»
Discussion
»
The Alley
»
Speechless.....
| The Alley |
|
Speechless..... |
|
|
Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA 
|
In a campaign that has spread like wildfire across the Internet, a group of Israeli environmentalists is encouraging Jews around the world to light at least one less candle this Hanukka to help the environment. The founders of the Green Hanukka campaign found that every candle that burns completely produces 15 grams of carbon dioxide. If an estimated one million Israeli households light for eight days, they said, it would do significant damage to the atmosphere. "The campaign calls for Jews around the world to save the last candle and save the planet, so we won't need another miracle," said Liad Ortar, the campaign's cofounder, who runs the Arkada environmental consulting firm and the Ynet Web site's environmental forum. I also read a news story of a Catholic church in England which has opened up a confessional exclusively for confessing "crimes against the environment". (No joke!) I wonder if the confessional booth for not recycling is blue?  Believe me when I tell ya, folks. You ain't seen nothin' yet! |
||
| © Copyright 2007 Michael Mack - All Rights Reserved | |||
Mistletoe Angel 
since 2000-12-17
Posts 32816Portland, Oregon |
As an American who takes conservation, ecological wisdom and sustainability most seriously on even the more insignificant levels, I absolutely agree this is absurd and doesn't accomplish anything. Look, the emissions candles release are a drop in the bucket compared to what fireplaces/chimneys release. The latter not only emits more CO2 particles than any other room or device in the house: it emits a whopping amount more than even the next closest appliance (some argue the stove, others argue the shower). If environmentalists want to make their case about making fireplaces more green, I absolutely agree there. Having read years ago about how much emissions charcoal briquettes and firewood release, I have, beginning in 2004, been using Java Logs, which each log is about 65% used coffee grounds (studies actually show coffee grounds suprisingly burn brighter and hotter than sawdust logs, while producing 88% less carbon monoxide than firewood) which a Canadian engineer by the name of Rod Sprules invented eight years ago from a book of "silly ideas" he wrote, where one suddenly stuck with him and made a lot of sense. Java Logs have been expanding rapidly on the US market over these past four years, where as recently as 2005 they were only available in select outlets in four states (New York, Massachusetts, Connecticut and New Jersey) and now you can find them at select outlets in almost every state. But candles? Unless you were to set a new Guinness Book of World Records statistic for the World's Largest Candle at thirty feet wide in diameter and one-hundred and fifty feet tall, and ignite it, which that would certainly release a lot of CO2 particles into the atmosphere.......I think the mindset that even lighting candles to celebrate holiday traditions and funerals, among other important rituals harms the planet immensely is downright dippy. By that logic, those Israeli environmentalists ought to be implementing a national ban on burning incense in antique stores and gift shops. Sincerely, Noah Eaton "If we have no peace, it is because we have forgotten that we belong to each other" Mother Teresa |
||
|
TomMark Member Elite
since 2007-07-27
Posts 2133LA,CA |
Sir Balladeer, you have no trust on good-will. If everything on making environment better and cleaner is fake , the intention at least is not fake and worth of a word of respect. You keep laughing out loudly your biased laughing.  (if this is considered as P-A, do please delete.) [This message has been edited by TomMark (12-04-2007 10:45 PM).] |
||
|
Christopher
Moderator
Member Rara Avis
since 1999-08-02
Posts 8296Purgatorial Incarceration |
it's not what you do, Mike, but that you do it.  |
||
|
Mistletoe Angel
since 2000-12-17
Posts 32816Portland, Oregon |
Although I do find some of Michael's opinions on the environment somewhat unfortunate, with all due respect, I believe the point Michael was making here was that some environmental organizations and coalitions cross the line and go too far, where the more trivial, insignificant things are being targeted rather than the more obvious, gargantually larger scale factors. In that respect, at least, I'm in solid agreement with him. Sincerely, Noah Eaton "If we have no peace, it is because we have forgotten that we belong to each other" Mother Teresa |
||
|
rwood Member Elite
since 2000-02-29
Posts 3793Tennessee |
sighs.. i love candles, and my fireplace. so does that mean my attempts at ambiance, tranquility and romance in the house is considered an evil against the environment of mankind and that I need to either use: electricity...or sit in the dark, or limit myself to one flame... how cruel. |
||
|
Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
