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Our Great Senior Citizen Dope Raid

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oceanvu2
Senior Member
since 02-24-2007
Posts 1007
Santa Monica, California, USA


0 posted 03-27-2008 02:05 PM       View Profile for oceanvu2   Email oceanvu2   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for oceanvu2

OK, well, I started thinking about the medical marijuana issue.  For some truly ill and disabled folk, marijuana use might provide some synptomatic relief.  There is no medical consensus on this, but hey, if someone has terminal cancer, aids, glaucoma, Parkinson's syndrome, or multiple sclerosis, what's the difference if a little dope seems to help?

The day after Prop 201 passed in California, my wife Debbie, who has MS, got a marijuana scrip from her long term neurologist to see if it would help with her tremors.

So, we're off to the marijuana store.  Eye opening!  At $60.00 and up for an eighth of an ounce, we'd be broke in a month.  These guys clearly weren't in business for humanitarian reasons.

Being a former greenhouse owner, I figured heck, I'd just grow some on our patio.  We were living in a HUD Senior and Disabled adult complex, no kids around, and the patio was below a high berm and not visible from the sidewalk.

I planted up three 15 gallon nursery cans and grew a gorgeous -- if I say so myself -- all but invisible crop.  The "all but" part got us in trouble.  A maintenance worker walking the berm saw our crop and turned us in.

We get a knock on the door about ten o'clock at night, and there are these two Marina del Rey policemen.  Big guys with big guns on their hips.  Oh, and Bermuda shorts, this being California and all.

I knew that only Fed's could arrest us, so when asked if I was "growing," I said, "Sure, wanna see it?"  

Off to the patio.  "Jeeze," the one cop said, "that's a good looking crop!"  The second asked, "How do you keep it so short?  My brother's plants are seven feet tall!"

"I pinch the plants back," I answered, discression being the better part of valor.

"Well, look, why don't you just harvest them and make this all go away?"  I agreed.

HUD was not so readily amused.  After months of "investigation," local Hud officials decided they didn't want to put the issue to a legal test, probably for fear of chaos if they lost.

HUD compromised.  They decided Deb could smoke it, but I couldn't grow it on site.  Not wanting to become a poster children for medical marijuana, we agreed.  Anti-climatic, but practical.

Did it help Deb's MS tremors?  Ohhh yeah!  But this is just anecdotal evidence of the plant's value.  (I haven't smoked the stuff since Vietnam, except for maybe a time or six. Having compromised my lungs with a Pall Mall habit, I can't hold down the smoke.)

I'll agree with anybody that marijuana ain't for kids, but I am wondering what the Government's problem is with medical use.  Sell it only in a pharmacy and knock out the "entrepreneurs."

Could it work?

Best, Terminally-straight-Jimbeaux  

[This message has been edited by oceanvu2 (03-27-2008 05:20 PM).]

serenity blaze
Member Empyrean
since 02-02-2000
Posts 28839


1 posted 03-27-2008 02:37 PM       View Profile for serenity blaze   Email serenity blaze   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for serenity blaze

Well the hubby and I just read this together.

The only other thing we do together is taxes. (Maybe that answers your question right there...?)

But, um?

Big guns and Bermuda Shorts!?!



What a title!

Ron
Administrator
Member Rara Avis
since 05-19-99
Posts 9708
Michigan, US


2 posted 03-27-2008 03:33 PM       View Profile for Ron   Email Ron   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Ron's Home Page   View IP for Ron

I certainly hope this thread doesn't become an advocate for breaking the law. Or (hint, hint) an admission of such. Sadly, if it does, it will have to be removed.

However, there's absolutely nothing wrong with a discussion of why the law should or shouldn't be changed.

For example:

quote:
For some truly ill and disabled folk, marijuana use might provide some synptomatic relief. There is no medical consensus on this ...

Why is there no professional consensus? Shouldn't that perhaps tell us something?

quote:
... but hey, if someone has terminal cancer, aids, glaucoma, Parkinson's syndrome, or multiple sclerosis, what's the difference if a little dope seems to help?

