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Kindergarten Time...

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Balladeer
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0 posted 10-17-2009 12:34 AM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer


Democrats skip out on Countrywide vote
By: David Freddoso
Commentary Staff Writer
10/15/09 10:23 PM PDT

Faced with a promised vote to subpoena documents on Countrywide Financial's "Friends of Angelo" program, Democrats on the House Oversight Committee fled a scheduled 2 p.m. markup today.

Rep. Darrell Issa of California, the Ranking Republican on the Oversight Committee, had promised to call for a vote at today's markup on whether to subpoena documents involved in the program that gave sweetheart mortgages to at least four Democratic government officials, including two senators. According to the Wall Street Journal, the program might have also benefitted the chairman of House Oversight, Rep. Edolphus Towns, D-N.Y.

Even if it had been ruled out of Order, Issa's motion would have received a vote.

The committee's Democrats simply failed to appear. Republican staffers say they caught them on tape leaving by a back door at 2:35.
http://www.sfexaminer.com/opinion/blogs/beltway-confidential/Democrats-skip-out-on-Countrywide-vote-64434312.html

Watch the video and see Democrats acting like little children. Be proud, Liberals, of this body that pledged to clean up Washington.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xvHWZvL3aRk
Denise
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1 posted 10-17-2009 10:12 AM       View Profile for Denise   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Denise

2010 can't come soon enough.
Bob K
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2 posted 10-18-2009 06:26 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     The documents need to be subpoenaed and the investigation needs to be pressed aggressively.  There should be no more slack, from my point of view, for Democrats than there is for Republicans around this sort of stuff.  If I had my way, because I'm a Democrat, I'd rather there were a bit less, though I supposed that's being silly.  I still feel that way, though.
Local Rebel
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3 posted 10-18-2009 08:23 PM       View Profile for Local Rebel   Email Local Rebel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Local Rebel

While I'm generally of the opinion that justice delayed is justice denied I think the Republicans have gone a bit over the top on this.

The Elephants have their own website up for this committee http://republicans.oversight.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&view=frontpage& Itemid=1
but completely ignore the official committee website; http://oversight.house.gov/story.asp?ID=2638

quote:

Thursday, October 15, 2009
Oversight Committee Business Meeting Postponed

For Immediate Release: Thursday, October 15, 2009
Contact: Oversight and Government Reform Press Office, (202) 225-5051

Oversight Committee Postpones Scheduled Business Meeting

Washington, DC The Committee on Oversight and Government Reform business meeting scheduled for today has been postponed to a date to be determined. This is due to conflicts Members of the Committee have with a Committee on Financial Services Markup on the consumer financial protection agency.



While I'm all in favor of investigations proceeding and subpoenas being served -- I think there is some Kindergartenish behavior here -- but it lies with those who forgot to represent what really happened on October 15.

A better source for discussion of the issue might have been the WSJ:

quote:

Senators Chris Dodd and Kent Conrad lawyered up when the Senate ethics committee asked about their VIP loans from Countrywide Financial. But the sweetheart Senators may not be able to stop another look at their dealings with the subprime mortgage factory. A Democrat on the House oversight committee, Illinois freshman Mike Quigley, tells us that he supports a subpoena to obtain documents on the "Friends of Angelo" loan program.

Named for former Countrywide CEO Angelo Mozilo, the program was used to curry influence with government officials. Bank of America, which bought the failed lender last year, has said it's ready to turn over the files as soon as it receives a subpoena.

We're told that, at a closed Thursday meeting of Democrats on the House oversight committee, several Members urged Chairman Edolphus Towns (D., N.Y.) to allow a vote on California Republican Darrell Issa's proposal to issue the subpoena. Mr. Towns received two mortgage loans from the Countrywide unit that processed VIP loans but claims he received no special favors.

