusChristPose   Email JesusChristPose   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JesusChristPose

"Do you think material objects or "phenomena" may be alive in a certain way?"

~ Absolutely not. They are not alive.

"Does a special heirloom have a certain kind of life in it?"

~ No.

"Does a poem itself have some life?  An engagement ring?  The sky? A storm in the sky?  A cloud?  What do you think?"

~ No.

"Melvin, the best thing you got going for you is your willingness to humiliate yourself."

Local Rebel
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since 12-21-1999
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Southern Abstentia


3 posted 09-10-2006 11:50 PM       View Profile for Local Rebel   Email Local Rebel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Local Rebel

There are certainly many pantheist religions in the world that would tend to the affirmative -- Shinto, Zen, Tao, Buddhism,  others too..Joseph Smith wrote of Adam hearing the Earth speak..

Physics also would tend to categorize us all as different tributaries of the same gravity well -- but would come up short of catogorizing the inanimate as animate.
icebox
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since 05-03-2003
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in the shadows


4 posted 09-11-2006 01:42 PM       View Profile for icebox   Email icebox   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for icebox

Pity the man who believes only in what he has seen.
JesusChristPose
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since 06-21-2005
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Pittsburgh, Pa


5 posted 09-11-2006 06:09 PM       View Profile for JesusChristPose   Email JesusChristPose   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JesusChristPose

"Pity the man who believes only in what he has seen."

~ Yes, I agree.  

"Melvin, the best thing you got going for you is your willingness to humiliate yourself."

kif kif
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since 06-01-2006
Posts 431
BCN


6 posted 09-18-2006 04:25 AM       View Profile for kif kif   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for kif kif

At first reading, I wouldn't class a man-made object like an heirloom or a ring with the sky, although our desire/love is poured into all these things, thus creating movements within them.

The sky was there to begin with, we just tamper with it.
Some man-made objects are made from man-made materials that wouldn't exist unless we desired to create something, remembering that everything material was drawn from the natural earth to begin with,(so perhaps the sky is akin to a ring) Yet, what about plastic things, like vinyl records? Sonic beauty encrypted within, but on the surface, a blight to the environment.). We've just mixed it up, like an artist's palette (albeit an environmentally unfriendly one), so I'd offer my opinion as yes.
mostlikelytolie
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since 09-20-2006
Posts 5


7 posted 09-20-2006 03:53 PM       View Profile for mostlikelytolie   Email mostlikelytolie   Edit/Delete Message     View IP for mostlikelytolie

But, Could you also argue that humans themselves also 'man made' objects? (well, all excepting those who came first, whether they're adam & eve or whomever you believe in) And therefore, wouldn't you be putting us in with objects, who would therefore not have a life either?...and also, I would like to point out that if I carried a teddy bear with me every where I went, and I lived a VERY fruitful life, skydiving, travelling, romance, parenthood, off to war even, wouldn't I be able to say that my teddy bear has lived a more fulfilling life than a man who did nothing of extraodinary? If Martin Luther King wore the same tie every day of his adult life, wouldn't that tie have seen much more of a life than a woman who barely ever left her house? Something to think about...

kif kif
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since 06-01-2006
Posts 431
BCN


8 posted 09-22-2006 02:15 AM       View Profile for kif kif   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for kif kif

I would say that humans are natural to the earth, like a bush that's selfing and becoming weird-looking---sweeping, I know, but your tie question's got me dizzy.

Tie's have no life-line, as somewhere along it's branches of production, the pulse was probably severed by using *unfair labour (perhaps if it was lovingly hand-made, especially for the wearer, it might have a life?) I take it back. Life, as in continuing vibrations that can be measured(?), are found in things that grow. *Would that include money? A sobering thought. I suppose it depends on what value we put on it. So, I think we're just making it all up as we go along, loving ourselves (and teddy!) (or not loving, as with your housebound woman.)

(*Obviously, I'd say no, because of my unfair labour comment.)

I believe that to find love and life in money means being deluded, so I'll have to back up even farther...sometimes, our idea of value is misguided.

[This message has been edited by kif kif (09-22-2006 04:27 AM).]

Brian James
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since 06-26-2005
Posts 147
Winnipeg


9 posted 09-28-2006 12:41 AM       View Profile for Brian James   Email Brian James   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Brian James

If your question is, "can we find creative ways of re-defining words like 'Life' so that their significance is expanded beyond meanings that are purely scientific or conventional," then my answer is "yes."  

"To me, the thing that art does for life is to clean it, to strip it to form."
~Robert Frost

Stephanos
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since 07-31-2000
Posts 3496
Statesboro, GA, USA


10 posted 09-28-2006 03:35 PM       View Profile for Stephanos   Email Stephanos   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Stephanos's Home Page   View IP for Stephanos

Brian,

I could be wrong, but I think Essorant may be edging toward some kind of pantheism, rather than descriptive creativity.  


Stephen.  
 
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