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"The Illustrated Guide to GOP Scandals"

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Balladeer
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25 posted 08-06-2010 09:47 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Exactly what was Jennifer's smear, Mike?  



Bob, do you feel that Jenn is so inept she can't speak for herself? Isn't that white horse of yours tired yet? She is fully capable of speaking for herself and defending her actions, I'm sure, and yet is seems to be a passion of yours to rush to defend her, without even being asked, in multiple threads? DOn't worry. She is not in danger..
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26 posted 08-06-2010 10:25 PM       View Profile for JenniferMaxwell   Email JenniferMaxwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JenniferMaxwell

If you wish to point fingers at Bob, Balladeer, maybe you should start a thread for that purpose?
Ringo
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27 posted 08-06-2010 10:32 PM       View Profile for Ringo   Email Ringo   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Ringo

And once again, the only good word seems to be a smear word...

Let's see what you can do with these facts about the Bush, Jr administration, and see how they get spun into bad things...

1) Tax receipts grew more than $547 Billion in the years 2001-2007. He doubles the child tax credit to $1000 (The Dems only thought kids were worth $500). He also raised the tax burden on the top 10% from 67% to 70%.
Wait... I thought the rich got massive tax cuts and paid less?

2) Estimates from a 2007 Federal survey show that the number of uninsured children under the age of 18 actually declined by 800,000 from 2001 to 2007. From 2007 to 2008, the number of people covered by affordable and portable Health Savings Account-eligible plans increased 35 percent. Additionally, since President Bush took office, more than 1,200 community health centers have opened or expanded nationwide, which has helped provide treatment to nearly 17 million people.
But, I thought the Republicans wanted you to die quickly?

3) From 2001 to 2007, air pollution decreased by 12 percent, and fine particulate matter pollution is down 17 percent since 2001. Ethanol production quadrupled from 1.6 billion gallons in 2000 to 6.5 billion gallons in 2007, wind energy production has increased by more than 400 percent, and solar energy capacity has doubled. In 2007, solar installations increased more than 32 percent and the U.S. produced 96 percent more biodiesel (490 million gallons) than in 2006. The Administration also provided nearly $18 billion to research, develop, and promote alternative and more efficient energy technologies such as biofuels, solar, wind, clean coal, nuclear, and hydrogen.  
And the mean, mean Republicans, hate the environment and want you to all die of asthma

4) In 2003, the Administration began calling for a new GSE (Fannie and Freddie) regulator, and over the next five years, the Administration continued to call for GSE reform only to be accused by Democrats in Congress of creating artificial fears and advocating for ill-advised proposals. By the time Congress finally acted in 2008 to provide the oversight the President requested, it was too late to prevent systemic consequences.
Hello, Rep. Barney Frank of Massachusetts... you were screaming the loudest

5) President Bush provided more than 40 million Americans with better access to prescription drugs by creating the market-based Medicare Prescription Drug Benefit. And it is one of the rare government programs that actually costs less than expected. Projected overall program spending between 2004 and 2013 is approximately $240 billion lower, nearly 38 percent, than originally estimated, thanks to the market-oriented principles included at President Bush's insistence.
But, wait... I thought it was the Democrats who thought this stuff up?

6) Federal spending on education has increased nearly 40 percent under President Bush. Additionally, Pell Grant funding nearly doubled during the Administration, which is expected to help more than 5.5 million students attend college in the 2008-09 school year, 1.2 million more students than were assisted by Pell Grants in the 2001-02 school year. This financial aid assistance also helps account for the fact that 66 percent of high school graduates from the class of 2006 enrolled in colleges, compared to 63 percent in 2000.