I've never met anyone who wasn't terminal. So where do we draw the line? You have to be willing to die within a year or two? If cancer and aids qualify, why not depression or anxiety?
Susan Caldwell
Member Rara Avis
since 12-27-2002
Posts 8464
Florida


3 posted 03-27-2008 03:46 PM       View Profile for Susan Caldwell   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Susan Caldwell

I had not heard that it helps Parkinsons.  My father has Parkinsons, course he doesn't live in Ca.  

"too bad ignorance isn't painful"
~Unknown~

oceanvu2
Senior Member
since 02-24-2007
Posts 1007
Santa Monica, California, USA


4 posted 03-27-2008 04:31 PM       View Profile for oceanvu2   Email oceanvu2   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for oceanvu2

Hi Ron!  I'm not advocating breaking the law.  By California state law, use of marijuana with a Physician's prescription is legal.  Growing of marijuana for medical use with prescription by the user or caregiver, is legal.  Under Federal law, both are still illegal in any of the several states with "compassionate use" State laws.  Any other use or growing remains illegal everywhere under State and Federal Laws.

The lack of medical consensus on the potential benefits for marijuana may be largely due the to FDA's unwillingness to sanction rigorous study, and any individual or institution attempting such study at this point would be guilty of "possession."  It's possible that what the lack of medical consensus tells us is that the FDA is keeping its head in the sand on this issue.

The biggest problem I see with the "compassionate use" proviso's is, as in California,  that they are immediately abused by drug dealers under the guise of "dispensaries."  They're in it for the money, which is huge!  This completely subverts the purpose of the State laws.

How, if Federal Law is changed, how true "compassionate use" standards are rigorously maintained, I don't know.  But all other usage/sale will probably remain illegal.

We "draw the line" by prosecuting prescription mills, just as we draw the line on doctors who make a living selling painkillers, opiates, and any other items which are readily abused.

Maybe admitting (accepting "hint-hint") very modest past marijuana use qualifies me to run for political office.  Many politicians "come out" on youthful indiscretions, because it is going to come out anyway.  Power of the press!

Regardless, I formally disavow any previous statements about my previous drug use.  I misquoted myself.

Susan:  To date, all discussion of potential marijuana benefits for anything is anecdotal. There may be a lot of anecdotes, but some people swear by bee pollen too.

Best, Jimbeaux  
serenity blaze
Member Empyrean
since 02-02-2000
Posts 28839


5 posted 03-27-2008 04:39 PM       View Profile for serenity blaze   Email serenity blaze   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for serenity blaze

oceanvu clearly states that his wife had a prescription.
http://norml.org/index.cfm?wtm_view=&Group_ID=4525

"The laws regarding possession and cultivation of marijuana do not apply to patients or patientsí primary caregivers who possess or cultivate marijuana for the personal medical use of the patient, upon the recommendation or approval of a physician."

Unfortunately, the laws regarding the legality of medical use of marijuana are not as clear-cut as say...the National Maximum Speed Limit laws.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Maximum_Speed_Law



serenity blaze
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since 02-02-2000
Posts 28839


6 posted 03-27-2008 04:42 PM       View Profile for serenity blaze   Email serenity blaze   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for serenity blaze

Oooops.

We did that at the same time...But?

Ask your wife's doctor if this drug might be right for her:
http://www.marinol.com/aboutmarinol/index.html

A friend of mine who is no longer with us, was prescribed this to enhance his appetite, but unfortunately, it was a little late for this synthetic version of marijuana to be of much benefit. (His problem was nausea though, and I don't know if it has benefits for MS patients, but you can try.)
Bob K
Member Elite
since 11-03-2007
Posts 3860


7 posted 04-04-2008 07:38 PM       View Profile for Bob K   Email Bob K   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Bob K




     Alas, this is one of the drugs that has some effect in mitigating perception of pain and the country's lawmakers, or rather many of them, are in the business of undercutting the validity of studies of the drug.

