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Balladeer
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75 posted 11-04-2008 07:53 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

That's not true, serene one. There must be SOMEBODY out there who listens to you!
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76 posted 11-04-2008 08:06 PM       View Profile for Denise   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Denise

No he wasn't arrested, Jen, but he should have been. I guess the police had to make a call as to whether they wanted to risk inciting increased tension, or just thought it best to try to diffuse the situation. But technically the guy should have been arrested for having that billy club and assuming a menancing stance with it in front of the polling place.
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77 posted 11-04-2008 08:20 PM       View Profile for JenniferMaxwell   Email JenniferMaxwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JenniferMaxwell

I understand how you feel, Denise, about the guy with the night stick not being arrested. I was just as shocked when I learned that a Bush appointed prosecutor dropped charges against the three skinheads who had weapons and threatened to kill Obama.

[This message has been edited by JenniferMaxwell (11-04-2008 09:01 PM).]

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78 posted 11-04-2008 09:18 PM       View Profile for Denise   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Denise

That is shocking. Where did you hear that? The last I read was on the 30th where a Federal Magistrate said they must remain in jail. There were three? I thought it was two skinheads.
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79 posted 11-04-2008 09:21 PM       View Profile for JenniferMaxwell   Email JenniferMaxwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JenniferMaxwell

Sorry, Denise, I messed up. I meant the three arrested in Colorado around convention time. The two skinheads are still in custody as far as I know.
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80 posted 11-05-2008 02:58 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



     I saw the McCain concession speech and thought it was a class act all the way.  I'm very sorry that anything marred the vote in Philadelphia; there's no excuse for it at all.  I'd like to get a more fully detailed report in a day or two, because the details often change over time as reporters have a chance to digest and get the accounts straight.  Perhaps there were more panthers, perhaps it was a matter that the police reacted to in a way that was more appropriate than we're in a position to judge at this point.  I'm simply sorry that any incident took place at all.

     I'm upset that the events made the day more difficult for the Republican folks here who tied high hopes to the election, though I have nothing but praise for the way that McCain dealt with his concession speech.  It would be nice if we could all find some way of working across the aisle.  There's a lot of stuff that needs to be done, and if the Democrats try to do it without the support of the Republicans, it's not going to work out as well as it might otherwise.  The Democrats are going to have to learn to be a bit flexible.  I certainly hope Obama will find some method for returning some of the powers the executive branch has gotten away from the legislative branch back to proper hands.  I 'd like to see greater access to Freedom of Information documents, for example, now and some investigations of exactly what's been happening in our names here and around the world.  Even if this means we may have to give up possible prosecutions to get a full account of the truth, it may be worth it.  But the truth about some of this stuff should be gotten out.  And the damage to the democracy somehow must be healed.

Sincerely, Bob Kaven
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81 posted 11-05-2008 03:39 AM       View Profile for serenity blaze   Email serenity blaze   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for serenity blaze

Mike?



.....................>

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82 posted 11-05-2008 07:58 AM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

I certainly hope Obama will find some method for returning some of the powers the executive branch has gotten away from the legislative branch back to proper hands

The "proper hands" being Pelosi, Reed and Murtha? Now THAT is REALLY scary!

Obama gave a brilliant acceptance speech at the end of the day. There is no doubt he is a class act. Time will tell for the rest. I wish him (and us) the best.
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83 posted 11-05-2008 08:01 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



Dear Mike,

           Unfortunately, these folks didn't put up as much of a fight about giving these rights up as I would have wanted them to.  This is not the first time you've heard me say that; it's a bitter truth.  If I recall correctly, some of the ideas in the patriot act and in the Homeland security bill were democratic creations.  That is as bitter or more bitter a pill for me to swallow.  I think the Democrats should have stood their ground against the rising tide of neo-conservative anti-democratic (the principle, not the party) rhetoric.  It was more difficult for them than they were able to do.  They were not principled enough for me, though I don't know if what they did do was wise in political terms or not.  It may have ensured their survival on some level.

