How to Join Member's Area Private Library Search Today's Topics p Login
Main Forums Discussion Tech Talk Mature Content Archives
   Nav Win
 Discussion
 The Alley
 Oak trees grow   [ Page: 1  2  ]
 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40
Follow us on Facebook

 Moderated by: Ron   (Admins )

 
User Options
Format for Better Printing EMail to a Friend Not Available
Admin Print Send ECard
Passions in Poetry

Oak trees grow

 Post A Reply Post New Topic   Go to the Next Oldest/Previous Topic Return to Topic Page Go to the Next Newest Topic 
Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 06-05-99
Posts 26302
Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA


25 posted 04-29-2010 05:21 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

The loans that were given to the thousands of people to buy homes without collateral...the same ones being foreclosed on now.
Bob K
Member Elite
since 11-03-2007
Posts 3860


26 posted 04-29-2010 09:22 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     The Homes are collateral, Mike; that's why they're repossessed.  Read the mortgage papers.
Denise
Moderator
Member Seraphic
since 08-22-99
Posts 23002


27 posted 04-29-2010 10:46 PM       View Profile for Denise   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Denise

Grinch set me straight about errors I had made?

You're entitled to your opionion, Bob.
Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 06-05-99
Posts 26302
Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA


28 posted 04-29-2010 11:42 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Well, shucks, then we can all buy homes, Bob. We don't need to fill out any silly loan papers or show that we have a job or the ability to pay or any of that foolishness. After all, the homes are collateral...nothing else is needed, right?
Bob K
Member Elite
since 11-03-2007
Posts 3860


29 posted 04-30-2010 02:50 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     Maybe you ought to think of the appropriate word, rather than trying to repeat other people's taking points, then, Mike.  Then you wouldn't end up at a loss for words like this.
Bob K
Member Elite
since 11-03-2007
Posts 3860


30 posted 04-30-2010 02:53 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     Maybe you ought to think of the appropriate word, rather than trying to repeat other people's taking points, then, Mike.  Then you wouldn't end up at a loss for words like this.

     Might you be thinking of "downpayments," perhaps? or something of that sort?
Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 06-05-99
Posts 26302
Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA


31 posted 04-30-2010 09:04 AM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Why bother with down payments? The house is collateral! Don't make a payment and the bank takes it...right?
Bob K
Member Elite
since 11-03-2007
Posts 3860


32 posted 04-30-2010 05:30 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K


     Ever gone to a real estate seminar, Mike, or read any of the bestselling books with titles like No Money Down?  A fair number of folks have made money doing exactly that, and the practice is far from rare.  Or have you been in hiding without watching tv for the past thirty years?

[This message has been edited by Bob K (04-30-2010 06:23 PM).]

Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 06-05-99
Posts 26302
Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA


33 posted 04-30-2010 06:47 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Most of the real estate seminars I have gone to have would up with the presenter ultimately serving a prison sentence. How IS old Tom Vu, by the way?

According to you, there's no need to buy a book OR make a home purchase with any kind of payments at all. Since the house as collateral is the silver bullet, banks should be able to give away deeds on the sidewalk.

The fact is that the house being collateral is not enough to make a purchase and you know it...so why continue with the tomfoolery?
Bob K
Member Elite
since 11-03-2007
Posts 3860


34 posted 04-30-2010 07:39 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



quote:

The loans that were given to the thousands of people to buy homes without collateral..



     Your line, Mike.  If you didn't mean it, exactly what did you mean?  

     What you said is stuff I've heard you say before.  Take a deep breath, look at the facts, whatever they may be, and then come back and say what the facts really are.  If you don't know what they are, then this really might be a good time to find out.  

     Otherwise, why keep repeating something that's clearly a fiction?  

     Getting testy with me because I'm pointing it out doesn't make the gap in the reasoning process magically vanish.  It's still there.  You need an explanation that's longer than a bumper sticker.  Sorry.  It's very hard to get an explanation that short in the first place; and getting it back up to full length is sometimes a real bear.
Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 06-05-99
Posts 26302
Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA


35 posted 04-30-2010 11:03 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

I don't understand that you don't understand, Bob. Thanks to ACORN pressure and tactics loans were given to those with no collateral and no way of making payments. According to you, collateral was not necessary since the home is the collateral. If collateral is not necessary, then, anyone should be able to buy a home, according to your scenario.
Bob K
Member Elite
since 11-03-2007
Posts 3860


36 posted 05-01-2010 01:41 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     In order to buy a home, what I have to do is show I have enough income, show I have a secure job, so that the income looks like it will continue, put down a down-payment of x-percent and pay a number of points at the closing.  I must pay taxes and insurance and the various other costs of upkeep.

