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Bumper Sticker Brains
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Bumper Sticker Brains |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia 
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quote: not the facts ma'am, anything but the facts..... apologies to Joe Friday |
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Uncas Member
since 2010-07-30
Posts 408 |
That's a bit of a stretch LR, the quote was that they didn't want too many facts not that they didn't want any facts at all. I think there are definitely some advantages to having short bumper sticker type facts that folk who aren't particularly interested in politics can understand but at the same time they need to be backed up by in-depth essay type information because some stuff can't be communicated in a short catchy slogan. The devil is in the detail. I've been following the race closely, it's raises all sorts of interesting questions for an outsider like me looking in. For instance why is Romney suffering because he's revised his opinion on certain subjects, his opponents frame it as 'flip-flopping' and a bad trait but isn't changing your mind when you think you've made a mistake a good thing. After all don't they put erasers on pencils for a very good reason.  |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
True enough. Facts are overrated. That's why the democratic machine will go after every republican front runner with every possible thing they can dig up in an effort to avoid the fact of Obama's failed economic policies. This should come as no surprise to you, reb. Do a commercial of soap bubbles sliding down the body of Jennifer Lopez and put it against a commercial of a scientist commenting on the ingredients of another soap, detailing how it is logically more beneficial to your body and see which soap sells the most. That's the way it is.. |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
An insufficient number of facts is simply propaganda. Its also the opposite of the truth, the WHOLE truth, and nothing but the truth. That would make a good bumper sticker? No? |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
Mike. That would be a silly thing for a Democratic machine to do. It would, logically, hold its' powder for late in the General Election, you know, when Democrats actually have a dog in the hunt. |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Then why are they doing it? They don't need, or want, to wait if they see a candidate they consider dangerous to Obama, like Cain. Nip him in the bud is much more effective. |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
A 'vast left wing conspiracy' Mike? hmmm, that reminds me of the devil with a blue dress........ I notice that it's your post that brings this up though.... some reason you want to discuss this instead of the thread subject? |
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Uncas Member
since 2010-07-30
Posts 408 |
quote: I agree, if you just throw out one fact without backing it up it can be a form of propaganda, especially if the fact is dubious, which is why credible politicians (if such an animal exists) should have both - a bumper sticker intro and an in-depth essay type back up. The Republicans, in my opinion, tend to be good at the bumper sticker stuff - the Democrats seem to try too hard to give all the facts, good if you want the whole truth as they see it but bad if your audience has a short attention span. Or as the guy in your post put it - "In politics, a bumper sticker always beats an essay". If he dropped the 'always' or replaced it with 'generally' I'd have to agree with the statement. . |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
Its not so much about not backing up the bumper sticker. Propaganda is using the truth to tell the lie you want to tell. For instance, that the 'flat' tax is fair because it fits on a bumper sticker. The health care reform act is bad because it's long. Rich people create jobs because they are the ones with the money. Or, if we're going to apply it to what Mike dragged in-- that woman is lying because she took money. Or, strangely, that other woman is lying because she never asked for money. Or maybe Cain's best, the billions of women he never harrassed proves he never harrassed any woman....or as is more the case, sexually assaulted. |
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Uncas Member
since 2010-07-30
Posts 408 |
Again LR I sort of agree with you but the difference is that I don't see your example bumper sticker facts as true examples of the type of stuff I was suggesting should be put out there by politicians. At best the examples you gave are claims not facts. quote: But propaganda is only propaganda when you're outside looking in, if someone tells you what you want to hear or confirms what you already think it's simply preaching to the choir. That's a good political tactic but only if your base is large enough, it's a dangerous tactic if you need to sway independents or swing voters though. They're the ones who need depth to be convinced but they're not averse to being convinced if the bumper sticker catches their attention. That's where both the Democrats and Republicans generally fall down, Dems tend to have the in-depth stuff sorted but lack a unified rallying strap line. The Republicans have a single strap line they all quote in unison but they stumble when asked to go beyond the bumper sticker rhetoric. That's a bit of a generalisation, sometimes it's the other way around and in very rare cases, Obama's election campaign for instance, they get both messages right. . |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
Sure, that's the nature of propaganda.... its claims, fueled by a fact.... the health care bill is long....we know you don't like to read boring stuff so we'll just point out how bad it is to be long in and of itself. And, propaganda is ALWAYS a two way street... the person who buys the lie wants the lie. You can't build a nation of people who hate jews out of people who love jews. And you'll get no arguement from me that there is no Democratic version of Frank Luntz, but, that's because Democrats, for the most part, aren't interested in talking points and can smell them in a hermetically sealed container buried a hundred feet underground. Isn't it, after all, the conservatives cheif complaint about OWS that they don't have a bumper sticker, and isn't it OWS that keeps saying they don't want one? Ed Rogers earns his money by knowing this, and, as he pointed out in his blog, Republicans are heirarchical and fall in line, thats what slogans are designed to do. |
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Uncas Member
since 2010-07-30
Posts 408 |
quote: But isn't that a major problem? One I pointed out earlier - Democrats are the choir not the target audience, if you're the Democrats going after independents you need a hook to get them interested and if you're going for Republicans you definitely need to brush up on your bumper sticker slogans. Surely it's what they like that should matter. . |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
Counter 'drill baby drill' with 'blow wind blow'? Solar energy here, solar energy now? smaller carbon footprints! enhance revenues, don't cut medicaid universal health care! hug a tree! any of those working for you Mike? |
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Uncas Member
since 2010-07-30
Posts 408 |
This one might get his attention LR: Record number of illegal immigrants deported in 2011 It also happens to be true. |
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Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
OK, back again. LR, I guess I changed the subject unknowingly because I really didn't understand what the subject was. I assumed it was about Republicans using "bumper sticker" mentality and my point was that that was exactly what Dems were doing with reference to trying to bring Cain down. Pardon me if it came across as a deviation. Bumper stickers? No, your examples don't have any pizazz at all. Expand your horizons! Please Don't Tell Obama What Comes After a Trillion 1-20-2013 The End Of An Error And We Thought Carter Sucked! Because Everyone Else Deserves What You Worked For Honk If I'm Paying Your Mortgage Someone Please Put The Constitution on His Telepromptor |
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Bob K Member Elite
since 2007-11-03
Posts 4208 |
I don't know the Democrats are trying to bring Mr. Cain down. I for one would welcome having Mr. Cain as an opponent in the presidential election. I think that He makes President Obama looks thoughtful and statemanlike. Please, Pease, please run Mr. Cain. I was citizen of Massachusetts when Mr. Romney was Governor. He was nowhere near liberal enough for my tastes, but that should be a plus for the Republicans. The problem is that he helped get a health care program through that he doesn't know exactly how to deal with on the national level. More conservative Republicans revile him for it, and that may be a serious problem for his nomination, and it may hurt his ability to get Republican support nationally. Republicans on the whole may have trouble trusting anything he says about what his plans are for the White House, and I remember all too clearly that he was not good for social services in Massachusetts outside that health care program, which I thought weak. I am also unsure what his notions are about the need to regulate any of the business interests that seem to be attempting to run the political interests of the country as though they were the same as the economic interests of the country. There may be times this is so; but there may also be times when it isn't so. This may in fact be one of the major problems with the political dialogue in the country right now as a whole. The substitution of slogan for education and thought and research has become a serious problem. The best I ever saw was by Pope, and it was great because it requited a small personal swacrifice as the price of admission. Modern examples are unwilling to require the like. I am His Majesty's Dog at Kew; I pray you, Sire, whose dog are you? |
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