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Abortion

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jbouder
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Whole Sort Of Genl Mish Mash


100 posted 01-16-2007 12:39 PM       View Profile for jbouder   Email jbouder   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for jbouder

LR:

In venues like this one, participants usually phone in or email questions and the presenter answers as many as he/she can.  It isn't uncommon.

Jim
Local Rebel
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101 posted 01-16-2007 05:07 PM       View Profile for Local Rebel   Email Local Rebel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Local Rebel

Right, and there are screeners taking the calls and e-mails -- and they try to consolidate them - but -- in a 'conference' of, Denise said thousands so lets say 2000, the odds of any participant actually getting to participate are .0005% per question taken.  

Assuming the presenter takes 10 (which would be a lot!) that goes up to a whopping .005% chance for the 'event'.

Which, calls into question the value of doing it this way -- since this is primarily a one-way communication.  Who benefits from this format?

Being a 'participant' is like calling yourself a participant in the Super Bowl because you watched it on television.  Using an on-demand medium would be a far more efficient (and altruistic) method to disseminate vital information in all ways but one -- oxytocin.
Denise
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102 posted 01-16-2007 08:50 PM       View Profile for Denise   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Denise

I was mistaken. The number of participants was listed as being in the hundreds, not thousands. I misread it. My apologies.

I think there is a difference between marketing techniques, which are in and of themselves a neutral factor, and what is being marketed. Is what is being shared truthful, helping people to make informed decisions, or is what is being marketed deliberately deceptive. I think that is the crux of the matter and where any judgments need to be made, not on techniques, per se.
Local Rebel
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103 posted 01-16-2007 09:54 PM       View Profile for Local Rebel   Email Local Rebel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Local Rebel

Deception is deception Denise -- it would be an easy sell to convince me that a business or non-profit was acting in its own interest to the detriment of its customers.  And, I'd be just as mad as you about that.

But that doesn't effect the debate over Constitutional rights of individuals, or, when a fetus becomes a person.

Since that is the case -- wouldn't it be better to, instead of talking about trying to eradicate a Supreme Court decision -- by talking about 'Abortion' in generic terms -- to shift the debate to specific issues;

Abortion on Demand
Paternity
Parental Notification
Patient's Rights (which includes information)
Public Funding
Contraception
Morning After
Stephanos
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104 posted 01-16-2007 10:50 PM       View Profile for Stephanos   Email Stephanos   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Stephanos's Home Page   View IP for Stephanos

I don't think so Reb.  Because the question of whether not the unborn are human beings will always affect these peripheral issues.  Not that these issues can't be discussed.  (They should be discussed.)  It's just that the central question must be the nature of what is "aborted".  But I'm afraid to you, that would entail a too "general" discussion.


Stephen.
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105 posted 01-16-2007 11:39 PM       View Profile for Local Rebel   Email Local Rebel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Local Rebel

I don't have any objections Stephen -- and why would that stop anyone anyway?  Go ahead   take me somewhere we haven't been.

My observation isn't that it's 'general' -- it's that it's settled.
hush
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106 posted 01-17-2007 08:20 AM       View Profile for hush   Email hush   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for hush

'Angelina Jolie Pregnant by Space Alien -- Brad is Furious'

I wonder if she'll be getting an abortion?
rhia_5779
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107 posted 01-17-2007 05:06 PM       View Profile for rhia_5779   Email rhia_5779   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for rhia_5779

I may be wrong, but most teenage girls reflect on most serious things for about 5 seconds and then move on to something else. Even with entertainment, they still take about 5 to 10 cell phone calls, eat microwave pizza, do their nails, and find anything remotely responsible to be a complete and utter bummer to their day.

Um yeah you are wrong about that sorry.
When did I say that? I said if they have the child and they are in the streets and they can't take care of the child nor get the child somewhere safe , the child could die.]

I didn’t say that you said that. I said that I said it. If a child dies (unless by a disease or illness) then it’s the parent’s fault. If a child is hit by a bus, the parent wasn't watching him. If a little girl gets kidnapped, the parent wasn’t watching her. Plain and simple.


What how is it all the parents fault? And if the child is playing at a friends house and the police chase  people in a gang down the street and the child accidentally gets shot? Is that the parents fault too.. WHat about if a drunk driver runs into them..
Well, for one thing, you seem very mature and intelligent for your age. But mostly kids that age aren’t as bright as you. When I say they aren’t intelligent enough, I mean they aren’t smart enough to care for another human being, especially a newborn. And I agree, kids should not be having sex and getting pregnant.