     It seems unlikely that marijuana is a wonderful clinically as its enthusiastic supporters claim.  It seems impossible to find out when the  studies of the drug are under the tight control of people who have shown long term antipathy to any claims of usefulness at all.  The data
of studies permitted by such people are inherently tainted in the minds of objective evaluators.  An actual scientific
evaluation of such a study is probably impossible.

     The last decent data I saw by the Harvard folks in the seventies and eighties showed that it was probably pretty much harmless; but when issues get this politicized, who knows?  My own experience with the drug eventually put me in the position of occasional use producing psycho-motor seizures.  Every time.  While I'd love to resume occasional recreational use, I haven't been able to for twenty years.  I simply don't like feeling that bad for that long.

     I think the prohibition has done more damage than the use, by a long shot.

     Jim's story about the Bicycle Police is priceless.

     I remember working in a detox unit in the early seventies and three or four Waltham (MA) police bringing in a guy in his early twenties.  Very drunk, he was, and climbing precariously over the furniture, desk to file cabinet to  office chair (with wheels on its legs) to examination table to floor with sudden leap back to the top of the filing cabinet.  Constant flow of speech came from his mouth, never quite loud enough to make out entirely; but the cops got his to sit down long enough for me to take his blood pressure, take his pulse and count his respirations by taking out a sandwich baggie filled with butt end roaches, perhaps two ounces of them and dangling them in front of him.  They said they'd give them back after he let us run him through the admission routine.  Ten minutes later I was wheeling this guy upstairs in a wheelchair with a bag of roaches included in his clothing.  

     He wanted them returned to him too, when he was checked out.  Thank God that wasn't my decision to make.
I couldn't believe it when the cops handed over a couple of ounces of unvouchered marijuana to me.  They probably had a sense of humor and hated paperwork as much as I did.
      
serenity blaze
Member Empyrean
since 02-02-2000
Posts 28839


8 posted 04-04-2008 08:01 PM       View Profile for serenity blaze   Email serenity blaze   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for serenity blaze

grin

There are a lot of amusing pot stories it seems, and if I can ever remember 'em all, I'd love to share.

But BobK? Like you, I've found that the stuff isn't worth the effort.

It's said that marijuana makes one ambitionless and lazy.

Maybe the stuff just ran its course in me? 'Cause there ain't no way I'm up to all the hoops I'd have to jump through for it now.



Thanks for the smile on the quirky story, though I couldn't help but feel for the guy.

hush
Senior Member
since 05-27-2001
Posts 1693
Ohio, USA


9 posted 04-16-2008 12:17 PM       View Profile for hush   Email hush   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for hush

A friend of mine went to CA and said she met people with medicinal marijuana cards far ailments like headaches and menstrual cramps.

Not that I care what people do on their free time, I really don't... but that's just prooof right there that it's not hard to get legal clearance and skirt the laws...
serenity blaze
Member Empyrean
since 02-02-2000
Posts 28839


10 posted 04-16-2008 03:28 PM       View Profile for serenity blaze   Email serenity blaze   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for serenity blaze

hush, I'm always intimidated to reply to your words, because I know I'd better have all my ducks in a row when I do because you are sooooo smart, dear lady.

But I'd like your thoughts on this, so I'll be brave. Besides, you have been kind to me-of-the-last-brain-cell in the past. And I think I'm kind of agreeing with you.

Since it is left up to the states, it does make the issue of medical marijuana a sticky legal issue. (Just one of many, too, as you know.)

But I blame the prescription drug abuse epidemic on that proclivity to "skirt the legal" issue. (Just partly.)

It's hard for me to explain things without anecdotes, so forgive me again, as I lapse.