     The animus you bear these people is on entirely different grounds.  I will not criticize you for it at this point.  I have tried to suggest that people need to work together to make this country an ongoing enterprise when President Bush and his Friends were running things.  I would be wrong to say differently now.  The next four yours will be difficult enough without pretending my brothers and my sisters are my enemies; we will need to lean on each other to find a way to pay back the debt we've run up and to put the economy back on track and to earn back the respect we've given up in the world.

     I know that it must have been a tough Tuesday for you, but I do hope that all is well.  Best wishes to you.

Sincerely,  Bob Kaven

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84 posted 11-05-2008 08:20 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Bob, 'tough" is when I'm holding three aces and someone hits a gutshot straight to beat me out of a hand they shouldn't have been in in the first place. Tuesday wasn't tough...it was simply disappointing, but not unexpected. The cards were stacked against McCain, carrying the weight of an unpopular president, with a press that ran negative stories of McCain over Obama by a ration of over 3 to 1, and the simple fact that McCain was not that strong of a contender, although he did his best. It would have been a shock to have seen McCain even come close, all things considered.

It was tougher seeing slime like Murtha get re-elected, although the Florida ladies' man got shot down at least.

The "tough" days are the ones that will come when we get "tested". That worries me.
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85 posted 11-06-2008 04:01 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K


Dear Mike,

          You and I ought to have a conversation about your thinking about the press and the conservatives some time.  I disagree with many of your conclusions.  In some of the "negative" coverage of McCain by the press, straight reportage was apparently considered "negative coverage."  For example, a report saying that McCain was five points behind in the polls was "negative."  It was also straight factual reportage and didn't reflect any sort of slanting of the news in favor of one candidate or the other.  This sort of rote repetition of standard positions voiced by talk show hosts such as O'Reilly and Hannity  are not, I believe, born out by examination of the facts.  When things have gotten a bit quieter, maybe we can have a look at some of them together?

     You may feel Representative Murtha is slime.  I would point out to you that that his district seems to disagree with you.  He does have a Bronze Star and a couple of Purple Hearts.  He was in the Marines, and the woman who  said that he was a coward on the floor of the House Apologized for saying it in the first place, and claimed that she was quoting a Marine who'd written her.  The Marine in question said he'd never said any such thing, and the Lady in question was somehow unable to find any  evidence to support her claim.

     I didn't like anything about Abscam, myself, and I think that Murtha should have been a lot clearer about turning down the bribe.  Myself, I think that the overall level of discomfort I have with the thing is about the same as I have for McCain and The Keating Five, which I wasn't all that thrilled with either, but which overall didn't seem to cook McCain's goose.  I saw no reason for Murtha's level of non-involvement in Abscam to cook Murtha's either.  I understand you may well disagree, but I don't believe I'd like to accuse either of them of being slime.

     The gentleman in Florida's problems with having affairs I believe  were very much bad news.  I was glad he was voted out, though I would have been pleased at having the extra Democrat in office.  He seemed a very unpleasant man overall.  I'm glad he's gone.  Maybe he can use his extra time to work on his marriage, if his wife will have him.  Yuck.

     As you said in your note:
     "The "tough" days are the ones that will come when we get "tested". That worries me."

     It worries me too.  Biden said it was coming, and before the concession speech was over we had stuff coming in from Carzai — if that's how you spell it — from Kabul and the new Russian President threatening to give very hard-line responses to our "defense shield" deployments in Eastern Europe.  There's that George Bush foreign policy for you, the gift that keeps on giving.
Oh good.  

     Apparently we living in interesting times.

     I still wish you well, and hope you have a good weekend.  Best of luck,  Best wishes,  Bob Kaven
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86 posted 11-06-2008 07:40 AM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

There's that George Bush foreign policy for you, the gift that keeps on giving.

Ah, yes. That shall be the mantra of the Democratic party for years now. Whatever goes wrong, whatever problems surface in the future, whatever promises Obama made that can't be kept will all elicit that Democratic response. I confess I didn't think it would be used so early, like one day after the election, but it's not surprising.

