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Passions in Poetry

Birth of a notion

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Balladeer
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25 posted 08-05-2009 05:11 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Bob, I saw no problem with the Patriot Act, just like all of the Democrats who voted for it.

As far as upsetting me, don't worry about that, Bob. You don't have that power.

Best to you...
moonbeam
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26 posted 04-11-2011 05:33 AM       View Profile for moonbeam   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for moonbeam

What a horrible notion:

Donald as President and Sarah as Vice (president, I mean).  Or vice versa, an even worse nightmare.

And lo and behold, they potentially seemed be in harmony over one of the nuttier Evil O theories:
http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/The-Vote/2011/0410/Did-Sarah-Palin-just-join-Donald-Trump-as-a-birther

Do these people not have better things to do than worry about the trivialities of where someone was born?  Does it really matter what the Framers said on this point?  

Personally, I think Donald should jump off one of his skyscrapers before Sarah tires of murdering moose and bears and takes to shooting ducks.

Balladeer
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27 posted 04-11-2011 07:46 AM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Does it matter what the framers said?
Does it matter what congress says?
Does it matter what the constitution says?

There seems to be a recurrent theme in many of your comments, mb, but it really doesn't matter
moonbeam
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28 posted 04-11-2011 08:56 AM       View Profile for moonbeam   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for moonbeam

Actually it matters to me

Yes of course there is a recurrent theme, and it's a theme that is generally responsive in nature.

By which I mean that I have a tendency to challenge statements that make assertions based upon blind acceptance of human laws (especially antiquated law) and statute rather than commonsense, morality and compassion (to name but a few).

Imv over the centuries far too many injustices have been perpetuated by to use of petty legal points, outdated law, and partisan statute.  I think it's essential to question the relevance and appropriateness of our laws and precedences at all times.
Ron
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29 posted 04-11-2011 10:56 AM       View Profile for Ron   Email Ron   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Ron's Home Page   View IP for Ron

quote:
  I think it's essential to question the relevance and appropriateness of our laws and precedences at all times.

I couldn't agree more. But, having questioned them, what then? Does one work to change what needs to be changed? Or does one choose to simply ignore the laws and precedences they don't like?

Isn't the word for that anarchy?


moonbeam
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30 posted 04-11-2011 11:15 AM       View Profile for moonbeam   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for moonbeam

     I think it's essential to question the relevance and appropriateness of our laws and precedences at all times.


I couldn't agree more. But, having questioned them, what then? Does one work to change what needs to be changed? Or does one choose to simply ignore the laws and precedences they don't like?

Isn't the word for that anarchy?


"precedences" - geez, I must have been half asleep.  Don't I mean "precedents" - maybe it's just a senior moment.

Well Ron, to be honest I wasn't really going beyond the point of expressing mild frustration at the propensity to simply quote law and precedent without, as it were, engaging one's brain.  

However as you invite me to go further, I suppose the idealists answer to your question is that one works within the system (even if that means the very laws that are suspect) to change what needs to be changed.

The pragmatic answer is more complex.  Partly, it depends who you are I guess.

Some might suggest that one you have worked the system to the point where you are President, then, although not above the law, you at least have a position of authority that allows you to push the boundaries (as with Libya maybe).

Then of couse there are times where one might argue that the law is so very out of touch with social acceptability, and is held there only by minority vested interests perhaps, that something more forceful or revolutionary is the "only" option.  Of course. it gets very complicated then, far more complicated than I have time for now.



Ron
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31 posted 04-11-2011 11:40 AM       View Profile for Ron   Email Ron   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Ron's Home Page   View IP for Ron

quote:
"precedences" - geez, I must have been half asleep.  Don't I mean "precedents" - maybe it's just a senior moment.

LOL. That's funny, because I just assumed it was one of those crazy English spelling things.

quote:
Some might suggest that one you have worked the system to the point where you are President, then, although not above the law, you at least have a position of authority that allows you to push the boundaries (as with Libya maybe).

Or one might argue that those sworn to uphold the law should be held to an even higher standard.

Mind you, I don't think the President broke any laws. 'Cause if he did those Republicans would be all over him like flies on dead meat. Y'all remember Nixon? And that was back when most politicians arguably cared more about hurting their country than boosting their party. You know, the long lost Good Ol' Days?


 
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