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Confused

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Denise
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25 posted 04-10-2009 12:05 PM       View Profile for Denise   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Denise

I think what has become the bigger issue in this is the fact that the White House is LYING about it, boldly, unashamedly, in the face of video evidence. That is truly disturbing.
Bob K
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26 posted 04-10-2009 12:06 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K

Dear Ron,

           I hadn't seen that my 4/9 message on this had been edited until I had a look today.  Thank you for your effort.  

Sincerely, Bob Kaven
Huan Yi
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27 posted 04-10-2009 12:15 PM       View Profile for Huan Yi   Email Huan Yi   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Huan Yi

.
“Good grief, does it really matter in the grand scheme of things whether and why he bowed?  “

“This concern about showing subservience.  Gawd almighty, what's wrong with a bit of humility?  Have you no idea how much damage the US does to itself by its perceived determination not ever to be wrong or humble?  Have you any idea how much stronger and more generous your country looks when its leader does shows some humility and understanding of other cultures?  It's precisely when a country (or person) resorts to the "I'm never wrong" scenario that it betrays its weakness. “

I agree.
He should have kneeled.

.
moonbeam
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28 posted 04-10-2009 12:34 PM       View Profile for moonbeam   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for moonbeam

No Huan, I think that would have been seen as mocking by exaggeration, as cheap a trick as sarcasm, don't you agree?

Mike and Denise, you are both right of course, I was only addressing part of Tim's original point, lying is definitely not good.

Essorant
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29 posted 04-10-2009 12:37 PM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

I don't think the president needs to try to justify a token of respect.  Period.

But I agree that denying that he bowed would be a shame if he actually did.  Is Obama himself denying it?
Huan Yi
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30 posted 04-10-2009 03:24 PM       View Profile for Huan Yi   Email Huan Yi   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Huan Yi

.

Mea culpa
Mea culpa

.
Denise
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31 posted 04-10-2009 04:14 PM       View Profile for Denise   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Denise

Moonbeam, sarcasm isn't a cheap trick. It's an art form!

Ess, Obama won't come out personally and deny it at this point. That would only add fuel to the fire. He's content to leave the lying to his staff, I'm sure. That way he can truthfully say that he never personally denied it.
moonbeam
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32 posted 04-10-2009 04:17 PM       View Profile for moonbeam   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for moonbeam

Heh.  Yes Denise, and the only one I'm really good at .

So the staff are lying?
Denise
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33 posted 04-10-2009 04:46 PM       View Profile for Denise   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Denise

I'm sure you have many other talents as well, Moonbeam!

Yes, it is my conclusion that the staff are lying.
moonbeam
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34 posted 04-10-2009 05:48 PM       View Profile for moonbeam   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for moonbeam

Rotf - I was talking strictly about art Denise.  As I was saying to a dear friend earlier today - I have absolutely no clue about perspective.

Which is possibly why I'm so argumentative.
Balladeer
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35 posted 04-10-2009 08:30 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

The White House is denying that the president bowed to King Abdullah of Saudi Arabia at a G-20 meeting in London, a scene that drew criticism on the right and praise from some Arab outlets.

"It wasn't a bow. He grasped his hand with two hands, and he's taller than King Abdullah," said an Obama aide, who spoke on the condition of anonymity.

.
.



Maybe he had a sudden attack of the stomach flu at precisely the minute he was shaking hands with the sheik? At least one of Clinton's aides could have come up with that one!
Denise
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36 posted 04-10-2009 08:42 PM       View Profile for Denise   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Denise

Or maybe that he was just picking up the Ipod that he dropped on the floor that he bought as a gift for the king!

Hmmmm...I wonder what he did buy as a gift for the king. I didn't hear mention of that, only that he bought the queen an Ipod.
Huan Yi
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37 posted 04-10-2009 09:23 PM       View Profile for Huan Yi   Email Huan Yi   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Huan Yi

.

“Mea culpa
Mea culpa”

Loose Translation:

I”m bowing
I’m bowing”


.

Sunshine
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38 posted 04-10-2009 10:04 PM       View Profile for Sunshine   Email Sunshine   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Sunshine's Home Page   View IP for Sunshine

Actually, Huan, mea culpa is:

quote:
me·a cul·pa (m klp, m)
n.
An acknowledgment of a personal error or fault.
Free Dictionary
So, maybe he steps on some toes?

Balladeer
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39 posted 04-10-2009 11:30 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Poor Gibbs....he was on tv tonight in a press conference where he was asked about the bow. He smiled and said, "No, it wasn't a bow. He was reaching down to shake both hands." When told that the video showed Obama only shaking one hand, with a hand in the cookie jar look, he said, "Well, that happened a long time ago".

