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Switching

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Brad
Member Ascendant
since 08-20-99
Posts 5896
Jejudo, South Korea


0 posted 11-26-1999 05:16 AM       View Profile for Brad   Email Brad   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Brad

Just read this:

Whenever the refinement of luxury has reached a high point, the woman shows herself well-behaved only by compulsion, and makes no secret in wishing that she might rather be a man, so that she could give larger and freer playing room to her inclinations; no man, however, would want to be a woman.

--Kant

Now besides the fact that this is a great example that even great thinkers say some really stupid things, what does everybody else think? If you're a man, would you want to be woman? If you're a woman, would you want to be a man?

How about if it was only for one month?

Brad
Nan
Administrator
Member Seraphic
since 05-20-99
Posts 24426
Cape Cod Massachusetts USA


1 posted 11-26-1999 07:44 AM       View Profile for Nan   Email Nan   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Nan's Home Page   View IP for Nan

I just Kant imagine such egocentrism - First, what does "refinement of luxury" have to do with gender? Secondly, women already give boundless free playing room to our inclinations. We even (so I'm told) make up our own rules as we go along... Why would we want to change that????
Poet deVine
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 05-26-99
Posts 25869
Hurricane Alley


2 posted 11-26-1999 09:36 AM       View Profile for Poet deVine   Email Poet deVine   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Poet deVine

A month? Yes. I would like it for a month..may I choose the man I'd like to be? Will I remember what occurred during that time? If so, then I'd like to be Ron. Imagine...the computer wizardry I could learn ... that alone would be worth it!

If I can't choose, then ok..I'll still do it.

I think Kant was right! After all, he lived in the late 1700's when women were not allowed to have inclinations, let alone learn what the word meant!

[This message has been edited by Poet deVine (edited 11-26-1999).]
Angel Rand
Member
since 09-04-99
Posts 140
London UK, and Zurich Switzerl


3 posted 11-26-1999 10:26 AM       View Profile for Angel Rand   Email Angel Rand   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Angel Rand

Kant could not have a philosophy more contrary to mine. But in this instance and considering how women were treated and regarded back in his time I would say he is right. Men enjoyed all the freedom and women had more or less none. Were I born in such a time I too would want to be a man. I have the strong suspicion that, had I been born even as recently back as the the last century, I would have been considered suffragette
Nowadays hmm well, when I was a little girl I occasionally wanted to be a boy cause I envied them that they did not have to run home from the playground each time they needed the loo LOL. Does that count?
Angel

------------------
"I swear -- by my life and by my love of it -- that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine." Ayn Rand, Atlas Shrugged
"Any alleged "right" of one man, which necessitates the violation of the rights of another, is not and cannot be a right." Ayn Rand

Alicat
Member Elite
since 05-23-99
Posts 4277
Coastal Texas


4 posted 11-26-1999 12:49 PM       View Profile for Alicat   Email Alicat   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Alicat

Um...no thanks. I'm rather happy being male...and being a touch empathic, I will often pick up on my female friends troubles. Like migraines, cramps, sore feet, tired backs...in short, everything to a degree. And having felt the merest tip of the iceberg, I find that I am just not egosado/masochistic enough to do that to myself. If I were meant to be female, then my dad could have seen to giving me the X instead of the Y chromosome.

Alicat
Brad
Member Ascendant
since 08-20-99
Posts 5896
Jejudo, South Korea


5 posted 11-27-1999 12:45 AM       View Profile for Brad   Email Brad   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Brad

I'm a bit surprized by the responses so far (except Nan's) I would definitely like to give it a shot.

I remember having a conversation with a Japanese grandmother who was complaining about modern women for their lack of responsibility. As she made very clear, women are the one's who do the real work. She said men weren't worth very much (there're always going to be little boys or something to that effect) but without women, society would crumble.

Give me month, I say.
Poet deVine
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since 05-26-99
Posts 25869
Hurricane Alley


6 posted 11-27-1999 11:05 AM       View Profile for Poet deVine   Email Poet deVine   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Poet deVine

Brad, I think you're going to be the exception instead of the rule here..what man would want to work 8 hours a day, come home, fix the evening meal, take care of the kids and the spouse (who's ranting and raving because he can't get his 1982 Chevy truck fixed)....then try to find some time to read, take a bath or just relax.

I know a lot of couple divide all this now - the age of women's lib has seen that, but I think it's still considered a man's world.