Thank you for the compliment  but no kid is smart enough to have another  kid.

“One way a unborn child dies the other a mothers life is destroyed maybe.”

How do you figure?
1.Trauma
2. responsibility
3. loss of innoncence\child hood
4 guilt for giving the child up if they choose to do so, that it is their flesh and blood they are giving up.”

Ok.
#1. Yes, the trauma of finding out she's pregnant would be immense.

#2. If they are choose to have sex, then they need to know that they have to be RESPONSIBLE enough to take care of their child.

(And if they didn't choose and they didn't know any better because they were never educated. )

#3. Loss of innocence? If a young girl is having sex, her innocence is pretty much gone to begin with, that you can’t argue.

(Not if she doesn't know better)

#4. You think the guilt of giving her baby away would hurt her? What do you think the guilt of aborting the child would do? Most women deeply regret aborting.


Then she never knew the child and she may not regret that till way older if ever..If she has it she will always regret giving it away.always


“ANd gangs aren't going to let the offspring of someone affliated with them or with them get out of the slums.”

You seem to only talk about gangs. How do you feel about a suburbanite aborting her baby because she doesn’t feel like having it?
(That is wrong. If she wasn't raped, she knew better, she is over 18  and she can take care for the baby and her life and her family and income won't suffer immensely than she should have the baby.)

“Should of clarified that , I meant a child wandering into the crossfire or having the ones fighting go near where the child is not paying attention.”

Rhea, that is my point. Why would a responsible or even rational person let their little child wander around in a neighborhood that is known to have gunfights? And children never pay attention. They don’t know what attention is. It’s the parent that’s not paying attention but should.
(Its RHIA.just to point out but they may not be able to help where they live. Children die everyday on the streets because there parents work and the kids are with a neighbor or by themselves and the wander. And if the ones fighting go near the child.And the parent is elsewhere assuming the child is safe because somene is watching them?)

“its the mother it doesn't sound like you care about.”

I suppose it may sound that way, but it’s not true. I care very deeply for mothers and women and everyone for that matter. I grew up with my mom, two sisters and aunts, so I’m closer to women than anyone else. I respect women, and I think women who consider abortions need to respect the child inside them, the person within them.

“Oh really, than why are the any kids living on the streets.”

Why are there over 200,000 homeless people in New York? These questions don’t always have answers.

People can take in kids to live with them and raise them if they are adults and homeless its harder to care for them.


“Its her body.YEs it is, Shes the one who has to go through having the baby and caring for it till she gets it to a place that will take it if she can get the child there.”

Yes it’s her body but you have to understand; the human inside her is not her life. The life inside of her is a totally different human life. Yes, she and a man created the child but the child is a separate entity, a separate person. She and the father have the obligation to protect the child.

And if she can't?


“and just doesn't want to have the baby.”

What if she has the child and after five years she doesn’t want her kid anymore? Does she have the right to kill her kid? I know I’ve said this before, I feel that we’re repeating ourselves.

NO, but the child already has a life in the world and is already growing and experiencing
“Um no, if the woman has cancer or the baby will be born with cancer or if there are complications to the birth.”

Yes but that’s cancer, not abortion. The child can still be helped maybe and if not, then who are we to play God? Who are we to say this person should die because it would be better that way? When did people decide that they have the right to take lives away and play God?

(So no we let the woman die by having a baby who will die anyway with cancer or what? Its both, if she has an abortion she may live.)

Stephanos
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108 posted 01-18-2007 12:36 AM       View Profile for Stephanos   Email Stephanos   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Stephanos's Home Page   View IP for Stephanos

LR:
quote:
My observation isn't that it's 'general' -- it's that it's settled.

Really? Settled?  In what sense do you mean?  Merely that the law stands as it is?  That's a far cry from settled.  But if and when we ever get stricter laws concerning abortion, I'll certainly remind you of that comment with a twinkle in my eye ... though I don't think I would ever try to use the mere status quo as an argument for what is right.     

Fact is, there's a big debate in this country (in spite of fluctations in law) of whether the unborn are human beings.  And that is the hinge upon which all other discussions swing.