rwood, it's a sad state of affairs indeed when the instruments of your love life are bad for the environment Noah, thank you for your thoughts. It's the absurdity that is absurd. Welcome to the age of paranoia, guilt and control  |
||
Ringo
since 2003-02-20
Posts 3684Saluting with misty eyes |
What's next? Taking the candles out of the Catholic Churches? Actually, I think I will go right out and light a candle myself to pray for those that are not lighting candles in celebration of their freedom of religion. What would you attempt to do...if you knew you could not fail?. |
||
|
TomMark Member Elite
since 2007-07-27
Posts 2133LA,CA |
My dear Sir Balladeer, I don't believe a little patch of green can block you view of the ?????  |
||
|
Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
quote: Are you refering to the War on Terror? It didn't seem to me that you were too unwilling to part with principle in the pursuit of Jihadists Mike. A few civil liberties here -- a few there -- all in the name of security. But, believe it or not, I actually AGREE with you -- that how we face security issues is a great tempest in a teapot -- whether it is a global war on terror or global warming -- paranoia, control -- too tempting to overstep the bounds of the Constitution -- but, in the face of disaster -- like Katrina -- we know that civil liberties et al go down the river as government takes control until the situation can be stabilized. This is where the matter of policy-making comes into play. It's much more credible -- and worthwhile -- to discuss how we handle these different crisis that we face -- than to say they don't exist. I'm pretty sure that you think the people who don't believe there is a terrorist threat from the Middle East are on the lunatic fringe -- and especially the people who are feeding that little frenzy (like the ones sitting in at Bill Maher's show screaming about the government being responsible for 9/11 and not Al Quada). But, in all honesty -- I can't see what your beef is here with people exercising thier Constitutional right to free speech to encourage others to do, or not do, something in a completely voluntary way. Where's Clara Peller? |
||
|
Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Do you see anywhere I was referring to the war on terror, reb? Then why the question - unless you are just using it as a reason to work it in to the conversation? that how we face security issues is a great tempest in a teapot Nor did I make any reference to security issues. Don't feel like traveling down your sideroads this time, sorry. |
||
|
Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
Every story, Mike, has a protagonist and an antagonist. In the story of Us, whether you want to call us the United States, Western Civilization, or, in your case -- Republicans -- there are different antagonists that we face -- global terrorism networks, a hurricane, 40 hurricanes, anthropogenic global warming, an extinction meteor, Hugo Chavez, Iranian nuclear arms (oops, scratch that one) -- whatever the antagonist is -- it is a Security issue. To quote Madison, via Brad quote: If you want to pretend that you don't understand Comparison again Mike, oh well  But, you still haven't explained why you object to free-thinking people exercising thier right to free speech asking other free-thinking people to participate in a voluntary action? |
||
|
Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
It's a thread about a group trying to save the planet by cutting back one candle on Hannukah. They say the extra candle will cause significant damage to the planet. Jews have been lighting the same amount of candles for their entire existence, with no reported significant damage incurred to the ozone layer, greenhouse affect or whatever. That's it. Up until you people have commented on their opinions of such a statement. You have so far injected..... the war on terror over-stepping the boundaries of the constitution civil liberties Katrina government control al Quada Hugo Chavez Iranian nuclear arms Quote from Madison about tyranny and oppression all in the name of some kinds of comparison. May I suggest you buy looser jockey shorts? But, you still haven't explained why you object to free-thinking people exercising thier right to free speech asking other free-thinking people to participate in a voluntary action? I haven't objected at all. I've simply displayed it and ridiculed it. They are entitled to say it and I'm entitled to give an opinion and ridicule it, if I wish. If another group comes out with sign that read BAN BAKED BEANS, THE LEADING CAUSE OF FLATULENCE HARMFUL TO THE OZONE LAYER, I will ridicule that, too, Hugo Chavez notwithstanding. |
||
|
TomMark Member Elite
since 2007-07-27
Posts 2133LA,CA |
You are right Sir Balladeer. Because nowadays many lit candles for meditation, for fashion and for bathing, so they (the group)just try to gave up their share to keep the balance. Tom |
||
|
Huan Yi Member Ascendant