How long can Mr. Towns bottle up the subpoena vote? Mr. Quigley is urging Democrats to remember that ethical lapses helped end the GOP majority. "The right thing to do is also the smart thing to do," says Mr. Quigley. "Both parties must decide that they can't protect their members, no matter how powerful they are." Countrywide's efforts to obtain influence were not limited to one party, nor is there any guarantee that only Democrats like Messrs. Dodd and Conrad succumbed to Angelo's charms. As Mr. Quigley says, "Stupidity wears both hats."
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704322004574477711907 000406.html?mod=WSJ_hpp_sections_opinion

Bob K
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4 posted 10-18-2009 09:41 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



Ahhh!
Balladeer
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5 posted 10-18-2009 10:22 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

LR, you didn't bother copying the next paragraph..

Still, Mr. Issa tells us that he has all Republican members of the committee ready to vote for a subpoena. The aim is to find out the extent and impact of Countrywide's efforts to influence federal housing policy. This goes to the heart of the financial crisis. Countrywide was the largest originator of subprime loans and provided billions of dollars of mortgages to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, at huge cost to taxpayers.

SO what does all of this have to do with the Democrats sneaking out of the back door when the vote was due to come up?

Was the vote postponed before or after they made their escape....and what does "a date to be determined" mean to you. WOuld you care to hold your breath for that long?
Bob K
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6 posted 10-19-2009 12:22 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



Dear Mike,

           I don't want anybody to get away with anything either.

     I am, however, frankly shocked to see you upset about partial references, or incomplete references, or references with any hint of impropriety about them at all.  

     I am imagining some sort of celestial conversion experience that must have hit you like a two by four, so that we may now expect similar care in your own work.  I can hardly contain my excitement!

Ecstatically yours, Bob Kaven
Balladeer
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7 posted 10-19-2009 12:24 AM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Bob, would you repeat that in English, please?
Balladeer
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8 posted 10-19-2009 12:30 AM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

By the way, Bob, insults - even when eloquently phrased - do not change either the facts or the subject. You were much more honest in your first post on this thread..


By the  way again, you don't know me well enough to know  when I'm upset so please don't make yourself look silly by trying to declare when I am. I can point things out without being upset by them....can't you?
Bob K
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9 posted 10-19-2009 11:04 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K

  Dear Mike,

             I was still honest.

     I agree with you about the subject.

     I do find it funny that you're upset with somebody else for quoting out of context.  I guess I'm actually happy that you noticed.

     I don't think that Democratic violations of ethics are better than Republican violations of ethics; and, as I said above, I think they're a bit worse because I have higher expectations for the Democrats.  

     L.R. suggests there may be more to the story, and I'm interested in finding out about that as well, but I don't believe that Democrats of inherently less corruptible.  That would be a pretty silly assumption to make, just as the reverse is a silly assumption to make.  The Republicans have had the keys to the treasury for a long time, that's all.

     It would be very good if the Democrats were sharp about their own ethics violations.  That would be a good habit to get into.

     And you noticing the out of context stuff has a good side as well.  If you practice noticing it with us and you really should then you'll be more careful with your own.  And it doesn't hurt there, either.  I'm sorry if I hit any sore places, though.

Yours, Bob Kaven

Bob K
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10 posted 10-19-2009 11:20 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     I see upset conveyed in vocabulary choices, Mike.  They particularly come across in terms of verb use.  Verb use and noun choice convey attitude and emotion.  For me to say this to a fellow writer should be completely unnecessary.  If it's a matter of spontaneous writing first draft then it's generally not a particularly conscious word choice, which is why we often choose to revise.  Even so, the conscious choice of a word is a communication.

     Please don't tell me that you actually believe that you can communicate with me and not communicate at the same time.  Can't be done.  If you choose to write, you choose to communicate, and that includes feelings and attitudes.  You certainly can't assume that I've insulted you with one breath and then claim that I don't understand that your feelings have been hurt with another; either both of us can communicate in writing with a certain degree of accuracy or neither of us can.

     To suggest you have powers of comprehension that I don't is downright silly.

Sincerely, Bob Kaven
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11 posted 10-19-2009 01:30 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

I do find it funny that you're upset with somebody else for quoting out of context.