Stephen.
rwood
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109 posted 01-18-2007 09:52 AM       View Profile for rwood   Email rwood   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for rwood

rhia~ I commend you for your involvement and input on such a tough topic.

"Um yeah you are wrong about that sorry."

Okay. My statement was directed to the abortion link, and the techniques of the site. I felt it wouldn't have a high appeal to teens, which may be good or bad. Though, after careful consideration of my statement, there's an upside and downside to being wrong.

Upside: Most teens are mindful, mature and responsible with their time, interests and attentions.

Does this more properly apply?

Downside: Expecting teens to be somewhat carefree and caught up with ordinary youthful things is wrong.

Though I feel there's nothing wrong with talking to friends on the phone, pizza, painting nails, etc..avoiding excess. According to studies, attention span is a very real problem for many teens, so my comment contains unfair or exaggerated time periods, though multi-tasking contributes to the amount of time spent among interests and tasks. I've not talked to or raised any teens that enjoyed cleaning their room, doing dishes, or homework, and some refuse.

I realize a good balance is hard to establish. It usually takes an adult who is involved, dedicated and devoted to help ensure a youth's progress and success into adulthood.

Even adults need a network, because they make plenty of mistakes and have to answer to them.

It's a shame when a person's immediate and personal network, becomes a disembodied voice or a cold campaign of information.

But, sadly, that's the cold hard facts of life for many.

Teens concern me, because abortion is a hard topic for adults to handle on their own.

So I'm not picking on teens. I'm interested and involved. Their lives are just as important as those who are in the position of caring for them.

There's a mass of info out there about safe sex for teens. There's a mass in support of abstinence. There are examples all around us, why each should be applied. How can all of that escape the attention and support of thousands of teens per year?

Is it because teens have tuned out what's happening all around them? Do they feel that intercourse is conveniently in the free-zone between youth and adulthood? Say, somewhere between naivety and some sort of social/environmental push in the direction of adult?

I'm just going by what you said about "not knowing any better," and issues of home life, street-life, society in general.

I'd like to hear what you have to say about these things. If my questions are unclear, I'll try to clarify, because I want to understand how any teen doesn't know any better when it comes to consensual matters of sex.

Is it possible that teens claim unawareness, naivety, youthful stupidity when the consequences arise, because it's convenient?

What do you feel are the reasons, when America is bombarding the airwaves, magazines, television, net, educational and institutional arenas, and every other media and society driven effort there is about teen pregnancy?

Thank you,

Reg



rhia_5779
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110 posted 01-18-2007 02:23 PM       View Profile for rhia_5779   Email rhia_5779   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for rhia_5779

If they are having sex they don't understand how bad of an idea that is. Its not consensual untill they are eighteen. They don't understand what they are doing and givinb up\gaining at the time. They should wait till if they do get pregnant or if something bad happens they do know how to handle it .

They need to def be educated on the topic better and learn how to make the right decisions from their parents and teachers. They shouldn't be having sex and if they are then they don't know any better. IF they are seventeen on the verge of eighteen then there is less of an excuse.
For the most part they don't understand
Ron
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111 posted 01-18-2007 03:59 PM       View Profile for Ron   Email Ron   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Ron's Home Page   View IP for Ron

quote:
What do you feel are the reasons, when America is bombarding the airwaves, magazines, television, net, educational and institutional arenas, and every other media and society driven effort there is about teen pregnancy?

The boy who cried wolf was heard well enough. He just wasn't believed.
rwood
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112 posted 01-18-2007 04:25 PM       View Profile for rwood   Email rwood   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for rwood

rhia~ Thank you. You seem to have strength and knowledge on the topic of teen pregnancy and the prevention of it. I hope you reach out to all those around you that may not have such an advantage. Your voice and your mind is so important.

State laws vary on the age of consensual sex. Some are listed as 16. I think we can both agree that's too young, but unfortunately there's not much anyone can do, once the doing is done.

I'll tell you a commonality among the girls who I talk to and care for is poor self-esteem. Many mistake the attentions of a boy to be something they need more than self-respect. Adults can fall into the same trap.

Another thing some of the girls have in common? They were home, alone, a lot, and said they were simply bored and disappointed with life. Womanhood (to them) seemed like a natural step, having to spend so much time on their own.