     Most often, the bank will sell my loan to some other organization that's in the loan buying business.  These loans are pay off well for the companies that buy them if they are well chosen.  As insurance against loss, the companies secure their costs against the value of the house in a given market.  The house collateralizes the loan.  When the homeowner goes belly up, the company is left with the value of the home and property, which it usually sells at some sort of discount to get the loss off its books quickly and so it can take a write-off business loss on its income-tax for that year.  

     So what I'm asking you, Mike, is exactly where is all this collateral that the buyers were supposed to put down.  Near as I can tell, the whole notion is somewhat odd.  They put up a down-payment.  They pay money to the owner of the mortgage, which builds the equity they have in the house.  If they walk away from the house, they will probably loose that, and the investors that bought the home loan will take the loss for the rest, which they will improve somewhat by putting it up for sale at a loss, and then by writing off the loss on the Federal taxes.

     Where's the collateral?

     And of course they had money to make payments.  They had to qualify for the loans.  The people who were making the loans at the finance companies were cooking the books and writing up loans that they shouldn't have written up.  When my wife and I were qualified for a loan, the bank qualified us to buy a house that was twice what we could afford.  We were skeptical enough to doubt them, though they pressed us to go higher, and the market, at that time, looked as though we could have bought in, held it for a year or two, then sold it for twice what we paid.  In fact, we could have, but we lived there longer than that and the market was down a bit from the height.

     If you were a player, an optimist, a gambler or a fool, you might have taken the plunge without so much as a second thought, and patted yourself on the back about how smart you were.  If you'd gotten out in time, in fact, you would have been smart.  Most of these poor schlumps got caught when the bubble burst.

     But about collateral, I think you've got things wrong.

     Maybe there's some financial wizard out there without any particular political drum to beat who might slide in some pure information on the economics of the thing?
Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 06-05-99
Posts 26302
Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA


37 posted 05-01-2010 07:42 AM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

And of course they had money to make payments.  They had to qualify for the loans.

That's my point, Bob. Thanks to ACORN intimidation, threats, sit-ins, etc., many did NOT necessarily have the money to make payments or otherwise qualify for the loans. Without the ACORN tactics, they wouldn't have gotten the loans. That's why ACORN used the tactics they did. Had it simply been a situation where people came in for a loan, had enough for a down payments, had sufficient income to show they could make payments, there would have been no need for ACORN to send dozens of protesters into banks to stop business, show up on the sidewalk outside bank officials' homes, call bankers to remind them that their families safety was not always a given, or a variety of other stunts that were reported and documented. Those greedy bankers would have happily loaned money to anyone they thought could make payments. That's what they do. The fact that ACORN had to go to such lengths so get the loans for their people shows how qualified, make that unqualified, the borrowers were.
Grinch
Member Elite
since 12-31-2005
Posts 2710
Whoville


38 posted 05-01-2010 10:03 AM       View Profile for Grinch   Email Grinch   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Grinch


quote:
Thanks to ACORN intimidation, threats, sit-ins, etc., many did NOT necessarily have the money to make payments or otherwise qualify for the loans. Without the ACORN tactics, they wouldn't have gotten the loans.


That isnít what happened Mike, while it's true that ACORN forced banks to stop denying loans to eligible candidates Ė the decision to lower the criteria for eligibility was made independently by the lenders themselves in 2002 to expand the market.

.
Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 06-05-99
Posts 26302
Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA


39 posted 05-01-2010 12:49 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Not the way I've seen it, grinch. They forced banks to give loans to ineligible candidates, not eligible ones.

Banks are a business. They are not going to turn down business, or opportunities to make profits, because a qualified person is black. That would be nonsensical.

There would be no reason for ACORN to go the intimidation route unless the candidates they wanted serviced were ineligible. That's the logic of it, as I see it.
Grinch
Member Elite
since 12-31-2005
Posts 2710
Whoville


40 posted 05-01-2010 01:09 PM       View Profile for Grinch   Email Grinch   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Grinch


It looks logical Mike but it isnít actually true.

I explained it once before, you may have missed it.
http://piptalk.com/pip/Forum6/HTML/001859-6.html#129

.
 
 Post A Reply Post New Topic   Go to the Next Oldest/Previous Topic Return to Topic Page Go to the Next Newest Topic 
All times are ET (US) Top
  User Options
>> Discussion >> The Alley >> Oak trees grow   [ Page: 1  2  ] Format for Better Printing EMail to a Friend Not Available
Print Send ECard

 

pipTalk Home Page | Main Poetry Forums

How to Join | Member's Area / Help | Private Library | Search | Contact Us | Today's Topics | Login
Discussion | Tech Talk | Archives | Sanctuary



© Passions in Poetry and netpoets.com 1998-2013
All Poetry and Prose is copyrighted by the individual authors