Nicole
Senior Member
since 06-23-99
Posts 1896
Florida


7 posted 11-27-1999 12:06 PM       View Profile for Nicole   Email Nicole   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Nicole

A month? You bet.
Trevor
Senior Member
since 08-12-99
Posts 744
Canada


8 posted 11-28-1999 01:46 AM       View Profile for Trevor   Email Trevor   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Trevor

Sign me up for a switch....just for a month though....it would be a little creepy yet exhilarating at the same time.....I'd also need to have a complete hormonal/brain pattern change with that too or else I'd have to be a lesbian, that doesn't sound bad though......I've always wondered what a woman's orgasm feels like, what sensations come from having a vagina.... I'd like to actually be a whole different person for a month....to percieve the world through someone else's eyes would be fascinating... or an animal for a day and look into their world.

So yeah, sign me up Dr. Frankenstien....I'll try your little experiment....and if I didn't like it I could just sit around and play with my new breasts until I switched back....
Angel Rand
Member
since 09-04-99
Posts 140
London UK, and Zurich Switzerl


9 posted 11-28-1999 02:45 PM       View Profile for Angel Rand   Email Angel Rand   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Angel Rand

Trevor ROFL!!!
jbouder
Member Elite
since 09-18-99
Posts 2641
Whole Sort Of Genl Mish Mash


10 posted 11-29-1999 12:19 PM       View Profile for jbouder   Email jbouder   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for jbouder

I'm with Trevor, but I would never admit to it in public.

------------------
Jim

"If I rest, I rust." -Martin Luther

TomMark
Member Elite
since 07-27-2007
Posts 2111
LA,CA


11 posted 01-10-2008 02:53 PM       View Profile for TomMark   Email TomMark   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for TomMark

no need to switch. You may just pretend as a woman to write a poem. Then you will say, "wow, SHE indeed is in me" when you think that a woman is different from a man by your definition. No doubt you hold the classical view of different  Genders.

oceanvu2
Senior Member
since 02-24-2007
Posts 1007
Santa Monica, California, USA


12 posted 01-10-2008 03:05 PM       View Profile for oceanvu2   Email oceanvu2   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for oceanvu2

Man or woman, what's the diff?
They're variations on a riff.
I figure that we'd all be fine
By signing in as androgyne.

Jim --  I'll admit to anything in public.  It's the things I don't admit privately that get get me into trouble.

The other Jim
Susan Caldwell
Member Rara Avis
since 12-27-2002
Posts 8464
Florida


13 posted 01-10-2008 03:18 PM       View Profile for Susan Caldwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Susan Caldwell

Sign me up for six months!! I need the rest!

"too bad ignorance isn't painful"
~Unknown~

XOx Uriah xOX
Senior Member
since 02-11-2006
Posts 1398
Virginia


14 posted 01-10-2008 03:37 PM       View Profile for XOx Uriah xOX   Email XOx Uriah xOX   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for XOx Uriah xOX


::shrugs::    I am unable to see one without the other.

seed and fruition    

promise and fulfillment

acorn...tree...acorn

They are the same

(((they)))    fun thought

::shrugs::
oceanvu2
Senior Member
since 02-24-2007
Posts 1007
Santa Monica, California, USA


15 posted 01-10-2008 04:53 PM       View Profile for oceanvu2   Email oceanvu2   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for oceanvu2

Susan -- I'd offer to swap with ya, but I don't know that my being a care giver 24/7 is much different from your being a caregiver 24/7, or anyone elses.

Plus, I take full responsibility for everything which happens in the universe, and I suspect you do too!  Not an easy job, but somebody has to do it.  Maybe we can just stay where we are and agree to share the burden.

Best, Jim
Susan Caldwell
Member Rara Avis
since 12-27-2002
Posts 8464
Florida


16 posted 01-10-2008 06:19 PM       View Profile for Susan Caldwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Susan Caldwell

Ah Jim, you made me smile.

"too bad ignorance isn't painful"
~Unknown~

rwood
Member Elite
since 02-29-2000
Posts 3797
Tennessee


17 posted 01-10-2008 07:29 PM       View Profile for rwood   Email rwood   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for rwood

quote:
Whenever the refinement of luxury has reached a high point, the woman shows herself well-behaved only by compulsion, and makes no secret in wishing that she might rather be a man, so that she could give larger and freer playing room to her inclinations; no man, however, would want to be a woman.



Ha. Pshaw. Who's well-behaved by compulsion?

One of the highest points I ever had in my life was when I finally got over the lowlife I chained myself to. I was completely compelled to soak his underwear in bleach each day (light rinse) and teach him a quiet lesson about cheating. He was allergic to bleach. Poor thing in his nice clean tidy-whites. Nothing a big tube of rash cream wouldn't cure, after a few weeks, the first time...not so much the second. By the third time, I think it might have fell off. I dunno. I'm sure he wished for "larger" and "freer" Fruit of the Looms to help house his "inclinations."

Pure luxury, bleach is.

I'm quite happy with my own sense of refinement and feel no desire to switch.

 
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