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Passions in Poetry

Favorite quotes, words of wisdom, personal mottos, thoughts to live by

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JenniferMaxwell
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150 posted 04-05-2010 03:51 AM       View Profile for JenniferMaxwell   Email JenniferMaxwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JenniferMaxwell

It was your characterization of the post as "the 9/12 commissions" that threw me off, Ringo, and the fact that you mentioned something about how I'd run off. I was still posting in that thread, so that threw me off even further.
Anyway, thanks for your additions to this thread.
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151 posted 04-05-2010 07:59 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     I catch that you didn't like Jennifer's comments about how a lot of right wing folks complain about socialism and the government but take full advantage of the government programs they hate.  That was the part obout the pledge.

     I caught that you didn't like the smear and run tactics that Jennifer was talking about.  You are in agreement with her about how unpleasant they are, and yet seem somehow to be accusing her of doing the same thing.

     If you are making that accusation, it will be interesting to see if you stick around long enough to discuss why you would do this.  Or have I misread your intentions.

     I catch your various quotes, though I don't necessarily agree with them.  I don't think, for example, that Marx had any single most important contribution, but the one that you suggest with your quote would be more of a Maoist or a Stalinist sort of thing on the nature of Revolution than a Marxist thing on the nature of the economics and the history underlying it.  

     To my mind a more important Marxist idea would be the notion of Mystified Oppression, which is from early Marx, and which was amplified somewhat by Herbert Marcuse.  It suggests that people are so bamboozled by what us former hippies used to call "The System" that we actually think that "The System" is rational and natural and normal.  It doesn't strike us as odd that the country that thinks of itself as being the freeist country in the world would have so very many of its citizens in jail, for example.  

     Or that there might be something wrong with the repeal of the Posse Comitatus law forbidding use of U.S. Troops against Americans on American soil.  We have a sort of brain fog that descends to cover these contradictions about how the system oppresses the people.  Marx suggested that this is inherent in Capitalism, and it may be that he is right.  

     Mystified Oppression:  The difference between what they said was the reason to go to war in Iraq, and whatever the actual reasons might have been.

     As long as you're looking for favorite ideas, there's one that's very close to the top of my list.
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152 posted 04-05-2010 10:18 PM       View Profile for Ringo   Email Ringo   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Ringo

Actually, Bob, the initial quotes that I posted were supposed to have follow-up explainations... and- again- I failed at making my thoughts more understood.

With everyone of the quotes I posted, there is an equal and similar reaction from the current Administration, and others.
For Example:

The best way to destroy the capitalist system is to debauch the currency.- Vladimir Lenin
The government is borrowing way beyond our ability to repay, and is printing money at a rate that is making it as worthless as the cotton fibers it is printed on.

The oppressed are allowed once every few years to decide which particular representatives of the oppressing class are to represent and repress them.- Karl Marx
It matters not in the least which political agenda you espouse, this is a blinding truth of the American Political system, This time, it happens to be the Democrats making moves to oppress the American people with their exhorbitant taxes and power-plays.

Ideas are more powerful than guns. We would not let our enemies have guns, why should we let them have ideas.- Joseph Stalin
Everytime someone who does not agree with the current far-left liberal thoughts (and by that, I mean the Rachael Maddow's and those even further left) is shouted down, and is not permitted to have their own thoughts. To these people, the only mpeople allowed to exercise their first amendment rights are those who completely and totally agree with them. (for proof, I submit Karl Rove, Sarah Palin, Michelle Malkin, and any other conservative thinker who attempted to speak in public around these ultra-left loons only to be shouted down, and have things thrown at them.)

Fascism should rightly be called Corporatism, as it is the merger of corporate and government power.- Benito Mussolini
Government Motors, Banks, Insurance Companies, Educational Lenders, etc

What good fortune for governments that the people do not think.- Adolf Hitler

Too many people blindly go about their business, not caring at all what is happening to them or their country. Too many people blindly accept what their government tells them is the absolute truth, and are unwilling to challenge the prevailing thought and to seek the absolute truth -not the popular pundit speak- and decide for themselves. That is how the government is able to break the laws they, themselves, make and  no one seems to care (example... the money paid back was- BY LAW according to the Spending Package- required to be used to pay down the debt... and it wasn't and no one seems to notice or care).