None of them felt they were doing anything unnatural or harmful. It's almost as if their bodies meant nothing, and their future was already non-existent. So yeah, I can see where you say they don't understand, but it's still so heartbreaking when such promising youths are broadsided by too common an occurrence of pregnancy.

And don't get me wrong, I think there are way too many adults who are being very poor examples and irresponsible parents as well. I already mentioned how thousands of grandparents are raising a second generation, They know somebody has to care for those children.

So I highly agree about parents and education. Again--a network of support. Effectiveness still seems to be a problem though.

Here's a link that might interest you or you might already have some knowledge of:

http://www.girlsinc.org/ic/page.php?id=1


This organization has been highly beneficial and educational for girls and their parent/s. My daughter and I mentor at our local program. They always need more volunteers.

Take care,
Reg


Ron~ Too true and too sad. Babies are second to Babes (beautiful women) and sexuality is pushed up and out in everything from deodorant to Doritos. How do we get any message across as serious and believable.
Denise
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113 posted 01-21-2007 12:38 PM       View Profile for Denise   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Denise

The teleconference was very informative. I guess I would say that the basic message was that as more and more people become informed as to the deceptive tactics and the lies upon which the abortion industry was founded and continues to flourish, the demand for abortion will decrease as hearts and minds are changed by the true facts surrounding the issue.

More girls and women will come to see that the fetus is much more than a blob of tissue as more pregnancy crisis centers obtain and utilize the 4-D ultrasound machines now available. Thanks to such advances in medical science that can disprove the contentions of the abortion industry, it is highly unlikely that if Roe were being decided today that it would be decided as it was in 1973, which is also an encouraging thought.

I was also heartened to hear that one of the pregancy crisis centers, in the Chicago area, I think, just celebrated its 30,000 saved baby. So there is progress being made in the pro-life movement despite Roe, and that progress will continue as more and more people become informed via the grassroots efforts of the pro-life movement until eventually the tide will turn against abortion on demand through the dissemination of truth, whether Roe is ever overturned or not or whether a Constitutional Life Amendment is ever passed or not.

Although Mr. Kupelian's book was offered at a reduced rate, I didn't feel that the sale of the book was the reason for the teleseminar. I feel that the message was to educate yourself and others, and to volunteer your time, effort, and resources, as you are able, to the pro-life movement.

If anyone would like the link to the 70 minute teleseminar you can email me and I will be glad to forward it to you.


Earth's crammed with heaven, and every common bush afire with God, but only he who sees takes off his shoes.
Elizabeth Barrett Browning
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114 posted 01-21-2007 01:46 PM       View Profile for Local Rebel   Email Local Rebel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Local Rebel

How do tactics effect a debate Denise?

quote:

Really? Settled?  In what sense do you mean?  Merely that the law stands as it is?  That's a far cry from settled.  But if and when we ever get stricter laws concerning abortion, I'll certainly remind you of that comment with a twinkle in my eye ... though I don't think I would ever try to use the mere status quo as an argument for what is right.    

Fact is, there's a big debate in this country (in spite of fluctations in law) of whether the unborn are human beings.  And that is the hinge upon which all other discussions swing.




Yes I'm speaking legally Stephen.  There aren't fluctiations in Supreme Court decisions.  You have 7 of 9 appointments by conservative, pro-life Presidents who haven't moved the ball since Roe.

But, obviously there is debate between people like us -- it just doesn't have any real effect on the core issue.  Stare decisis http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stare_decisis is the policy of the U.S. legal system.  The odds of reversing Roe are not high and at best less than even.

Denise
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115 posted 01-21-2007 03:34 PM       View Profile for Denise   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Denise

I'm not really sure what you mean, L.R., but if I think I know what you're asking, my reply would be that an actual and honest debate can't happen unless it is undergirded with TRUTH.

Now, enjoy the game!
Local Rebel
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116 posted 01-21-2007 04:53 PM       View Profile for Local Rebel   Email Local Rebel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Local Rebel

Thanks Denise -- I will...

Argue the arguments instead of against the arguers then...although the vituparation/ invective is a longstanding tradition of the Progymnasmata we tend to do better with thesis.