I'm afraid we could never have a conversation over press coverage, Bob, because we are way too far seperate in our conclusions, although I think it would be pleasant to sit down over a cup of coffee and try. I'll get some facts that do NOT come from Fox or Hannity or Rush and get back to you. It's all there.

Enjoy your Thursday and, if it rains, please don't blame Bush for screwing up the environment and causing it
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87 posted 11-06-2008 04:51 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



Dear Mike,

          I don't know about Afghanistan, Mike.  I tend to think that he backed off when he should have pressed.  The result might have been at this point different and more to our liking.  That's a big Might Have, of course.  If possibly we'd have taken the Taliban up on their offer of turning Bin Ladin over to a neutral third party in 2002, things could be substantially different now.  I wouldn't know how to judge, but a "yes," on our part would have been a very inexpensive step one.  

     There are a lot if "ifs" in between, though.  

     None of them were helped by Bush's comment about saying that he didn't think about bin Ladin a few years back.  That Bib Ladin wasn't all that important.  

     That sort of unannounced vacillation in foreign policy is indeed a gift that kept on giving; among others, it gave to the Democrats.  It was poor foreign policy.

     Pushing against Russian borders when there is apparent peace between the two countries is a pretty clear way of getting a crazy response.  This is exactly what Bush managed to get, and he managed to get it at a time when he's leaving office, making it a problem for his Democratic successor.  This is a gift that will keep on giving.  It will take a certain amount of artfulness to sidestep a confrontation with the Russians while maintaining a posture of some strength in the world and at the same time deal with the financial problems.  Again, This is a gift that will keep on giving, and a hearty and sarcastic thanks is due to the current administration for this gift as well.

     I can imagine the congressional rhetoric as I write.  I would rather that the new President have time to address the financial problems directly, without demands that large amounts of money be spent at this point for a military repair budget that's been put off ever since President Bush said it was urgent in 2000, and then ground down the army he was given by his predecessor, Bill Clinton in what many of us have seen as an ill chosen adventure, extraordinarily disrespectful of the lives and the personal fates of the troops he was given the honor of commanding.  

Sincerely yours,  Bob Kaven  
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88 posted 11-06-2008 04:57 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Murtha’s War Hero Status Called Into Question

By Marc Morano and Randy Hall
January 13, 2006

(CNSNews.com) - Having ascended to the national stage as one of the most vocal critics of President Bush’s handling of the war in Iraq, Pennsylvania Democratic Congressman John Murtha has long downplayed the controversy and the bitterness surrounding the two Purple Hearts he was awarded for military service in Vietnam.

Murtha is a retired marine and was the first Vietnam combat veteran elected to Congress. Since 1967, there have been at least three different accounts of the injuries that purportedly earned Murtha his Purple Hearts. Those accounts also appear to conflict with the limited military records that are available, and Murtha has thus far refused to release his own military records.

A Cybercast News Service investigation also reveals that one of Murtha’s former Democratic congressional colleagues and a fellow decorated Vietnam veteran, Don Bailey of Pennsylvania, alleges that Murtha admitted during an emotional conversation on the floor of the U.S. House in the early 1980s that he did not deserve his Purple Hearts.

http://sweetness-light.com/archive/murthas-purple-hearts-questioned

slime.

A published report that U.S. Rep. Jack Murtha “threatened to withdraw support from a defense project” after a spat with fellow U.S. Rep. Todd Tiahrt may have placed him afoul of House ethics rules, research by the Majority Accountability Project (majorityap.com) has found.According to the May 8, 2007, report in the Hill newspaper, Murtha was irate that Tiahrt voted against a $23 million project in Murtha’s district. Murtha allegedly retaliated “by unleashing a loud, finger-jabbing, spittle-spraying piece of his mind” against Tiahrt, threatening to withdraw his support for a project that would create between 800-1,000 jobs in the Kansas Republican’s district.

slime


In the early 1980’s, Murtha was named an “unindicted co-conspirator” in the Abscam investigation, an FBI sting operation where agents posed as Arab sheiks and offered bribes to a host of elected officials. Six members of Congress - one Senator and five U.S. Representatives - were later convicted of conspiracy and taking bribes.