The ones I posted in my last visit here, were very simply a statement about Marxism, and then using the Administration's own words about how they are accomplishing this very thing.

Oh, and a couple of other things:
1) I never "greened" my wounds... as I said, I viewed most posts with amusement. There was no revenge sought.
2) "The person" has a name.

Anyhow... Tommy (the original 1975 version) is on, and a man must, after all, have his priorities. Y'all have a great night.

I had no reason to be over-optimistic,
But somehow, when you smiled, I could brave bad weather...
Captain Walker... from the song "1921"

2) "Some

Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting, "WHAT A RIDE

JenniferMaxwell
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153 posted 04-05-2010 10:33 PM       View Profile for JenniferMaxwell   Email JenniferMaxwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JenniferMaxwell

The mind is everything. What you think you become.
- Buddha
rwood
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154 posted 04-05-2010 10:53 PM       View Profile for rwood   Email rwood   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for rwood

"History teaches us that men and nations behave wisely once they have exhausted all other alternatives."  ~Abba Eban

"Most people are other people.  Their thoughts are someone else's opinions, their lives a mimicry, their passions a quotation."  ~Oscar Wilde, De Profundis, 1905
Bob K
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155 posted 04-06-2010 12:17 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



quote:

The best way to destroy the capitalist system is to debauch the currency.- Vladimir Lenin
The government is borrowing way beyond our ability to repay, and is printing money at a rate that is making it as worthless as the cotton fibers it is printed on.



     Borrowing excessively is a problem.

     Printing money to cover debt doesn't seem to be our current problem, however.  That would lead to an inflationary spiral.  This is a bad thing, yes; but from the current position of the Fed and of the Government in general, our problem is not with inflation at this point, which is I believe what you were saying Lenin was suggesting the weakness was in the Capitalist system.

      It is with deflation, which is why the interest rates are at such a low point and why people are still not borrowing money.  Why buy, the reasoning goes, when if we wait, the price may dip even l;lower?  This is the sort of spiral that can lead to Depressions.

     Near as I can tell, you have your economics backwards.

quote:

The oppressed are allowed once every few years to decide which particular representatives of the oppressing class are to represent and repress them.- Karl Marx
It matters not in the least which political agenda you espouse, this is a blinding truth of the American Political system, This time, it happens to be the Democrats making moves to oppress the American people with their exorbitant taxes and power-plays.



     Which new taxes do you have to pay?

     Which power plays do you speak of?

      We had a pretty much balanced budget when Bush came into power.  Bush ran up an enormous debt with a war, and with tax cuts we could not afford.  The tax cuts put us in the hole, as did the war.  Somebody has to pay the money back, unless you advocate borrowing and defaulting.  You can blame the Democrats for facing up to reality, you can't  blame them for the tax cuts and you'll have trouble blaming them for the war.

     You want to run up a debt and run out on it, is that your point?  Is that what you teach your kids?

quote:


Everytime someone who does not agree with the current far-left liberal thoughts (and by that, I mean the Rachel Maddow's and those even further left) is shouted down, and is not permitted to have their own thoughts. To these people, the only people allowed to exercise their first amendment rights are those who completely and totally agree with them. (for proof, I submit Karl Rove, Sarah Palin, Michelle Malkin, and any other conservative thinker who attempted to speak in public around these ultra-left loons only to be shouted down, and have things thrown at them.)



     I'm sorry, I';m mildly amazed, that's all.

     Where were you when Karl Rove and Company shipped down Republican Party workers to lay siege to the folks doing the recount for the Florida elections, and disrupted it?  Were you not paying attention to what the TEA Party has been doing to meetings Congressmen have been holding with their constituents to explain the Health Care legislation, refusing to allow them to explain the bill and the situation and shouting them down?  Showing up at political meetings carrying guns?

     It may be your right, but it does not have a warming effect on free speech, Ringo, Does it?  I say this as a guy who would have trouble speaking before a bunch of folks carrying guns myself.