7) Perhaps more importantly, the President's No Child Left Behind Act has delivered tangible results to students. Since the law was enacted, fourth-grade students have achieved their highest reading and math scores on record, eighth-grade students have achieved their highest math scores on record, and African-American and Hispanic students have posted all-time high scores in a number of categories, narrowing the gap between minority students and white students.
This can't be... Republicans only care about what's best for them, and hate anyone who is not a WASP

8) The President successfully pushed for expanding NATO membership, generated international pressure on Iran to stop it from developing nuclear weapons, and organized the Six-Party Talks, which have resulted in North Korea committing to give up its nuclear weapons and abandon its nuclear programs. Verifying North Korea's commitment will be a challenge, but at the most recent Six-Party Talks meeting, there was strong consensus among the five parties that North Korea must submit to a comprehensive verification regime that accords with international standards.
And, yet... during the current administration...

9) During the first 7 years of the Bush (Jr) administration, the American Economy enjoyed the longest period of job growth- 52 straight months with 8.3 million jobs produced.
With an additional 118,000 jobs lost last month

10) Some other items that are infrequently mentioned about the real record of the Bush Administration but are worth noting: Teenage drug use has declined 25 percent; in 2007, the violent crime rate was 43 percent lower than the rate in 1998; between 2005 and 2007, the chronically homeless population decreased approximately 30 percent; funding for veterans' medical care has increased more than 115 percent; and as of 2005, the most recent abortion rate is at its lowest since 1974.

Not too shabby for the... wait, what was it?... oh, yeah... the worst president in US History with the worst record, and who only cared for his rich friends and his buddies, and hated the "little people".

facts from various sources


Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting, "WHAT A RIDE
JenniferMaxwell
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28 posted 08-06-2010 10:46 PM       View Profile for JenniferMaxwell   Email JenniferMaxwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JenniferMaxwell

"the worst president in US History with the worst record, and who only cared for his rich friends and his buddies, and hated the "little people" - Ringo

Indeed, Ringo, a GOP scandal, one the whole world will never forget.
Bob K
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29 posted 08-07-2010 12:54 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



quote:

Exactly what was Jennifer's smear, Mike?  

Bob, do you feel that Jenn is so inept she can't speak for herself? Isn't that white horse of yours tired yet? She is fully capable of speaking for herself and defending her actions, I'm sure, and yet is seems to be a passion of yours to rush to defend her, without even being asked, in multiple threads? DOn't worry. She is not in danger..



     I think the question was a fair one.  It deserves an answer.  I saw no smear.

     While I am fond of Jennifer, my personal opinion of Jennifer has no bearing on the question about the post, which inquired where the smear was.  I still see no smear, and I would rather deal with the GOP scandals which are the subject of the thread.  I would expect that you might have significant things to say on that subject, many of which might prove both interesting and enlightening to me and perhaps to other readers of this thread.  I am not interested in personal comments about Jennifer, or in your personal comments about myself, however, in this context.

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30 posted 08-07-2010 01:18 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     Ringo, I'm sorry, I just saw your posting, having gotten sidetracked by other matters.  I find I need some time to reply here as well.  Just offhand, however, the question about job growth during the Bush years seems a touch misleading.  52 consecutive months of job growth still suggests that there were three years of something else.  The question is where those months were, and how keyed in were they to the Clinton boom years.

     The suggestion is that the job growth was simply phenomenal, but my understanding is that it totalled something like 3 million jobs for President Bush's entire two terms, when the population was growing due to immegration and other factors.  Whereas the Obama job growth has been anemic but has totalled something like three million jobs so far in his first term.  Both of them look sick compared to the Clinton years.  Again, as I understand it, and off the top of my head.

     As for the No Child Left Behind law, I think you might find some questions on that as well.  The upper range of test score and the lower range are coming together, but what does that mean?  The O Levels in England are a comprehensive and solid test of academic ability on any number of subjects, and only a portion of the English students are expected to pass them at College levels  Those who do, have a very rich education indeed.

     The American tests, from what the teachers tell me, are much more rote education, and require only a superficial mastery of superficial material.

     Calling that a victory is simply redefining the word "victory."

     It is not "simply throwing money at the problem."  But it is also not providing a good or a great education for our american students by any stretch of the imagination.  And it looks like we'll be substituting Texas History for real history soon enough, if the Texas School board gets its way.

