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Passions in Poetry

What"s This Problem The Right WingWith Unions?

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Balladeer
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125 posted 04-04-2011 10:26 AM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Bob, the Republicans did not engage in anti-constitutional behavior. If you want to claim they did, cite chapter and verse, please.

If you want to give a pass for the union's intimidation tactics, go ahead. I recall you supported ACORN for using the same tactics to intimidate and browbeat banks to give out unsecured loans, which did very well for the housing industry, didn't it?

I cited what you asked for, clearly showiwng that their actions can be deemed illegal. If those are the kind of tactics you admire, then so be it.

We don't live in the age of the mafia protections rackets any longer and I don't think they will get away with it but, instead, will cause a further revolt against their revolting tactics.
Balladeer
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126 posted 04-04-2011 10:30 AM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

They apparently also believe that they can ignore an injunction

Are you referring to the Democrats ignoring the health care injunction or is it the offshore oil drilling injunction?
Bob K
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127 posted 04-04-2011 07:39 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     The Wisconsin courts issued injunctions against publication by the secretary of State of Wisconsin of the Law in Question and against it's going into effect.  The courts in Wisconsin have the power to do that.  Governor Walker had  another agency publish the law, which has no standing in Wisconsin law according to the Wisconsin Secretary of State, and also declared the Law in force, despite the injunction against it.

     Chapter and verse.

     Should you wish to talk about some non-Union subject, perhaps you might consider using another thread where the subject is not this Problem the Right Wing has with Unions.  It's difficult enough to get folks on the right to talk about the Unions at all, and using precious space devoted to that subject to discussion of oil seems a waste of time to me.

     I'd be thrilled, however, to join you in a thread devoted to oil and power.  Apparently the executives the Brought you the deaths on the Deepwater Horizon 11 of them and the worst oil disaster that i know of in history have just voted themselves  a stupendous executive bonus for, of all things, their wonderful safety record covering the time of the disaster.  So you see, there would be lots to discuss in that other thread about oil and injunctions and stuff like that.

     Simply not here, where we'd be giving more short shrift to Unions.  In my humble opinion, of course.
Balladeer
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128 posted 04-04-2011 07:57 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

You opened it, Bob. They apparently also believe that they can ignore an injunction

You decided to take a shot at republicans with that comment. It is fair game for me to point out that democrats have their own problems with regards to ignoring injunctions. Injunctions are legal rulings, regardless of the subject. You can't attack one party for ignoring them and excuse the other because it is more convenient for you to do so.
Bob K
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129 posted 04-05-2011 03:26 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     Only one of them falls inside the subject of "What's this problem the right wing has with Unions, however," and the other falls inside another subject area:  Say, the one we had going on oil wells not too long ago, where it would have fit in smoothly and not been a change of subject.  If you want to bring it over there, why not?  It might fit, and I might find it an interesting use of time, perhaps.

     Or perhaps there might be some way to bring it up here that makes it relevent to the discussion about Unions and the trouble the Right wing has in understanding the need that labor has in dealing with capital on a more equal footing in terms of power and money.  Certainly it seems understandable to me that when a political party and the people who provide most of the funding for that party the Republicans, in this case attack the ability of working folks to put bread on the table for themselves and their families, that those folks and the Unions that support them would be very unhappy and would wish to take action.  The fact thaty this action is both uncomfortable and effective should not be terribly surprising, and I frankly doubt that it is to the Republican donor base or to those in authority in the party itself.  There is a long history of the rhetoric being used, and the speaker you cite, the Republican state senator in Wisconsin, even makes reference to prior anti-union battles fought in the thirties, and not just in Wisconsin.  "Thugs" is one of everybody's favorite, left and right, and I'm not particularly surprised to hear it trotted out again.

     The man brings it up as though he hasn't just voted away collective bargaining rights from state workers, and as though he simply cannot understand why people might possibly be upset with him.  It may be that he has also helped vote a large tax cut for businesses first, which meant that he made the deficit problem considerably worse for the state before he took bargaining rights away from state workers, who had agreed not to press for any increase in wages or benefits and who were budget neutral.

     That's simply a wild guess, however.
Balladeer
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130 posted 04-05-2011 07:57 AM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Once again, it's just an example that, if the right does it, it's blasphemous and, if the left does it, it's excusable.

You want to excuse the left and the unions for illegal activities and tactics? No problem...that seems to be a defensive mindset used when nothing else is available.
Bob K
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131 posted 04-05-2011 02:44 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     Which activities have the Unions been enjoined from, here, Mike?

     Which activities have the Republicans been enjoined from, here, Mike?

     Let's keep this apples and apples, and not apples in Wisconsin and hypothetical oil wells in international waters in the Gulf of Mexico involving Multi-nationals and a national Government agency and possibly other parties, shall we?  

     The Unions have not be enjoined from any illegal activities, though the Republicans have growled and threatened.  If they can in fact make arrests and successfully press charges, then they should do so; and if they can convict on those charges, then they should do that as well.  There is a great deal of difference between smearing people with the threat, and making things stick, isn't there?  Certainly the Republicans have proven that they can destroy people and organizations with threats, distortions and outright lies and smears, as they have attempted to do even with some of their own party members from time to time, as they tried to do with Senator McCain, for example.  And as they did with their smear piece of ACORN by James O'Keefe.

     But it doesn't seem useful to cave in simply at the bluster and threat.  Especially when no charges have been laid against the Unions and when injunctions have been laid upon the Republicans, and Ignored.

quote:

You want to excuse the left and the unions for illegal activities and tactics?



     In this case, it seems the other way around.
Ron
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132 posted 04-05-2011 04:12 PM       View Profile for Ron   Email Ron   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Ron's Home Page   View IP for Ron

quote:
... as they have attempted to do even with some of their own party members from time to time, as they tried to do with Senator McCain, for example.  And as they did with their smear piece of ACORN by James O'Keefe.

And you're honestly worried about other people staying on topic, Bob?
Uncas
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133 posted 04-05-2011 06:00 PM       View Profile for Uncas   Email Uncas   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Uncas

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDSN1F72QU4

.
Bob K
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134 posted 04-05-2011 08:53 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K


     I'm trying to keep myself on topic.  The more distractions, the more difficulty I have, Ron.

     I suspect you may have noticed.

     Addressing them more directly speaks to the Poster and not to the issues involved, and I'm attempting to practice not addressing the Poster and limiting myself to the issues, hopefully with some success.  It is a skill I am attempting to acquire because it seems useful and "civic."

     I quote the poet James Welch here from one of his poems in Riding The Earthboy Forty  "Albert Heavy Runner was always civic.[/i]  It's been close to forty years, so I might have that a bit wrong.

     I am striving to be civic and to maintain my lively sense of fun and to keep myself on topic.
Ron
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135 posted 04-05-2011 09:54 PM       View Profile for Ron   Email Ron   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Ron's Home Page   View IP for Ron

quote:
I'm trying to keep myself on topic. The more distractions, the more difficulty I have, Ron.

LOL. Welcome to our glass house, Bob.

And I'm sure you know what they say about people who live in glass houses?
Bob K
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136 posted 04-05-2011 11:31 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     We shouldn't stow thrones?

      Stew tunes?

       Brew prunes?

       Something like that, isn't it?

     I feel fairly busy ducking to feel that I have all that much time to throw stones, truth be told.  In the ongoing conversation between drake and doctor, I'm never certain which side I'm taking.  The lines are so frequently indistinguishable.  Everytime I yell, "Duck!" somebody else seems to yell back "Quack!"  It's all very confusing.
 
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