     And, by the way, anybody who calls Rachel Maddow "far-left" has serious problems with their distance vision.  They seem unable to distinguish among somebody who has left wing sympathies (and can occasionally criticize left wing politics and politicians for being foolish); and somebody who's a left wing ideologue; and somebody who's a screaming left wing revolutionary.  

     You, Ringo, have confused somebody who's a left wing intellectual with somebody who's a left wing ideologue and parroting party line with somebody for whom the Party is far too conservative and moderate.  Your understanding appears to end with what other people have told you is far left, and you have believed them.

     I believe you have also misjudged the dangers of the Radical Right.  The moderate right has been purged or is in the process of being purged from the American political scene (within the Republican Party).  What used to be everyday rational Eisenhower Republicans would no longer be tolerated in the Modern Republican Party.  They would be called RINOs.  They would not be funded in Party sponsored races.  Radical Right Wing ideologues would be run against them.

     My sincere belief is the closest thing we have today to an Eisenhower or a Rockefeller Republican is President Obama, whom I will often speak of as Republican Lite.  It is pitiful that the current Republicans despise him.  The health Care bill he got through was essentially the 1994 Republican Bob Dole sponsored Bill that was supposed to be the Republican Answer to Hillary Clinton's Bill.  And Hillary Clinton's Bill was far from a solid single payer lefty wing system.

     You're simply not remembering your history.


quote:

Fascism should rightly be called Corporatism, as it is the merger of corporate and government power.- Benito Mussolini



     You are very right, I believe.

     Your examples, however — Government Motors, Banks, Insurance Companies, Educational Lenders, etc — are wrong and don't prove that the current government is anything like that.

     Krupp, for example, and Bayer, in Germany were hefty financial supporters of the Third Reich.  Many of their officials joined the Party, and the Government found that the company interests were very much the interests of the Government as well.  They granted sweetheart deals to the companies for supplies of munitions and various chemicals, and in return gave these companies access to slave laborers from Concentration camps and labor camps to be worked to death at quite literally slave wages.  This, by the way, is an example of what Marx would call Predatory Capitalism.  Soap was produced from human fat in the concentration camps, human hair was used as mattress stuffing, all at a profit for both the companies and the government.

    I.G. Farben and Bayer were, I believe, suppliers of the Zyklon B. Gas used in the Concentration camps for the elimination of "undesirables such as Jews, Labor leaders, Communists, homosexuals, gypsies and so on.  Think of that the next time you take a Bayer aspirin.

     G.M., on the other hand, asked for a government loan.  The same conditions came to bear on that loan as would have come to bear on you, had you taken out a loan.  You default, you lose your collateral.  G.M. was particularly high handed about it, asked for several extensions, got them, and then refused to pay.  

     What would have happened to you?

     Was the Government supposed to allow GM to push them around because it was GM?  Evidently GM thought  so.  The voters wouldn't have stood for it.  I don't think the Government is thrilled to have this White Elephant on its hands, but until there's a satisfactory re-organization plan or it's sold off piece by piece to repay the taxpayers, we've got it.

     It's not like we're running it to compete with more functional car companies.  We'd rather not have it at all.  Unless you would, in which case, you should make them an offer.

     I know there is more to write about, but my brain is mush, and I'll have to try again later.
Mysteria
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156 posted 04-06-2010 12:57 AM       View Profile for Mysteria   Email Mysteria   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Mysteria

How strange is the lot of us mortals! Each of us is here for a brief sojourn; for what purpose he knows not, though he senses it. But without deeper reflection one knows from daily life that one exists for other people.
Albert Einstein
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157 posted 04-13-2010 02:04 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

'First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win.'" - Gandhi


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158 posted 04-14-2010 09:05 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

"It does not take a majority to prevail ... but rather an irate, tireless minority, keen on setting brushfires of freedom in the minds of men." --Samuel Adams


JenniferMaxwell
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159 posted 04-15-2010 02:28 PM       View Profile for JenniferMaxwell   Email JenniferMaxwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JenniferMaxwell

"Tea Parties are for little girls with imaginary friends."
- bumper sticker
Denise
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160 posted 04-15-2010 02:37 PM       View Profile for Denise   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Denise

“We contend that for a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up by the handle.” — Winston Churchill
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161 posted 04-15-2010 02:52 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

A veiled insult directed at liberals who post in the Alley? Hmmmmm...

