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Sex Discrimination in Public Schools?

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iliana
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since 12-05-2003
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0 posted 10-25-2006 02:21 AM       View Profile for iliana   Email iliana   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for iliana

Now we have this:  U.S. Eases Rules On Educating Sexes Separately

I'd pity the poor teacher who had a whole classroom of either all boys or all girls.  

What do you think?
serenity blaze
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since 02-02-2000
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1 posted 10-25-2006 03:32 AM       View Profile for serenity blaze   Email serenity blaze   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for serenity blaze

Actually, I had the experience of both.

I attended high school in a region that did precisely just this thing.

My freshman and sophomore years were spent in a "girls only" high school. It was a new school, and still under construction those two years, but I think there was a very free atmosphere during that time. Granted, I don't know if that was due to the students, or the lack of anxiety of the staff, but I personally felt I learned more during that time. (Dress codes, etc? Forget it--no need.)

When they integrated the boys during my junior year--um, I actually felt sorry for the boys.

I recall, distinctly, a friend of mine, leaning up against the wall outside a stairwell, surveying the drooling adolescent boys, and saying, "I knew they were going to send boys--but did they have to send us boys?"

Um, y'see, we'd grown accustomed to skipping out with the construction workers.

We wished 'the boys' would go back to the apparent armpit that spawned them.

But that was just my experience, and not necessarily a reflection of the opinions of the management.
iliana
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2 posted 10-25-2006 03:53 AM       View Profile for iliana   Email iliana   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for iliana

Funny, Ser!  I'm not sure how I feel about it.  My niece went her freshman year co-ed and then to a private all-girls school.  She turned out fine; but the competition for her was much more strenuous.  She probably would have ended up with scholarships had she stayed in public school with co-ed classes.  

Some learned folks say we girls learn differently than boys.  I don't really believe it is a gender thing though.  I've known very left-brained girls and right-brained guys.  I kinda feel like growing up with the opposite sex, we learn to adjust to them.  If boys and girls were educated separately K-12, I'm afraid this would turn into either a war zone or a patriarchal society.  But...that's just me.  Ah-hah....maybe the answer is to separate by the way kids learn and not by gender.  

And it's late and I'm probably talking nonsense...but I just couldn't resist letting you know I read your comment.  *hugs*......jo
serenity blaze
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3 posted 10-25-2006 06:05 AM       View Profile for serenity blaze   Email serenity blaze   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for serenity blaze

I'm just not sure what your point is Jo.

My son came home yesterday, and I learned he had to go pee outside  (grounds for expulsion?I have no idea.)

But I was told that there is only a thirty minute "relief" period for the kids at West Jefferson High School--in Jefferson Parish Lousisiana. I'm told the boys are piled in there so bad they can't line up and have proceeded to pee wherever--sinks, walls, until urine is leaking out into the hallway.

sighing here, forgive me Jo

but none of this is funny

COME TO AN INNER CITY SCHOOL

I beg you.

(and trust me, this ain't even New Orleans, it's outer limits)

seperating girls and boys is far down on my priority list at the moment.
nakdthoughts
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4 posted 10-25-2006 06:34 AM       View Profile for nakdthoughts   Email nakdthoughts   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for nakdthoughts

"maybe the answer is to separate by the way kids learn and not by gender."


Don't you think that is what they do now and have been doing for years?  Even in first grade children move from one class to another grouped by what is supposedly their learning abilities in reading, math and  science.
They spend more time collecting their materials to move into the halls only to drop them and waste time waiting for the other class(es) to line up and change rooms.

Young children especially, are each at their own early levels of learning and I don't see why they don't go back to self- contained homeroom/classrooms except for specials( art, music, gym) so that they may have time to do the extra fun things that make learning enjoyable both for the teacher and students.

(my opinion only)

They say they don't want to label children but they do when they have GT ..gifted and talented... and what are they gifted and talented with? these children are between the ages of  5 and 9?  I know every parent wants to believe their child is gifted and talented...instead of being special only to them.

I don't have enough time to explain since I am on my way out the door to work at school and am preparing to help a 3rd grade class make  individual quilt wall hangings, based on reading a story "The Keeping Quilt", if I can find the time to pull them out of their lunches or lunch recess to complete them, since their teacher has no time during the exchange of classes.

M
Christopher
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5 posted 10-25-2006 11:17 AM       View Profile for Christopher   Email Christopher   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Christopher

Wish I would have gone to an all-girl school.
quote:
She said school environments were structured to better suit boys' way of learning. American University researchers found in a study of over 100 classrooms conducted during the 1980s that teachers bestowed more attention on boys than on girls.
Anyone else see the irony here? It's not about segregating the girls from the boys, but, rather, catering to the boys' stupidity. Aren't schools set up to teach at the level of the lowest students?

In reality... why don't we all just forego public school and put our children in private schools where they can get the direct, personalized attention that will help them excel in life? We can make sure the boys and girls are separated. We can also ensure that we keep them away from (or put them in) focused religious curriculum. Better yet, we can make sure the administration of the school board is resolutely Republican, not some squeeky Democrat or , a LIBERAL! And hey, if that works, we can probably start keeping them away from any of those ethnic type people that seem unable to learn quite as fast as Johnny.