Once again, Bob, you are demonstrating some kind of clairvoyance or undetected super powers to be able to determine when I am upset. Whenever I am, I'll let you know...and there will be little doubt about it.

Challenging some one's response does not mean the person has to be upset to do it. Yes, I can picture you picturing me banging furiously on the computer keys, red-faced, eyes bulged out, screaming obscenities in  the air....sorry to burst that bubble, Bob. I added to LR's quote another paragraph which he didn't bother using. He did, however, provide the link which allowed me to read the entire thing. I do the same. Whether you agree or not on how I quote sources, the link is always there so you can see the entire thing for yourself. I don't see a problem with that. If you read the source and add a portion that I left out, that's fine....and I won't even call you being upset with me by doing it.
Bob K
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12 posted 10-19-2009 08:27 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



quote:

You certainly can't assume that I've insulted you with one breath and then claim that I don't understand that your feelings have been hurt with another; either both of us can communicate in writing with a certain degree of accuracy or neither of us can.

Balladeer
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13 posted 10-19-2009 09:21 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

and then claim that I don't understand that your feelings have been hurt

That's the point, Bob. My  feelings haven't been hurt outside of your imagination.

Anyway, that's enough of staying away from the actual topic or replies. Time to move on.....
Local Rebel
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14 posted 10-19-2009 11:00 PM       View Profile for Local Rebel   Email Local Rebel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Local Rebel

Arrrrgh!

You FOUND that paragraph!  I was hoping you wouldn't see it!  That's why I bothered to cite the article and bring it to everyone's attention!  I was hoping to avoid discussing it!

But, seriously.  um.....

I found a credible conservative source for the issue -- and -- I still get a complaint?

Mike -- maybe we shouldn't do this until you get better.  I saw my father get extremely paranoid on a PCA drip -- it's the nature of the drug my friend.

Hope you'll be better soon.
Bob K
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15 posted 10-20-2009 02:08 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



quote:

Challenging some one's response does not mean the person has to be upset to do it. Yes, I can picture you picturing me banging furiously on the computer keys, red-faced, eyes bulged out, screaming obscenities in  the air....sorry to burst that bubble, Bob



     Your imagination lives up to some of your most wonderful cartoons, Mike, but no, I hadn't gotten that specific.  I don't know what you look like when you're upset, but you make yourself sound like Yosemite Sam, which, when you think of it, is pretty wonderful.  I wish I could look like Yosemite Sam when I got upset.  I'm afraid I look more like Donald or Daffy Duck probably daffy, because I will occasionally go off in explosions of feathers, especially when I eat dynamite.  It is certainly not pretty at all.

     I wish I could shout Varmint! and wave blazing six-guns around harmlessly and turn beet color and pound at the key-board all at the same time.

     Yosemite Mike, doesn't sound all that bad, does it?  Daffy Bob?  Ha!
Bob K
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16 posted 10-20-2009 02:11 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



Dear L.R.,

          So much for reading Poe.  Hiding things out in the open like that needs to be even more blatant.  I find actually printing it in the text means it'll be overlooked or misread.  Footnotes not so much.

Sincerely, Bob Kaven
Balladeer
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17 posted 10-20-2009 06:51 AM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

You're right, gentlemen. Maybe I should take some time off and just read Beck's latest book. The title suggests it will remind me of posting here without actually doing it  
Bob K
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18 posted 10-20-2009 11:53 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     Gotta be careful, there, Mike.  Too much of that stuff and they'll pull you over.  If they find all those copies of Beck's latest in the back seat, it's DWI city for sure, no matter how sympathetic the officers may be.  Maybe just one, Mike, but only a little at a time, and not while you're driving.

Balladeer
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19 posted 10-20-2009 01:44 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

I assume that's Driving While Inspired, Bob?
Bob K
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20 posted 10-20-2009 07:01 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     Thank you, Mike.  I forget that you have that fresh and quirky sense of humor that breaks through at the most endearing times.  Of which that was one.
Balladeer
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