THAT is the irritating part. If it's a non-issue, why lie about it....and why lie when evidence is so abundant that you did lie? Those are actions of people so full of themselves they don't really care what you think. They are Joe Biden talking about stopping by a diner during his campaign to have coffee with friends - a diner that coincidently had been closed for over 20 years. They don't care if they get caught or not....they just keep doing it, anyway.
Ringo
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40 posted 04-10-2009 11:54 PM       View Profile for Ringo   Email Ringo   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Ringo

Never mind

But this one goes to eleven... http://www.hubpages.com/profile/RingoShort
Essorant
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41 posted 04-11-2009 01:49 AM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

So anytime someone leans or bends in front of someone or something it is "bowing"?  You are "bowing" to your grandmother if she is short and you lean downwards to hug her?  You are "bowing" to your cat  when you lean down to pet it?  "Bowing" even to the toilet when you lean down to flush it?  I don't think so.  

A bow is not a bow in the ceremonious sense unless it is intended to be.  And only Obama knows if he intended it to be.  Pretending you know better just because you saw what it looked like on some video, isn't how to judge something respectfully.  For there is more to things than just the superficial appearance:  There is the truth and the meaning behind it.


Local Rebel
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42 posted 04-11-2009 03:28 AM       View Profile for Local Rebel   Email Local Rebel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Local Rebel

Obama bows to GW and Laura Bush? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsS7OLYWtac

Obama bows to the Queen of England? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYLuLEfVNow&feature=related

Obama bows to the Saudi King? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WlqW6UCeaY&feature=related

Balladeer
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43 posted 04-11-2009 07:53 AM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

You're right, Essorant. I bow to my toilet regularly!


and, of course, cats DEMAND that you bow to them! Believe me, I know!
Grinch
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44 posted 04-11-2009 09:35 AM       View Profile for Grinch   Email Grinch   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Grinch


quote:
THAT is the irritating part. If it's a non-issue, why lie about it


If you ask me I’d say it was a bow, that would be my opinion, my best guess evaluation of a situation I didn’t witness first hand. It could be that I’m mistaken of course, that I interpreted it wrong. In which case you could, quite rightly, level a claim that I was wrong or that I was mistaken, but would that make me a liar?

I honestly don’t think so.

Here’s an interesting conundrum for you Mike, if Bob and Ess think that it’s not a bow am I to presume that you think they’re liars too? Or could it be that they’re simply mistaken?

Essorant
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45 posted 04-11-2009 02:28 PM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

I must be confused, because I don't even agree with some of the things I said in my previous comment anymore. Obviously he bent downwards in greeting and that would be a bow I think.  But I don't want to make anymore ado about this.  There are better things to do then turn a twosecond bow into a contraversy.

Balladeer
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46 posted 04-11-2009 04:19 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Here�s an interesting conundrum for you Mike, if Bob and Ess think that it�s not a bow am I to presume that you think they�re liars too? Or could it be that they�re simply mistaken?

If Bob and Ess don't think it's a bow then it is because of partisan thinking and sticking up for their "guy". Essorant has since come out and said it is a bow so that leaves Bob. If the video were of Bush, it would be not only a bow but a curtsey and a loo-de-loop, also. That's ok.

It's so funny because it was such a non-issue. The fact that he is bowing is a fact, just by looking at the pic and video. The fact that the white house lied about it is also a fact, from the "no bow" to the "two-handed handshake".

All any of these people had to say was, "Fine. It was a bow - so what?" and it would have been a dead issue. Instead we have all of this energy (and dishonesty) trying to convince people of something clearly visible on tape to be untrue. It's like the husband caught in bed with the maid, saying to the wife, "Are you gonna believe what you see or what I tell you?"

One has to wonder if they are going through all of this in CYA mode over such a small item, what will they do on the important ones? That's a question everyone should wonder about.

Anyway, I narrowed down to these possibilities:

(1) Obama had a back spasm at the minute he reached to shake hands

(2) Obama was admiring the shine on the sheik's slippers

(3) Obama suffers from ADD. "Nice to meet you, shei....OH! LOOK AT THAT MOUSE!!!

(4) Obama bowed.

Take your pick
Grinch
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47 posted 04-11-2009 04:26 PM       View Profile for Grinch   Email Grinch   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Grinch


I’ve changed my mind too Mike.

It definitely wasn’t a bow and anyone who thinks otherwise is a..

err..mistaken person.

Bob K
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48 posted 04-11-2009 04:54 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



Dear folks,

          If my post from last evening was to be redacted in it's entirety, please do me the courtesy of placing a note in the thread saying that that was the case, even if you do not chose to make note of the contents.  I would not care to let people assume that I would allow this sort of discussion continue without letting my thoughts be known, even if they were not chosen for acknowledgement.  
Balladeer
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49 posted 04-11-2009 05:25 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

No problem, grinch. Anyone who doesn't agree with you probably saw the photo or the video or saw Gibbs. red-faced, trying to lie his way out of it. Disregarding reality is simple...even a blind man can do it
 
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