At a barbecue some time ago, we were discussing various drug issues, and where to find them was as conspicuously absent as many of the people we knew who had died of overdoses. We know where to find drugs. The names of doctors with a free hand were passed around, once upon a time. Now with the abuse of pain management clinics--all you need is a record of one broken bone, or a surgery, or anything, just ANYTHING as a "cover" for the doctor to write that "Holy Trinity." For those who don't know, that's the deadly mix of Hydrocodone, Soma, and Zanax. Some people even get methadone, dilaudid, oxycontin. It's just...crazy.

Someone asked, "What ever happened to the good old days where you could be happy with just some beer and a little pot?"

My answer was "Legalities."

In order to apply for a job, you have to pass a drug test. In order to keep that job, you may have to submit a urine sample on demand. If you get hurt on the job, I've known people who had to pee in a cup before they were sent for medical attention. So we can add insurance companies, and even the litigious nature of our society to the blame game, too.

People who want to get high are going to get high. They will find a way.

I don't know what the answers are, either. There doesn't seem to be a one-size-fits-all answer.

I find it incomprehensible too, that these same companies/corporations need to do this, especially for safety related issues. When it involves public safety, I'm most especially keen on rigidity regarding such. I also think though, they need to take into consideration issues such as sleep-deprivation. The same companies that will drug test think nothing of grueling back-to-back shiftwork. (I'm thinking especially of offshore workers, tug-boats captains, police, and yes, the medical profession.)

Maybe especially the medical profession. After Katrina, I learned the hard way that in matters of chronic illness, no doctor was better than a burnt-out doctor.

And grin, I'm still not sure if I am arguing with you or against you.

I'm not even sure if I am arguing at all.

*tapping my head*

That last brain cell is almost as exhausted as my last nerve.

hush
Senior Member
since 05-27-2001
Posts 1693
Ohio, USA


11 posted 04-18-2008 12:16 PM       View Profile for hush   Email hush   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for hush

Umm... K? What's the question again? LOL...

Sure, I know the doc's that pass drugs out like candy... nobody knows the system better than someone within it... LOL... and I learned from the best- my mom- she knew exactly how to manipulate the system. It's not hard, but it is getting harder to find doc's willing to prescribe pain meds even for those in need...

I'm not sure I get your point about sleep deprivation? It's okay to smoke a little weed if it gets you to sleep? (Once again, I have a friend who does exactly that- I could care less, but you know the rules and you run the risk of getting caught). If you have a legitimate prescription to sleep aids, there's no problem. And if you take two when you're precribed one... it's not like they can prove it...

According to one of my co-worker's, the new thing is to test hair, which will provide an accurate drug use history for as long as... your hair is, I guess. And your employer can test whether you've used drugs at any point during your employment history and use it against you.

Not sure how I feel about that one.... I kind of feel like incidents should be dealt with seperately as they come, but a pattern is a pattern and sometimes a pattern needs to be established before disciplinary action can be taken.
serenity blaze
Member Empyrean
since 02-02-2000
Posts 28839


12 posted 04-18-2008 02:41 PM       View Profile for serenity blaze   Email serenity blaze   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for serenity blaze

I know I had a question somewhere in there.



I guess I would be dismissed as a witness from both sides.

*laughing*

(And I don't smoke pot anymore--it makes me twitchy, and the only thing high about that is the price.)

Ironically enough, I put that habit to rest when I attended a Wide Spread Panic concert. The dancing and gauze skirted hippy girls made me feel nostalgic, and well, whatever that stuff was, it wasn't what I remembered. I had to go to the bathroom, and suddenly the stairs looked wayyyyy too high to climb. (That ever happened to you, it happened to me, and when y'gotta pee, oy, ya get, well, panicky.)

So some sweet lil' hippy girl had mercy on the old lady here, and took me by the hand and brought me to the bathroom and back--like I was a lost child.

That may not be the last time, but it's the last time I remember thinking, "these kids ain't smoking the same rope" and decided to let the um, "torch" pass...

But if I could make a nice tea with it? Who knows?

So I claim sleep deprivation. Really.

I know it sounds like Paula Abdul too, but I wasn't stoned, I was exhausted!

Love and hugs and stuff, hush.
 
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