slime

More recently, questions were raised about Murtha’s relationship with the lobbying firm of his brother, Robert “Kit” Murtha. According a 2005 Los Angeles Times study, Murtha authored legislation that “benefited at least 10 companies represented” by Kit Murtha’s firm, costing taxpayers almost $21 million dollars. Another employee of the firm was Carmen Scialabba, “who worked for Rep. Murtha for 27 years.”

slime

In June, 2006, the Washington Times reported that Murtha “leaned on U.S. Navy officials to sign a contract to transfer the Hunters Point Shipyard to the city of San Francisco.” According to that report, “Laurence Pelosi, nephew of House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi, at the time was an executive of the company which owned the rights to the land.”

slime

Here you can also see the FBI video of Murtha taken during the Abscam scandal...
http://majorityap.com/Did-Murtha-violate-House-ethics-rules

slime and double slime


In the on-going controversy over the defamation lawsuit against Rep. Jack Murtha, one of the collateral issues has been whether the Marines that he accused of a massacre would be tried for murder. Today, it appears that there will be no such charges coming out of the killing of roughly two dozen Iraqi citizens in the town of Haditha in November 2005. The recommendation is that Sgt. Frank Wuterich face trial for lesser charges of negligent homicide.
Murtha is in hot water because he indicated that he was basing his decision on information from an official source – making it more difficult to argue opinion. He also made the comments outside of Congress – stripping away his constitutional protection as a member of Congress.


slime

Murtha's Freddie/Fannie Distortions

John Murtha has taken some pretty stiff criticism for slandering his constituents as racists -- and deservedly so. But it's worth looking at the rest of his recent interview to get a sense of how he views the credit crunch. Here's how Murtha describes how we got into this financial mess:

    Six months ago they said to me... Paul Kanjorski - who's on the Banking Committee said 'Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac aren't going to make it. A hundred banks are going to go bankrupt.' I said 'well what the hell are we doing about it? What do you mean?' I could hardly believe that. Finally the president kept saying things are all right. Well the president has no credibility. When he says something nobody believes that.

    And so finally Bernanke and Paulson came over. Scared the hell out of us. I mean, scared us... made us... convinced us that we had to do something. And of course they sent a 3 pages thing over -- an open door.'

It's amazing that even after all the discussion about this crisis over the last few weeks, Murtha is either so oblivious to current events, or so non-plussed about not telling the truth. In September, 2003, the president proposed a new agency to oversee Fannie and Freddie because they were extended too far. In May, 2005, John McCain warned of the threat faced by the two GSEs. There were literally dozens of warnings from the White House. And John Murtha takes so little interest in the issue that the first inkling he had of trouble was when Paul Kanjorski told him 6 months ago? Murtha paints a picture that does not reflect reality. He is either foolish or dishonest--or both.
http://www.weeklystandard.com/weblogs/TWSFP/2008/10/murthas_freddiefannie_distorti.asp[/ URL]  [URL=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybgHkAPBVFI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybgHkAPBVFI

slime

Murtha named as one of ten worst members of Congress
By Wally Edge

Democratic Congressman John Murtha is having a real bad week. First he calls his district and Western Pa. racist, then he cancels out of a candidate forum so he doesn't need to face the constituents he called racists. William Russell then posts a fundraising quarter of $1.6 million and to top it off Esquire has named Murtha as one of the ten worst members of Congress.

http://www.politickerpa.com/wallyedgepa/2188/murtha-named-one-ten-worst-members-congre ss
JenniferMaxwell
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89 posted 11-06-2008 05:44 PM       View Profile for JenniferMaxwell   Email JenniferMaxwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for JenniferMaxwell

http://www.alternet.org/story/38145/
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90 posted 11-06-2008 05:59 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Here you go, Bob. Not a Fox among them......

