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Antony Flew the Theist

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Brad
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since 08-20-99
Posts 5896
Jejudo, South Korea


50 posted 01-04-2005 05:36 PM       View Profile for Brad   Email Brad   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Brad

I'm going to have to pick and choose for a couple of days:

quote:
Morality itself is no longer an end, but a means to an end, as easily shed as a cumbersome tail, or a third leg.  Moral innovation is permitted, whether individual or corporate.  And egoism doesn't really save the day, in my view.



quote:
Someone who fears and respects the judgement of God against murder, typically has more of an aversion to murder than someone who doesn't.  A man who feels he will lose tenfold for stealing, doesn't steal as much.  Likewise a man who feels certain that good behavior will be in some way rewarded, will be more likely to act in a good way rather than not.


You don't see the problem? The only way a morality can be an end in itself is by choosing to live morally. Fear of retribution or anticipation of reward is morality as means to an end.  
Stephanos
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since 07-31-2000
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Statesboro, GA, USA


51 posted 01-08-2005 12:24 AM       View Profile for Stephanos   Email Stephanos   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Stephanos's Home Page   View IP for Stephanos

Brad,

As I recall, Behe wasn't referring to how the stereo works, but rather to how it was made.  Plugging a tuner, CD player, and speakers together might simplistically answer the first question, but not the second.  

In short, he was saying that in earlier times science only presented (due to ignorance) the cell as a kind of "black box".  Therefore the earlier scientific authorities (confident of Darwinistic explanation) gave answers to the "how" which were akin to saying that a stereo is made by connecting unit A to unit B, etc ..., when the real problem was about making those systems which are hid behind the grey plastic boxes with "BOSE" on them.  His argument hinges on the complexity and specificity of biological systems.  That's for a whole other thread.  And that's really not what I'm here to argue now.  But I just wanted you to keep the context right when quoting him, to be fair.    


I'll try address your other points soon maybe.


PS,

Brad, I'm glad you told me that was your daughter.  I thought maybe you were really upset at someone named "Freddy".   $#@!


Or either your were trying to express your deconstructionism in a more vivid way.





Stephen.
Brad
Member Ascendant
since 08-20-99
Posts 5896
Jejudo, South Korea


52 posted 01-08-2005 12:42 AM       View Profile for Brad   Email Brad   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Brad

Ah, take your time. I'm done with your points yet. You can let me finish and then you can spend two or three weeks responding to me.

 
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