How sad, how petty, an interesting thread turned into an Obama hate-fest. Teabagger mentality I guess.

"Favorite quotes, words of wisdom, personal mottos, thoughts to live by"
Seemed like a good idea, thought provoking, educational even. I learned a lot from reading quotes from Voltaire, Disraeli, Pascal, even Cicero and if others did, then perhaps it wasn't a complete waste of time and effort. I'm sorry to see it go.

"Tea Parties are for little girls with imaginary friends."
- bumper sticker



Yep, same person posted all of those, unbelievable as it may seem.
JenniferMaxwell
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162 posted 04-15-2010 07:14 PM       View Profile for JenniferMaxwell   Email JenniferMaxwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JenniferMaxwell

Cyberbullying "involves the use of information and communication technologies to support deliberate, repeated, and hostile behavior by an individual or group, that is intended to harm others.
-Bill Belsey
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163 posted 04-15-2010 07:21 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

"Tea Parties are for little girls with imaginary friends."
- bumper sticker
.

An insult (also called putdown) is an expression, statement (or sometimes behavior) which is considered degrading and offensive.
Sociologists suggest that insults are often an indicator of flawed reasoning about the character or motivation of others. ...Wikipedia
JenniferMaxwell
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164 posted 04-15-2010 07:22 PM       View Profile for JenniferMaxwell   Email JenniferMaxwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JenniferMaxwell

Cyberbullying "involves the use of information and communication technologies to support deliberate, repeated, and hostile behavior by an individual or group, that is intended to harm others.
-Bill Belsey
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165 posted 04-17-2010 09:02 PM       View Profile for JenniferMaxwell   Email JenniferMaxwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JenniferMaxwell

"The tree of silence bears the fruit of peace."
- Arabian Proverb


"I love it when a plan comes together!"
- Hannibal (of the A Team)

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166 posted 04-20-2010 06:00 PM       View Profile for Grinch   Email Grinch   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Grinch

quote:
“We contend that for a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket and trying to lift himself up by the handle.” — Winston Churchill


A great quote from a gret speech Denise, do you agree with what he was saying?

.
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167 posted 04-20-2010 09:15 PM       View Profile for Denise   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Denise

I like this quote, Grinch. I've never read the entire speech that I recall. I tried a search for it but came up with nothing. Do you have a link to it?
Grinch
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168 posted 04-21-2010 01:56 PM       View Profile for Grinch   Email Grinch   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Grinch


I posted one for Mike a while back:
http://piptalk.com/pip/Forum6/HTML/001755-4.html#99

.
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169 posted 04-21-2010 02:04 PM       View Profile for Grinch   Email Grinch   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Grinch


I guess the link doesn't work any more but the post is worth reading to find out what Winston was talking about.

The full speech is now here:
http://www.winstonchurchill.org/learn/speeches/speeches-of-winston-churchill/96-the-free-trade-league

.
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170 posted 04-21-2010 03:39 PM       View Profile for Mysteria   Email Mysteria   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Mysteria

"In America any boy may become President and I suppose it's just one of the risks he takes."
    Adlai E. Stevenson Jr.

and love this one:

"America is the greatest, freest and most decent society in existence. It is an oasis of goodness in a desert of cynicism and barbarism. This country, once an experiment unique in the world, is now the last best hope for the world."
      Dinesh D'Souza
Denise
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171 posted 04-21-2010 04:08 PM       View Profile for Denise   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Denise

Thanks Grinch. I'll have to read it later.

"The government that governs least, governs best." - Thomas Jefferson
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172 posted 04-21-2010 10:01 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

"I think we have more machinery of government than is necessary, too many parasites living on the labor of the industrious." --Thomas Jefferson
Bob K
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173 posted 04-23-2010 03:16 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     Being a slave-owner, of course, he might well have included himself among that number, sad to say.
rwood
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174 posted 04-23-2010 07:15 AM       View Profile for rwood   Email rwood   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for rwood

"A keen sense of humor helps us to overlook the unbecoming, understand the unconventional, tolerate the unpleasant, overcome the unexpected, and outlast the unbearable" (Billy Graham)

 
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