How the Media Vote. Surveys of journalists’ self-reported voting habits show them backing the Democratic candidate in every presidential election since 1964, including landslide losers George McGovern, Walter Mondale and Michael Dukakis. In 2004, a poll conducted by the University of Connecticut found journalists backed John Kerry over George W. Bush by a greater than two-to-one margin.  See Section.

Journalists’ Political Views. Compared to their audiences, journalists are far more likely to say they are Democrats or liberals, and they espouse liberal positions on a wide variety of issues. A 2004 poll by the Pew Research Center for The People & The Press found five times more journalists described themselves as “liberal” as said they were “conservative.” See Section.

How the Public Views the Media. In increasing numbers, the viewing audiences recognize the media’s liberal tilt. Gallup polls have consistently found that three times as many see the media as “too liberal” as see a media that is “too conservative.” A 2005 survey conducted for the American Journalism Review found nearly two-thirds of the public disagreed with the statement, “The news media try to report the news without bias,” and 42 percent of adults disagreed strongly. See Section.

Admissions of Liberal Bias. A number of journalists have admitted that the majority of their brethren approach the news from a liberal angle. During the 2004 presidential campaign, for example, Newsweek’s Evan Thomas predicted that sympathetic media coverage would boost Kerry’s vote by “maybe 15 points,” which he later revised to five points. In 2005, ex-CBS News President Van Gordon Sauter confessed he stopped watching his old network: “The unremitting liberal orientation finally became too much for me.” See Section

http://www.mediaresearch.org/biasbasics/biasbasics1.asp


Conservatives are utterly convinced that the mainstream news organizations have been deeply unfair to the Republican ticket, and they have some points they can cite as evidence. For example, the Project for Excellence in Journalism found that there were twice as many favorable Obama stories after the convention as favorable McCain ones. Conversely, twice as many McCain stories were negative. The Center for Media and Public Affairs found that network TV coverage of Obama was 65 percent positive, compared to 31 percent positive for McCain. As Politico.com put it: "in the closing weeks of this election, John McCain and Sarah Palin are getting hosed in the press." Indeed, one of the editors of Politico.com received a scolding note about bias from his own mother.

Then there's also the well-known fact that national reporters for major news organizations are disproportionately likely to vote Democratic. Slate.com polled its staff and found that Barack Obama won 55 votes, and John McCain 1. That's partly because Slate's staff is composed of young, urban, highly educated techies, but still -- that's some margin.
http://www.mediaresearch.org/cyberalerts/2008/cyb20081105.asp#8

Media Bias Is Real, Finds UCLA Political Scientist
By
Meg Sullivan
| 12/14/2005 5:36:31 PM

While the editorial page of The Wall Street Journal is conservative, the newspaper's news pages are liberal, even more liberal than The New York Times. The Drudge Report may have a right-wing reputation, but it leans left. Coverage by public television and radio is conservative compared to the rest of the mainstream media. Meanwhile, almost all major media outlets tilt to the left.

These are just a few of the surprising findings from a UCLA-led study, which is believed to be the first successful attempt at objectively quantifying bias in a range of media outlets and ranking them accordingly.

"I suspected that many media outlets would tilt to the left because surveys have shown that reporters tend to vote more Democrat than Republican," said Tim Groseclose, a UCLA political scientist and the study's lead author. "But I was surprised at just how pronounced the distinctions are."

"Overall, the major media outlets are quite moderate compared to members of Congress, but even so, there is a quantifiable and significant bias in that nearly all of them lean to the left," said co‑author Jeffrey Milyo, University of Missouri economist and public policy scholar.

The results appear in the latest issue of the Quarterly Journal of Economics, which will become available in mid-December.
http://newsroom.ucla.edu/portal/ucla/Media-Bias-Is-Real-Finds-UCLA-6664.aspx
You're not imagining things - the national press has been beating John McCain and Sarah Palin over the head. And now there's an academic study that proves it.

The Project for Excellence in Journalism of the Pew Research Center (which has never been accused of harboring conservative sympathies) concludes: "Coverage of McCain has been heavily unfavorable - and has become more so over time."

How unfavorable?