     More at a later time.
JenniferMaxwell
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31 posted 08-07-2010 05:14 AM       View Profile for JenniferMaxwell   Email JenniferMaxwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JenniferMaxwell

Bush left office with the worst employment-growth record of any president since World War II.

Anyway -

Saudi-Funded Fox News Rejects Ad Arguing Against Middle East Oil Dependence

"Last week, progressive veterans organization VoteVets.org released an ad arguing that “a clean energy climate plan would cut our dependence on foreign oil in half and cut oil profits for hostile nations.” The ad asserts that “every day, Iran gets $100 million richer selling oil around the world and peddling hate.”

While CNN and MSNBC have aired the ad, Fox News is refusing to do so. Politico reports Fox apparently found the ad “too confusing.” Watch the “confusing” ad:

There is nothing confusing about the ad. VoteVets’ assertion that hostile nations profit off our oil dependence is based on a Wonk Room analysis that finds, under the a strong carbon cap regime which restrains U.S. appetite for oil, Iran would lose $1.8 trillion worth of oil revenues over the next forty years — or, over $100 million a day. “If the world moves away from oil dependence, Iran’s regime will no longer be able to rely on petrodollars to stay afloat,” Brad Johnson writes in pretty simple terms.

In a statement issued to ThinkProgress, Richard Smith, a senior adviser to VoteVets who served in Afghanistan, says “the only confusing thing” is why Fox is rejecting the ad:

“There’s nothing confusing about the link between oil and terrorist funding, and even the most dyed-in-the-wool neocons agree on that point. The only confusing thing here is why FOX News would reject an ad that calls on Congress to defund our enemies by finding new sources of energy.”

It’s unclear what Fox News’ motivations are. As Media Matters has documented, the network is a reliable source of misinformation on clean energy reform. Interestingly, Saudi oil tycoon Prince Alwaleed bin Talal owns a 7 percent stake in Fox News’ parent company News Corp, making him the largest shareholder outside the family of CEO Rupert Murdoch. But Murdoch has said the he is for a mandatory cap on carbon emissions and believes that Fox News ought to be covering the issue differently.
http://thinkprogress.org/2010/05/05/saudi-fox-clean-energy-ad/

And here's a link to the ad. Too confusing for Fox viewers?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RbyWiFpDNXM&feature=PlayList&p=BBD6DE93C7374732&index=11

Bob K
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32 posted 08-11-2010 03:24 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     Here are some references about Bush health care taken from 2004-07, about the range that you covered,, Ringo, from a variety of sources.


http://www.nytimes.com/2004/08/27/business/27health.html
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=SourceWatch:Project:Record_on_SCHIP
http://www.democracynow.org/2007/8/29/headlines
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33 posted 08-13-2010 03:16 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



quote:

Some other items that are infrequently mentioned about the real record of the Bush Administration but are worth noting: Teenage drug use has declined 25 percent; in 2007, the violent crime rate was 43 percent lower than the rate in 1998; between 2005 and 2007, the chronically homeless population decreased approximately 30 percent; funding for veterans' medical care has increased more than 115 percent; and as of 2005, the most recent abortion rate is at its lowest since 1974.



     Here you are very specific with figures, and you spark my interest about the sources of your data.  When you say "various sources," you've gotten savvy enough to understand that when you make this sort of specific claim, you really should be more exact.  There is a lot of wiggle room.

     For example,

quote:

between 2005 and 2007, the chronically homeless population decreased approximately 30 percent. . .



     This is a very peculiar figure.  Given that it's 2010, there are figures available for a lot more periods than that.  Why would those two particular years be chosen to offer an example of a decrease in chronic hopelessness.  What might it have decreased from?

     Well, when was Katrina?  There was a massive dislocation of folks from Katrina, which may well have provided a large spike in the homeless population, but were these folks counted as chronically homeless over that period or were they classified under some other rubric.  Tossing several hundred thousand people from their homes along the Gulf coast into temporary trailer parks and into temporary housing did require a massive aid effort, so these folks may well have failed to have registered as chronically homeless, as may have several other people who would have lost their jobs in the economic downturn, who normally would have gotten counted as homeless but were caught up in the aid provisions passed after Katrina.