I'm sure children can learn textbooks just fine without members of the other sex... in fact, perhaps even better. Of course, that's the problem with much of education - while we devote all our efforts on the ability to recite text from the pages of history, we neglect to notice that life is rarely about recitation and more about cooperation, understanding and intermingling.

If boys and girls don't learn how to co-exist during the "formative" years, how well is that education going to go once they hit the "real" world and have to do so... or, perhaps, will we just end up extending that segregation to the workplace and the rest of life?
iliana
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6 posted 10-25-2006 01:42 PM       View Profile for iliana   Email iliana   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for iliana

Ser, Christopher has made the point for me....or rather asked the appropriate question.  My heart goes out for the the children of New Orleans and you know I wish there was more focus on your city.  Of course, there are more important matters at hand.  There are so many matters at hand.

I put this up because I found it quite controversial, particularly for educators.  Additionally, I wonder if we are not headed for "corporate" schools and this would, perhaps, be a step in that direction.  Perhaps this sounds far fetched, but alot has happened that has just flown by us all these past few years.

Maureen, is there a difference in "leveling" the classes and teaching to the right or left brain?  I used to teach music privately (never public school) so I was always working with right brainers and it was always one on one, so I could adjust per student.  I'm not up on public education and how they sort who is in which class.  When I was in school, they did it by grades and test scores.  Does that work that way now only with right and left brain dominance?  

[This message has been edited by iliana (10-25-2006 02:14 PM).]

serenity blaze
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7 posted 10-25-2006 01:56 PM       View Profile for serenity blaze   Email serenity blaze   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for serenity blaze

I think what upsets me more, is the disparity of class.

We've all heard the selling point of real estate when the agent murmers smugly "and it's located in the U.B. Rich school district..."

But? shrug-- things are looking up since the state took over the troubled schools. My daughter was actually issued a text book!

I hadn't seen one of those for years...

sigh

I'm having cramps. forgive me

Christopher
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8 posted 10-25-2006 03:11 PM       View Profile for Christopher   Email Christopher   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Christopher

It's not really that big of a stretch to go from open sex segregation to open class segregation, is it?
serenity blaze
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9 posted 10-25-2006 03:29 PM       View Profile for serenity blaze   Email serenity blaze   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for serenity blaze

*scratching my head*

okay.

I'm confused.

Be patient with me, 'cause I concede my opinion is probably colored by the fact that I had such a positive personal experience.

splain it to me, gently please.

Even the rice crispies are hollering at me lately.
Essorant
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10 posted 10-25-2006 05:01 PM       View Profile for Essorant   Email Essorant   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Essorant's Home Page   View IP for Essorant

As long as both genders have equal learning opportunities, and neither is treated as superior/inferior, I don't have any problem with offering both mixed and segregated learning enviroments.  
Christopher
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11 posted 10-25-2006 05:17 PM       View Profile for Christopher   Email Christopher   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Christopher

it's all about regression, right? a reversal of status quo - as i read not too long ago, there is still a considerable gap in salaries between males and females in equivalent jobs.
http://www.purchasing.com/article/CA6289416.html  
quote:
This year's results indicate a $23,700 gap between the average compensation earned by men ($85,900) and women. Survey results show that in percentage terms, women's average compensation increased more slowly than men's did over the past year.
This shows that the gap has yet to be filled and filed away... so, if we begin segregating girls and boys, it provides a ready impetus to stretch that gap - not that it would necessarily happen, but...

So, divide girls and boys because they learn differently, then what's next? If you can justify that, you could go on and justify that someone of a differing socio-economic class learns differently due to a varied upbringing, difference in nutrition, difference in intellectual capability between middle-class and low-class life requirements.

I guess my problem is even past that and back to the whole "real world" issue - learning textbooks in the classes isn't the true education one takes (or should) from their time in school - it's the cooperative nature of community, the ability to USE your brain (not resuscitate previously voiced concepts and histories), the ability to co-exist and mutually support your fellow human beings... not your fellow gender or socio-economic class.
iliana
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12 posted 10-25-2006 05:21 PM       View Profile for iliana   Email iliana   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for iliana

Christopher, you and I are on the same page.  Thanks for your input.  
Edward Grim
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13 posted 12-28-2006 07:54 PM       View Profile for Edward Grim   Email Edward Grim   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Edward Grim's Home Page   View IP for Edward Grim

I was home-schooled so I can't be of much help. Though in my days of being heavily schizophrenic, I suppose I was in an all boys' school.


I read here that ladies learn differently than dudes... It must be true, because the majority of women I meet are intensely smarter than me. Females also mature quicker than dudes which is apparent when you look at some of the older guys today.


Ed

And I said to the devil, "You better leave my spleen alone."

Huan Yi
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14 posted 12-29-2006 08:16 PM       View Profile for Huan Yi   Email Huan Yi   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Huan Yi

.

Do boys and girls respond the same to the exactly same
and equal environment of same and equal opportunity?
I seem to recall a spate of articles some small time ago
bemoaning the answer being no.

.
 
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