According to Pew's survey of 2,412 stories from 48 news outlets during the period between the end of the conventions through the final presidential debate, negative stories about McCain outweighed positive ones "by a factor of more than three to one."

Indeed, fully 57 percent of news stories on McCain were negative; only 14 percent were positive.

For Palin, the figures were 39 percent negative and 28 positive - and most of those positive stories appeared right after she was nominated.

The study's authors played it safe: "For a story to be deemed as having a negative or positive spin," says Pew, "it must be clearly so, not a close call."

And this is just a select bunch of news stories. It doesn't reflect the negative drumbeat against the GOP ticket from other parts of the media, including late-night and early-morning talk shows, cable news and the blogs.

Nor does it cover the period since the last debate - when coverage of McCain, by Pew's own accounts, was growing increasingly negative.

To be sure, the folks at Pew bend over backward not to interpret their own findings as evidence of conscious journalistic bias, calling it inconclusive.

But hey, the numbers pretty much speak for themselves.
http://www.nypost.com/seven/11012008/postopinion/editorials/media_bias_made_scientific_136350.htm

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Journalists are mostly Democrats.

So what?

The people get what the people want.

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Journalists are supposed to be the watch dogs of government and those who wish to obtain power in government. They aren't supposed to be in bed with them.
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93 posted 11-06-2008 07:30 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Spiffy reply, grinch. Nice work...

Journalists, at least in the past, were supposed to have been unbiased in their reporting. Their job was to convey facts, allowing the listener to make up their own minds. Yes, they had their own political affiliations but they were to be left at the door before sitting down at the mike. They have since become Ellsworth Tooheys, fashioning their broadcasts and news medias to sway public opinion.

Yes, I know. What an old-fashioned way to think. That's why newspaper sales and advertising is down and mainstream news viewers have gone to cable. The liberal press has been so blatant in their prejudices, they have exposed themselves to even the most forgiving audience.

They are not to be taken seriously any longer. The Murrows and the Cronkites are relics of the past when the media reported the news, not created it.
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WASHINGTON (AFP) - The official website of US President-elect Barack Obama for his transition to the White House, www.change.gov, went online on Thursday inviting users to offer their ideas for the future of the country.

Under the headline of "Open Government," the website asks readers to "Share Your Vision" via email.

"The story of the campaign and this historic moment has been your story," the website states. "Share your story and your ideas, and be part of bringing positive lasting change to this country."

The website's homepage notes that it's "75 days until inauguration," when Obama is to be sworn in as president on January 20, 2009.

It also features a quote from Obama: "Today we begin in earnest the work of making sure that the world we leave our children is just a little bit better than the one we inhabit today."

A blog posting includes a link to a YouTube video of Obama's victory speech in Chicago on Tuesday.

Users can also apply for jobs via the website or read about the president-elect's agenda and priorities for his administration.
http://change.gov/
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Mike,

I wasn’t trying to be flippant, I think I simply have a pragmatic view of the media - that unbiased reporting isn’t conducive to selling news, they just give the people what they want.

I’ve a sneaky suspicion that when the people want a Republican President the media will reflect it and I’ll be saying the same thing to Bob when he starts decrying a media bias.

Put simply I think that the media reflects public opinion rather than shaping it.

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96 posted 11-06-2008 09:38 PM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Grinch, that's the same argument they use about Hollywood movies. Do the movies reflect real life or do they influence real life?

When Harrison Ford appeared in the first Indiana Jones movie, sales of the hat he wore went up over 2000 percent and he was given a national haberdashery award. When Clark Gable had a scene wearing a white undershirt, sales also exploded. When Oprah Winfrey said she didn't eat beef because she feared mad cow disease, beef sales plummeted over 20% and she was sued by the beef industry. Exorcism went up drastically after The Exorcist hit the scene. Professional poker was  relatively unnoticed until the movie Rounders came out. Now the World Poker Tour is one of the most watched shows on television and tournaments have sprung up all over the world, thanks to the movie.

Saying that they (the news, movies, etc) only reflect real life and give the people what they want is a pathetic excuse used by them to justify their actions. They create the need and then they fill it. That's what they do.