The way to counter an argument is with data.
Denise
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117 posted 01-23-2007 12:30 PM       View Profile for Denise   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Denise

I agree, L.R., but I also see nothing wrong with exposing the deceptive practices and falsehoods in conjunction with conveying the accurate data. The lies have been perpetrated for so long that many people just assume they are true without a second thought. By exposing the Abortion Industry for what it is, and the lies upon which it was founded and thrives, just might lead some people to start to question long held assumptions, especially the post-Roe younger generations who have known nothing else.
A Romantic Heart
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118 posted 02-06-2007 11:15 PM       View Profile for A Romantic Heart   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for A Romantic Heart

God is in control of life and death, he holds the keys to it, only HE knows the FUTURE and what is best, God is love, What if Mary was forced to have an abortion, Would Jesus still have been born to save us all from our sins, yes!(Another Virgin) but he knew the future and he knew Marys heart,she would carry Jesus and birth him life, because God has a purpose for each life conceived and brought forth in the womb,(God is in control and uses what or who he wants to bring forth what he sets out to be fullfilled or accomplished) even before you were born, I knew the number of hairs on your head, declares the lord (Scripture)
God places each child, each soul for a reason, a purpose, we don't know that reason at the moment, but maybe that child will grow-up and be the next child to end cancer , etc. It is not for us to judge, for God knows the plans he has for each and everyone of us,
Jer.29:11 "I know the plans I have for you," says the Lord, Plans for good and not for evil, to give you a future and a hope.
IT is our CHOICE to choose to follow Jesus, his ways and his teachings, we have a free will, God gave us free will, he is not a dictator. If you make someone love you they don't really love you, but if they CHOOSE to love you, they really love you.
Jesus died for all the babies that never got to live, and he died for all the mothers who made a bad choice to kill those babies, he loves them too, he forgives, because his mercy and grace and his love is so deep, his love is eternal.
There are couples out there who are praying for a child to love and hold, who can't have natural children, but God has a purpose for them to adopt children , they are all Gods children anyway, he is just allowing us to be the overseers for them, everything I have is Gods, he gave it all to me, and all of it goes back to him. So who are we to take a life and kill it? We don't know the knowledge of the future.
When sin entered into the world through Adam and Eve, then there was life and death, good and evil, right and wrong. For they tasted of the knowledge of good and evil. God told them not to eat of that tree, but they CHOSE to eat and disobey,
when they could have had life eternal and without hate, without murder, without all the evil, they thought they were smarter than God, and chose to do what they wanted, not what God was trying to tell them for their own good, because he loves us.They could've had a life free from death, but sin and disobediance brings forth death. So God was telling them something for their own Good, like our parents told us, they didn't listen and now that is why we have death, once born it is ordained for man to die. To everything there is a season, and if you have life, you have death, if you have good you have evil. Heaven is the only place without sin, for God cannot look upon sin.Jesus was without sin, until he took on the sins of the world, our sins at the cross. Then he gained the keys to heaven and hell, to life and death, he rose on the third day and was brought back to life, and now lives forever in heaven. His Holy spirit lives inside each believer, each believer is to be christlike...to do what Jesus would do....Jesus wouldn't kill babies yet to be born.

That one child, one life, could be the next Billy Ghraham or the next president, next inventor of something we need. We destroy ourselves with unintelligence.

On another note, I was born with a birth defect, I am so glad my mother didn't have me aborted because I wasn't perfect, neither is she, you, or any of us, Jesus is the only perfect one.

The doctors told my mom that I would need special tubes in my ears to hear, speech classes, braces, surgery.etc.

Thank God, Praise the Lord Jesus, she trusted God and prayed for me, I didn't need tubes, I didn't need speech classes.

I made A's and B's in school, I was told I could pursue a career in modeling, but I live for Jesus, I not only talk and get up to speak in front of people , I sing and write songs for Jesus.

I help people who are less, who are in need, because I know, I have been there, I know what they feel and what they are going through,(They feel unloved, unperfect as to the worlds standards) I am sent to love, and give love, show love, Gods love to all. His love is unconditional.He loves me they way I am...not for who I am , but for what I am in him for him. He loves you just the way you are and knew that 2000 years ago when he died on the cross, he died for all the people that had been, were, and were yet to come, he died and took your place , the palce of your children and grandchildren, he knew we would all sin, and he took our punishment before God so we wouldn't have to, he loved us so much to die for us,
WHO would die for you? your mother? father? best friend? who would lay down their life to save yours? and if saving lifes was so important to Jesus, that he suffered and died on the cross for each life, that was or ever will be, then we should hold life just as precious and save each life that we can.