since 2004-10-12
Posts 6688Waukegan |
. What about all those birthday candles every time a kid gets a year older? . |
||
|
Not A Poet Member Elite
since 1999-11-03
Posts 3885Oklahoma, USA |
I read just yesterday that kangaroo farts don't contain methane. The "experts" are trying to fingure out how to get cows to eat the same stuff 'roos do.  But I'm not eatin' that stuff.  |
||
|
Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
quote: You're right. So long as you didn't say: quote: And then it became a thread about: quote: Paranoia, guilt, control.... But, you've convinced me Mike -- or rather -- my comparison has convinced me. It's better that your ilk remain un-paranoid about anthropogenic global warming -- given your track record on global terrorism. Ridicule. PLEASE ! (I'm supposed to wear jockey shorts?) |
||
|
Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
Why, reb, thank you for giving me a track record on global terrorism. My ilk and I thank you and plan on remaining un-paranoid.  |
||
|
Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
Afraid I haven't given you that track record Mike -- you, your ilk, and our flareless leader have. |
||
|
rwood Member Elite
since 2000-02-29
Posts 3793Tennessee |
well, I'm a little confused. I know my knowledge of natural science isn't up to par, but logically thinking back....wouldn't the atmosphere have suffered a breakdown years ago....before electricity and there was nothing but fire, before the killing off of great herds of animals...I mean didn't the dinosaurs poot? And crap VW sized piles of waste? And what of all that volcanic activity? I think we need to care about the atmosphere, but to become so ridiculous we feel/or create a need to breathe through our butts like turtles. |
||
|
Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA |
You would think so, Regina. I read where some experts had proclaimed that Krakatoa threw more into the atmosphere than all of humanity has combined. Considering there was an age where large eruptions were common-place, wouldn't one think the atmosphere should not have survived that. When Saddam Hussein set fire to the oil fiends in Kuwait while retreating, scientists claimed that it would take over 10 years for the ozone layer to repair itself. One year later they checked it again and it had been completely repaired. all that an some knucklehad is claiming that one less candle on menorahs will keep the ozone layer from becoming dangerously impaired....go figure. |
||
|
Not A Poet Member Elite
since 1999-11-03
Posts 3885Oklahoma, USA |
quote: An empty wagon always rattles. |
||
|
Bob K Member Elite
since 2007-11-03
Posts 4208 |
Dear Balladeer, I really hate doing this, but I will. Could you please post the source of your story? Heaven knows there's enough idiocy going about in the world for everybody to take responsibility for a huge heaping portion, left, right and center, and heaven knows the environment movement has loonies foaming on both sides, but I'd really feel better if the source on this was something like The Economist on the right or The BBC internationally or The New York Times in The Center or The Christian Science Monitor on the Slight Left or The Nation further over and not someone like Fox or The Washington Times or some of the other places that aren't quite as clear with their fact checking. I may have mentioned to you that I like to have my news either well sourced or with the reliability of the sourcing there for me to estimate for myself. Nobody has to supply that for me, but then I can always ask, right? My best, BobK. |
||
|
Bob K Member Elite
since 2007-11-03
Posts 4208 |
I realize this is an old posting; but what is the sourcing on this? It sounds like Fox or Drudge or The Washington Times and I can't recall seeing any personally sourced and confirmed backup for this. Balladeer, do you recall any that's gone on record as confirming any of this? BobK. |
||
|
Ron
Administrator
Member Rara Avis
since 1999-05-19
Posts 8669Michigan, US |
Sources are always good, Bob. Pick your own? |
||
|
Bob K Member Elite
since 2007-11-03
Posts 4208 |
Sources are always good, and these are extra special. Got to say, these really take the cake. If I wrote a short story with this as a plot, I'm not sure an editor would accept it without trying to get me to change the set up. Thank you! |
||
|
Stephanos
since 2000-07-31
Posts 3618Statesboro, GA, USA |
quote: I found this in a CNN transcript. Is CNN not a good enough source to think it is true? http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0712/05/ltm.01.html Stephen |
||
|
Bob K Member Elite
since 2007-11-03
Posts 4208 |
Yes they are. See my post just prior to yours in response to Ron's listings as well. I'm not very good with footnotes myself, so I try to note where I'm shaky in my texts. And I want that from others, too. You are right to ask. |
||
|
|
⇧ top of page ⇧ |
|
| All times are ET (US). All dates are in Year-Month-Day format. | ||