     Is that the explanation?  I have no idea.  But I'd really want an explanation before I'd count on an actual 30% decline in actual homelessness during that period.  What's more, I would think that you would too.  Unless you remember 2005-07 as being years of real harmony and surplus because of that generous Republican administration.

quote:

funding for veterans' medical care has increased more than 115 percent. . .



     Perhaps you have forgotten the funding scandals in the Bush administration for the VA, the attempted closings of some of the hospitals, and the wide public attention gotten by the pictures of the terrible state of many of those institutions that forced the increase in funding.  The fact that the funding was increased 15% over that period, while americans went to warn and began bringing home disproportionate rations of chronic head wounds was and remains shameful.  The care for such wounds is some of the most expensive.  Attempts to disqualify many soldiers from treatment that in other administrations would have been theirs was disgusting and remains so.  

     Attempts to privatize the long term care of elderly vets does not seem to me to be the best of solutions, though the Republican administration was very much for it.  I feel it is breaking faith with our vets, and opens the door on supplying substandard care.  Reasonable people disagree with me.

quote:

the most recent abortion rate is at its lowest since 1974.



     You may believe this is a good thing.  It may in fact be a good thing.  

     What I notice, however, is that the decrease is not clearly attributable to a decrease in the need for the safe and legal abortions, it is because what defines a legal abortion has been steadily narrowed, and those who are willing to offer them have become human targets.  Thus the intention of the law, to make abortion safe, legal and available has been assaulted.

     We know that the number of safe, legal and easily available abortions may have declined.  This does not mean that the number of abortions overall has declined.

     The main victims of this war on legal abortions have been the poor, who cannot afford travel to another state or country the way a financially better fixed person might be able to do.

     We do not know the number of illegal abortions or abortions that were not performed in the open fashion the law mandated  were performed, nor do we know the number of casualties due to botched procedures there have been as a result.  I have a lot of inflammatory things I would like to say here, but which I will refrain from saying.  It is an issue I find very disturbing.

     I understand people who disagree with me feel much the same way.

     How in heaven's name anyone can tell teenaged drug use has declined 25%, I don't know.  If this statement is for real, I would like to know what category they place alcohol in, and whether it is lumped together with drugs or not.  I suspect it is only by segregating the more dangerous alcohol for many of the less dangerous drugs that such a figure may be derived.  Alcohol may be the most risky of the drugs available, with the exception of the barbiturates, and it is the most often used and abused by teens.
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34 posted 08-13-2010 10:48 AM       View Profile for Ringo   Email Ringo   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Ringo

quote:
"the worst president in US History with the worst record, and who only cared for his rich friends and his buddies, and hated the "little people" - Ringo
Indeed, Ringo, a GOP scandal, one the whole world will never forget.

It is amazing how, in one small sentence, you make it seem that I am agreeing with your thoughts, attitudes, beliefs by taking something I said and repeating it out of context.
For that, I wish to that you for making a point that I had made before and had people argue with me...

LIFE IS PERCEPTION

When I wrote it, I did not, in any way, mean it to agree with anyone's derision about the man... and yet, that is exactly what it means now, that there is a political soundbyte made by taking only part of the speech and presenting it as if the entire meaning and the entire "truth" was brought into one tiny little portion that was chosen by someone to be used for their own agenda.

Once again, the loyal opposition, your argument has been lost because the entire thought was not argued, but rather co-opted for the only portion that served a purpose for other than which it was intended.

Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting, "WHAT A RIDE

JenniferMaxwell
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35 posted 08-13-2010 12:15 PM       View Profile for JenniferMaxwell   Email JenniferMaxwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JenniferMaxwell


“Any time someone uses another author's words or ideas without correctly giving them credit, that's plagiarism.”

From:
http://collegeuniversity.suite101.com/article.cfm/a_definition_for_plagiarism
Ron
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"Anytime someone has no real answer to a point and instead throws a non sequitur into the discussion, that's deflection."