If I didn't have the birth defect, I would have been arrogant and prideful, selfish, non-loving, giving. The scar on my face keeps me humble, and it allows me to hear and see the suffering of others. Prideful and arrogance is what Satan was cast out of heaven for, by God himself, because he wanted to be God.

Sound familiar?

Who is in control of your life?
you or God?

I found out the hard way....GOD is in control of all things Great or small!

Even if you love him or not, accept him as your Lord and savior or not....God is in Control!

We are not God...and never will we have the love or the intelligence he has.

What a blessing....go here!
http://piptalk.com/pip/Forum29/HTML/002134.html

J. M. Barrie, the playwright, may have said it best when he wrote, “God gave us memories so that we might have roses in December.”

[This message has been edited by A Romantic Heart (02-06-2007 11:48 PM).]

LeeJ
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119 posted 02-07-2007 10:32 AM       View Profile for LeeJ   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for LeeJ

My real mom, constantly reminded me while growing up that she almost went for a then, very illegal and very dangerous abortion.  I am so so thankful she didn't and that I'm here and had the chance to experience life, love, birth, bringing up my own child, now a grandchild, friends, writing, horses, the ocean, and all the wonderful things I've seen, felt and touched.  

Last night I saw a program about a woman who was raped years ago...she seriously at that time, contemplated abortion...but instead, gave her baby girl up for adoption.
  
That Baby Girl turned into a fine upstanding, intelligent, beautiful woman, who went searching for her birth mother...now, years later, she has found her birth mother and both of them are so so thankful to be together...to laugh, to love, to experience life together. They now work together giving seminars to girls who are contemplating abortion.  

The mother herself explains, I was so young when I was raped, confused and afraid, and a virgin teenager.  She couldn't go through with abortion and decided to give the child up for adoption, now she is so thankful she did, and so much more is her daughter.

I disagree totally with abortion...for very personal reasons..

Time changes people, and at the time, when children are getting abortions, they or they're parents are only thinking of a quick fix to the problem, in my way of thinking, abortion is an action of convenience only.

Later, much later in life, when girls grow into a women, they remember the abortion they've had, and for the rest of their life, live with deeply rooted reservations, guilt, sorrow at the loss for a decission they made when they were young...some seek out help dealing with the now overbearing guilt, some will never forgive themselves...some always wonder...and yes, some have no reservations...b/c they convince themselves it was ok to do.

Long story short...no matter what happens in our lives, somehow we get by, and we will make it...child or not...but what I'm suggesting here is, before any one person suggests to a young girl to have an abortion, I believe they should think very long and hard about the consequences.    

Children are our purpose to a great degree...

I did have it pretty rough growing up, but there were those who had it much rougher then I did...we all get by, it molds our characters...and I turned out ok...with some minor flaws... , that I'm still working on...but, bottom line...I'm so so happy to have been here, to have experienced, and to be alive, thank God, my birth mother, was not able to go for that abortion.  Thank God I'm writing this so called testimony right now...and thank God for the family across the street who took me into their home and treated me like they're own child.

Everything happens for a reason, even birth defects...we learn to deal and cope...and if we can't there is always a couple out there who are praying for a child to hold, care for and love.

My cousin was 15 years old when she conceived her first child...she is fine today, and by the way, still married to the same man, all her children are respectful, mature people...they were great kids...it depends on the mother, and all those involved raising those kids...but all children, in my book, deserve a chance at life, as to me, there is no greater gift, then life and living.

Again, we've sadly become a nation of quick fixes and instant gratification...I wonder if we could be loosing the ability to actually deal with the root of problems...problem solving...working through them and living up to our wrongs, accepting responsiblity and doing what we have to do...regardless of our bad choices.  

I'd also like to say, I know two families that have had down syndrome retarted children...they to feel very strongly against abortion...


These are simply my thoughts on the subject of abortion...I really have not read all the above.  


  

[This message has been edited by LeeJ (02-09-2007 12:22 PM).]

rhia_5779
Senior Member
since 06-09-2006
Posts 1304
California


120 posted 02-20-2007 06:20 AM       View Profile for rhia_5779   Email rhia_5779   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for rhia_5779

What if I said I might not believe god exists at all?

If god knows what is best , so are you saying that when people die its for the best.

How do you know the fourteen year old who dies as a runaway wouldnt be the next president or such?
 
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