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O'Reilly v. San Francisco

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Mistletoe Angel
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0 posted 11-11-2005 03:07 PM       View Profile for Mistletoe Angel   Email Mistletoe Angel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Mistletoe Angel's Home Page   View IP for Mistletoe Angel

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10004302/

With San Francisco citizens recently voting in favor of a ban on military recruiters on high school and college campuses, O'Reilly responded to the passing of the measure with these words on his radio program Tuesday:

*

"Listen, citizens of San Francisco, if you vote against military recruiting, you're not going to get another nickel in federal funds. Fine. You want to be your own country? Go right ahead,"

"And if al-Qaida comes in here and blows you up, we're not going to do anything about it. We're going to say, look, every other place in America is off limits to you, except San Francisco. You want to blow up the Coit Tower? Go ahead,"


*

Understandably, the debate on military recruiting has been a polarizing one, where, as I have previously mentioned, I'm all in support of military recruiters holding a table event on campus or talking about the benefits of signing up in a high school gymnasium in assembly.

I simply believe in the American ideal of "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness", which
radiates just as true to this day than the warmth of the hands who penned it down. I absolutely acknowledge that there are indeed a small number of Americans even now who truly do have interest in serving America through the military, and I absolutely respect that and have nothing against that, for it is their choice, it is their life, it is their pursuit of happiness, and though I have no desire at all to serve America through the
military, I will not violate the wishes of this small group of Americans.

What is inappropriate in my mind is how some military recruiters are exploiting their visits in doing things like forcing school principals to hand over entire student records and contact information. I have no problem with recruiters simply holding a table event or holding a school assembly in a gymnasium, but a number of
recruiters are not choosing the honorable path in convincing young minds about the benefits of military service and rather exploiting their visits to usurp that choice, that liberty, that pursuit of happiness of thousands of young men and women nationwide.

Furthermore, young Americans crucially need to understand both sides of the story; they
need to understand what they may very well be dealing with and the potential consequences of signing up. My friend Randy Meador signed up for the National Guard in 2002, about a year before the war in Iraq, and he signed up because he wanted college money and because he believed it would be a great thing to fly out to flood sites and humanitarian missions and aid those in need. Luckily, he is not among the National Guard
in Iraq currently, but our National Guard is being operated very much like the U.S Army and Marines, which it is not their intended purpose.

The truth is, many young Americans who sign up to serve, a majority of whom do it for job experience and college money, never receive what the recruiters tell them. Many veterans who return to serve who are told they are guaranteed work once their shift is completed actually get less work than those who never served by a 13% margin. And,
most importantly, it must be understood and explained by recruiters that your very life will be on the line and the chance you can be lost in battle is real.

*

*

Anyway, I am deeply offended by O'Reilly's words and believe, beyond the important debate of military recruiting, his words were most troubling, for San Francisco is just as American as any other major city, and considering how Portland shares many of the same opinions as San Francisco, to think he wouldn't mind places like mine being attacked is insulting.



Sincerely,
Noah Eaton

"If we have no peace, it is because we have forgotten that we belong to each other"

Mother Teresa

Mistletoe Angel
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1 posted 11-15-2005 09:04 PM       View Profile for Mistletoe Angel   Email Mistletoe Angel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Mistletoe Angel's Home Page   View IP for Mistletoe Angel

O'Reilly continues to defend his attacks on San Francisco and encourage mass McCarthyism:

*****************************

1) http://msnbc.msn.com/id/10004302/

O'Reilly first made the comments following last Tuesday's elections.

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2) O'Reilly defends comments the following day. (November 12, 2005)

"What I said isnít controversial. What I said needed to be said. Iím sitting here and Iím looking at a city that has absolutely no clue about what the world is. None. You know, if you had been hit on 9/11 instead of New York, believe me, you would not have voted against military recruting. Yet the left-wing, selfish, Land of Oz philosophy that the media and the city politicians have embraced out there is an absolute intellectual disgrace."

*

3) Yesterday, O'Reilly on his syndicated radio program claimed that his comments was a "satirical riff" and added he promises to publish the names of everyone who supports sites criticizing his comments on his official web-site:

"Iím glad the smear sites made a big deal out of it. Now we can all know who was with the anti-military internet crowd. Weíll post the names of all who support the smear merchants on billoreilly.com. So check with us."

*

*********************************

Now let me make some things plainly clear here.

San Francisco has always been a most successful American city, which truly is as all-American as every other metropolitan city in the nation.