From: Ron Carnell, who is at least as much an authority on the meaning of words as Suite101.
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37 posted 08-13-2010 06:00 PM       View Profile for JenniferMaxwell   Email JenniferMaxwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JenniferMaxwell

Not to worry, Ron, maybe Ringo will be back later to respond to points in Bob’s posts. He could be tied up checking out Ed Gillespie quotes. Here’s one that I like a lot:

"Where they have a chess piece on the board, we need a chess piece on the board."
– Ed Gillespie
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38 posted 08-13-2010 07:26 PM       View Profile for Ron   Email Ron   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Ron's Home Page   View IP for Ron

LOL. Your fifth-grade repartee is refreshing, Jennifer. Not very original, but nonetheless refreshing. Fifth-graders, of course, use come-backs like that both to deflect and to intentionally irritate.

It probably works on fifth-graders.
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39 posted 08-13-2010 09:52 PM       View Profile for JenniferMaxwell   Email JenniferMaxwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JenniferMaxwell

Do I ever know what you mean, Ron!  I had exactly the same reaction to #25.
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quote:
We know that the number of safe, legal and easily available abortions may have declined.  This does not mean that the number of abortions overall has declined.


Couldn't help but comment here Bob.  We do know that most likely this is the case, since law typically keeps crimes in check.  You and I of course would disagree on whether abortion should constitute a crime.  We could debate the moral, social, and legal points back and forth till we're blue in the face as we have in the past.  (and No, that's not saying I really want to again).  But I am saying that it is reasonable to think abortions (not just "safe" ones-  I cringe at saying that, wondering why safety is limited in this case to the parent only) will decrease where legal sanction, and the pseudo-scientific rationale attached with the business, decreases.


Stephen
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41 posted 08-13-2010 11:28 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K


quote:

Couldn't help but comment here Bob.  We do know that most likely this is the case, since law typically keeps crimes in check.



     "We" do not know it, Stephanos.  You assert it.

     Legal sanctions may work, but I suspect they work only for laws that have the support of the people.  Drug offenses, Ringo has asserted, among teens have gone down substantially, yet somehow pot is a growth industry and is beginning the legalization process in many states.  As did Alcohol before it.  As did birth control.

     If people think that things are really crimes, they may allow their behavior to be regulated to some extent.  But when abortion was completely illegal, there were an enormous number of illegal abortions, up to 3,000,000 per year according to some estimates.  Adultery is also illegal.

     I think your basic supposition is flawed.

quote:

But I am saying that it is reasonable to think abortions (not just "safe" ones-  I cringe at saying that, wondering why safety is limited in this case to the parent only) will decrease where legal sanction, and the pseudo-scientific rationale attached with the business, decreases.



     I think you may have mis-spoken here.  Perhaps I'm wrong.

     It appears that you've said that abortion will decrease when legal sanction decreases, which seems different from the proposition you suggest beforehand, though certainly more Christian in many ways.

     An assertion that the reasoning is pseudo-scientific, should you wish it to be accepted, requires the sort of proof that I believe social issues are reluctant to supply.  You might be able to fight to a tie with the assertion, maybe, but I doubt you could definitively carry the day before an unbiased audience.

     You might wish you could, I might wish I could prevail definitively in the other direction.  While we have strong moral feelings, each of us, this isn't, I believe, the sort of argument that wins the day in a discussion of which argument is more scientific.  

     Respectfully, Bob Kaven
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42 posted 08-14-2010 07:50 AM       View Profile for Ringo   Email Ringo   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Ringo

quote:
Not to worry, Ron, maybe Ringo will be back later to respond to points in Bob’s posts. He could be tied up checking out Ed Gillespie quotes.

Actually, I was in the middle of replying when life intervened and I was forced away from the keyboard... although, I did rather enjoy your attempt (feeble as it was) at an insult.

Rest assured, I will be replying to all of this as soon as I get the time, I only came in to read a few poems and head to work. I don't have time at the moment to give this thread a proper post.
 
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