A news agency is supposed to report the news. They are not supposed to create it, nor are they supposed to influence the reader's or listener's way of thinking.

Yes, I realize that way of thinking belongs to the past. Maybe I do, too..who knows? There are some things that should involve ethics. Reporting is one, so is medicine and the law. right now we are 0 for 3, in my book.

Don't know if you ever read The Fountainhead but, if you ever get around to it, you will see exactly how newspapers do it, step by step.
Bob K
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since 11-03-2007
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97 posted 11-07-2008 03:26 AM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K



Dear Mike,

           I read The Fountainhead.  I don't understand why you would think that the book was other than a provocative and interesting (for me, though not for many others) piece of fiction.  Why you would think that it was a better description of the newspaper business in the thirties and forties than Front Page, or His Gal Friday, or Citizen Kane is beyond me.  Why you would think it reflects anything about today's newspaper or news business is even more of a puzzle.

     The majority of the sources you quote in the comments you make about Rep. Murtha, by the way, go back to organizations founded by or organized around the thinking of Brent Bozell.  Mr. Bozell's dedication is to exposing "The Liberal Media," without actually having proved in advance that such a thing exists in any more widespread a fashion than does the right wing media.  

     Much of the disparity in coverage in this past election had to do with reports of McCain trailing in the polls.  Certainly a lot of the things that McCain and and Palin said didn't seem to help themselves out very well, and it seems pretty easy to blame the press for the actions of the Republican Party over the past two terms that simply haven't made them the darlings of the public.

     Have no fear, though, Mike.  If the press feels that Obama is falling short, the press will do a number on him pretty quickly.  It simply won't be quickly enough for you, I suspect.
Grinch
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since 12-31-2005
Posts 2710
Whoville


98 posted 11-07-2008 04:47 AM       View Profile for Grinch   Email Grinch   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Grinch


quote:
They create the need and then they fill it. That's what they do.


If that’s true Mike they’re not very good at it.

If the media controls who wins elections and the media are biased towards Democrats you’d expect them to win every election by a landslide. Reality doesn’t seem to match your assertion. In fact if you look at election results over the past 50 years I think you’ll find that the landslides have general slid in favour of the Republicans.

I think the reality is that there are staunch Republican  biased media outlets and there are staunch Democrat  biased media outlets and a whole heap of Capitalist media outlets that can and do blow either way.

If I’m right the Republicans will win an election at some point in the future, if you’re right those clever media moguls will keep the Democrats in power forever.

Balladeer
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Posts 26302
Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA


99 posted 11-07-2008 09:08 AM       View Profile for Balladeer   Email Balladeer   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Balladeer's Home Page   View IP for Balladeer

Grinch, I said that's what they do. I didn't say they were especially good at it. They did the same with Gore but Gore was too superficial to win. They did the same with Kerry, but he was too busy shooting himself in the foot. The fact that the democrats lost those two elections was not due to the non-attempts of the media, it was due to the bozos the democrats put up.

Bob, if you don't see where the Fountainhead is an excellent representation of how the media uses mind control, you didn't read the Fountainhead. It goes into great detail for those who can see how little snippets and subliminal hints go into all phases of the paper, from the food section to the comics to wherever, promoting whatever the paper is trying to shovel in order to plant their messages in the reader's mind, even without them knowing it. Citizen Kane was excellent, also, but dealt more with how to sell newspapers and create the empire, a la the National Enquirer. True enough, Kane tried to use the same tactics to promote his wife's singing career but, as I explained to Grinch, even when you are on a cause, you still need a little talent on the part of whoever you champion.

Do I want Obama to fail? You couldn't be more wrong. As I stated in the other post, as he goes so goes America and I would be very content to see him succeed, if it's done in the right way. I have retirement savings, too, Bob, and I get no pleasure out of watching them go down daily. Nor (unlike congressional Democrats) would I like to see America or the economy fail just so I can say "told ya!". In this case, I would be more than happy to be wrong.
 
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