If Bill O'Reilly seriously believes that he wouldn't care if San Francisco was ataacked by al-Qaeda, he is literally defending the 18,000 San Franciscoans between the age of 0-24 be killed, many of which are not anti-military by any means and are simply opposed of predatory recruitment as their mayor Gavin has put it.

It saddens me deeply he continues to resort to these hateful words.

Sincerely,
Noah Eaton

"If we have no peace, it is because we have forgotten that we belong to each other"

Mother Teresa

Brad
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2 posted 11-19-2005 08:27 PM       View Profile for Brad   Email Brad   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Brad

Just curious. How many are going to sign up for "the list"?

Youtoocanbeblacklisted

Mistletoe Angel
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3 posted 11-19-2005 09:18 PM       View Profile for Mistletoe Angel   Email Mistletoe Angel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Mistletoe Angel's Home Page   View IP for Mistletoe Angel

I personally don't really get why many are basically drafting themselves onto O'Reilly's blacklist. I'd rather not get involved, as I don't like to play the black and white game and I don't like to think of some as friends and some as enemies, but rather that some are just more different than each other though deep down in heart we share more in common than in difference.

All I can say is I hope O'Reilly is at least well aware of the impact of his words; that he's basically endorsing an attack on American soils, and besides his rhetoric being McCarthyesque and vitriotic, his words are also very much threatening our national security.

Sincerely,
Noah Eaton

"If we have no peace, it is because we have forgotten that we belong to each other"

Mother Teresa

Midnitesun
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4 posted 11-19-2005 09:25 PM       View Profile for Midnitesun   Email Midnitesun   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Midnitesun

Personally? I think he is a big idiot with an audience of bigger idiots. I've watched him a couple of times, for comic relief.
~sigh~
San Francisco is a beautiful town, filled with the diversity that IS America. If only people could learn to see that variety is a necessity for survival.....
Mistletoe Angel
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5 posted 11-19-2005 10:15 PM       View Profile for Mistletoe Angel   Email Mistletoe Angel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Mistletoe Angel's Home Page   View IP for Mistletoe Angel

Exactly, Kacey!

San Francisco is one of America's most unique cities. The conference that formed the United Nations was held there in 1945, in the War Memorial Opera House. The Treaty of San Francisco was signed here in 1951, which foramlly ended war with Japan. San Francisco is truly the center of alternative culture, from beat poets to music to their comedy clubs which got comedians like Robin Williams and Ellen DeGeneres into stardom. And it has some of the most breathtaking architecture and scenery of any city.

Now, you may or may not agree with the deep liberal politics of the Bay Area, but it is quite naive to think that liberals have "hijacked" the city as O'Reilly claims. Since the early 20th century it has always been a public center for counterculture; San Francisco is famous and defined for it. Even before the 1950's when City Lights Bookstore began widely circulating Beat literature has the city been host to these ideals. But the bottom line is, San Francisco is as all-American as apple pie, just as American as any other American city. It has influenced the nation many times over, from the arts to the dot.com boom, and is a true crown jewel of or nation's diversity.

Portland, Oregon is very much like San Francisco culturally, though smaller and with much less population density. So when I heard O'Reilly saying to go ahead and blow up the Coit Tower, he was also basically insinuating al-Qaeda can go ahead and blow up the Rose Garden too since we are close cousins to San Francisco.

Beyond just the hurt of his words, I simply believe O'Reilly has not even read the text of the two measures San Francisco passed. If he bothered to read the entire text, the citizens of San Francisco were not simply just going to vote against the military, period. That's nothing but a logical fallacy; the specifics of the vote are revealed plainly in the text.

I am one who believes in fostering diversity to the fullest. There are some places in America which hold views I find extreme and those I strongly disagree with. Topeka, Kansas, for instance, is influenced in part by the radical views of Fred Phelps of the Westboro Baptist Church, who is intensely anti-homosexual and even hosts a web-site that says God hates them. As much as I find it startling that there are a number of residents who demonize homosexuals there and deny them rights to civil liberties, I would never wish anyone affliated with Westboro or anyone harm there, and certainly condemn with every piece of my heart anyone ever endorsing anything like that. Moreover, Topeka is a very unique city which has every right to its opinions and whose diversity and space to speak should be acknowledged.

Topeka is just as American as San Francisco, Denver is just as American as Colorado Springs, and I can just hope O'Reilly recognizes that the colors of American values and freedom span everywhere among our borders from sea to shining sea.

Sincerely,
Noah Eaton

"If we have no peace, it is because we have forgotten that we belong to each other"

Mother Teresa

Ringo
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6 posted 11-20-2005 01:10 AM       View Profile for Ringo   Email Ringo   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Ringo

Noah, My Friend:
One thing you need to realize... O'Reilly is doing what he does to elicit a specified response fron a specified group of people. In mymopinion, he is to be grouped in with professional wrestlers. When I hit the ring, I say things that are very carefully thought out (most times) and that qare designed to cause a known reaction among our core audience. Although I might or might not believe everything that comes out of my mouth, I know exactly what the audiences reaction is going to be, and I design my show for that reason.
O'Reilly, Scarborough, Limbaugh, Sharpton, Jackson, Franken, Moore.... they ALL cater to a specific audience, and know what that audience, and what those NOT in their audience is going to say. By allowing it to bother you, You are feeding into that specified reacction, and giving his arguments validity.

Now, it is no secret at all to anyone who has been on the Blue Pages for any length of time that I am a conservative Republican (and, yes, I DO have a card), however I do not agree with what he said. Why? Because I see the statement for what it was.

I'll make my own mistakes and sweet success
I'm not here to recreate your yesterday's best
One by one when it's done half the fun is getting there-

Mistletoe Angel
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7 posted 11-20-2005 04:25 PM       View Profile for Mistletoe Angel   Email Mistletoe Angel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Mistletoe Angel's Home Page   View IP for Mistletoe Angel

Look, I understand that O'Reilly is no stranger to controversy and has made a career and a foundation based on it.

But this particular statement I believe holds special consequences unlike many of his previous controversial statements. I happen to believe much of his dialogue has long been McCarthyesque, but he has taken it up to a new level in actually not only trying to polarize the patriotic from the unpatriotic, but seemingly endorsing harm on the most densely populated unpatriotic.

O'Reilly's show is the top-rated cable news program out of ANY news program out there of its kind. His audience and frequency is among the widest worldwide. His words can very easily encourage and embolden al-Qaeda and other terrorist organizations into doing just that; blowing up the Coit Tower and other major metropolitan areas vulnerable. His words are a security issue themselves, and a threat to our national security.

Because I believe every individual has the right to express their views openly, I am not one who is vigorously trying to push for O'Reilly to be fired for his venemous words. But the fact that he is the most popular voice on Fox News, often considered the central anchor of Fox News, shows how obvious it is that Fox News is NOT "fair and balanced" and very much is influenced by O'Reilly's radical opinions. Not everyone is like O'Reilly on the network, as I find Greta Van Susseren to be more fair and inclusive for instance, but Sean Hannity, Brit Hume, The Beltway Boys, they all seem to share O'Reilly's philosophy significantly, which can strike such dangerous messages worldwide.

I remember how offended many were when Dick Durbin spoke on the Senate floor, using a Nazi analogy in talking about how the administration is endorsing torture in Abu-Ghraib and elsewhere, how his words were influencing Al-Jareeza and terrorists and such. I remember how I was looking over the transcript of his words and believed, as clumsy as his choice of words was, how his words were taken out of context as though he believed "Americans" in general enjoy torturing and were Nazis and such. And finally I remember how many were crying for him to be censured for that.

I believe it is absolutely okay for many to still insist and hold to their beliefs that Durbin actually comapred our troops to Nazis and such, but I believe I was seeing his statement for what it was; he was simply pointing out how the administration is endorsing torture, and to this day even our own vice president has been in an aggressive unpublicized campaign to stop McCain's anti-torture legislation. (it was passed by the Senate 90-9).

Durbin's words can be questioned, no doubt about it, and I agree myself he could have made his point much more simply and could easily have avoided the use of those analogies. But it is absolutely clear what O'Reilly said. He said in his own words, "You want to blow up the Coit Tower? Go ahead!".

I feel I too am looking a it as it is, and that should be the thing that most bothers everyone who heard his words.

Sincerely,
Noah Eaton


"If we have no peace, it is because we have forgotten that we belong to each other"

Mother Teresa
majnu
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8 posted 12-11-2005 05:28 PM       View Profile for majnu   Email majnu   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for majnu

my friend i would ove to see what would happen to the us economy if Cali seceeded. they would come grovelling back at our feet. we have sea port, airports, hightech, manufacturing, textiles, we could (finally!) build some nuke power plants, we have agricultre, we have some feul cites, we have mines. and we have enough gross state product to import many things.

you gotta love the stupid conservatives - no one is quite as funny.

-majnu
--------------------------------------
Timid thoughts be not afraid. I am a Poet.

 
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