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Passions in Poetry

Gripes about music?

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Kamala
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25 posted 05-16-2003 04:42 PM       View Profile for Kamala   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Kamala

Ahhh... a discussion about music.  I'm actually a musician/ethnomusicologist by training... and i consider myself both a composer and a poet.... just to give you guys some sense of where i'm coming from.

personally, i used to HATE the boy bands, but it's true.  it actually does take talent to blend voices like that, those guys normally have a very nice open voice timbre, and the chords they're singing aren't always easy to sing together.  as far as the dancing goes, we all know that's ass... but the singing is actually good sometimes.  Boys II Men's "End of the Road" and "I'll make love to you" come to mind.

as for pop music being drab and mass produced today... it's no different now than it's ever been.  there's good stuff and there's bad stuff.  unfortunately, the radio tends to play most of the mediocre stuff, but i think there's a lot of good quality pop music being made out there -- across all genres.

i don't consider myself a heavy metal fan, but my current boyfriend is BIG into the stuff, and I've actually started to like some of it... the stuff that's *musical* AS WELL AS being hardcore, guitar scratchy, low throat grindy, etc.  

besides that stuff though, i think that anyone who's given a listen at the Flaming Lips, Sigur Ros, Beck's "Sea Change," Coldplay, Dead Can Dance, Trail of Dead, Stars of the Lid, etc.... knows that there's good stuff out there.  I mean, whether you like these types of music or not, there's no denying that they know how to put good music together, even if all you're looking at is craft.

It just so happens that I have some of the broadest musical tastes I know... hence the ethnomusicology (world musics) bent.  But in any case, I don't think genre matters as much as whether or not there's talent *within* that genre.  and there usually is in all cases.  you just have to find those artists out.

kamala
Ringo
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26 posted 05-16-2003 08:21 PM       View Profile for Ringo   Email Ringo   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Ringo

Opeth- I am not comparing them as far as talent, or influence. I would listen to 10 hours of the Chairman of the Board before I would willingly listen to even 1 Butt Street Boyz song. The point was that the original argument didn't hold water (not writing their own music, just singing, not playing an instrument, etc). Frank was vilified by the non-teeny boppers in his time as being no talent, he NEVER wrote a note in his entire life, he couldn't play a Mary Had A Little Lamb if his Mafia Membership Card depended on it. Now take out Frank and add 98 Disease, or any of the others who can't write their own tunes, or play an instrument. THAT is the ONLY comparison I would ever make between the two. Talent wise, they don't mix.

Day after day I'm more confused,
So I look for the light through the pouring rain...

Opeth
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27 posted 05-17-2003 06:43 AM       View Profile for Opeth   Email Opeth   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Opeth

Ringo ~ That is what I thought. I just wanted you to verify it.    

Opeth's Recent Playlist


1. ISIS ~ Oceanic
2. Opeth ~ My Arms, Your Hearse
3. Opeth ~ Damnation
4. Jethro Tull ~ A Passion Play
5. Sibelius ~ Symphony #2
6. Tchaikovsky ~ Symphony #6
7. Agalloch ~ The Mantle
8. Tool ~ Lateralus
9. Pink Floyd ~ Animals (If you play the bass guitar, Pigs: 3 Different Ones, is a great song to learn)
10. Fight ~ Small Deadly Space


I don't have time for Boy bands, Brittany & Madonna boppers and simple pop music, but hey, listen to what you like!
  

[This message has been edited by Opeth (05-17-2003 09:19 AM).]

Ron
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28 posted 05-17-2003 11:27 AM       View Profile for Ron   Email Ron   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Ron's Home Page   View IP for Ron

Pop culture usually gets a bad rap, and not always without justification. After all, to paraphrase Sturgeon's Law, ninety percent of it is crap; but ninety percent of EVERYTHING is crap.

What too many seem to forget is that Mozart and Shakespeare were, at one time, considered pop culture. Even the non-elite masses occasionally get it right.
Opeth
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29 posted 05-17-2003 11:34 AM       View Profile for Opeth   Email Opeth   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Opeth

Mozart's music, during his time, was not considered to be any thing really special by the masses. Unlike today's pop music stars whose music is considered to be the best of today by the masses.

Not only that, Mozart was a brilliant composer and musician. That can't be said for today's pop musicians.

Opeth ~ In search of music that makes me think.

[This message has been edited by Opeth (05-17-2003 11:36 AM).]

JP
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30 posted 05-17-2003 12:25 PM       View Profile for JP   Email JP   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit JP's Home Page   View IP for JP

This interesting thing is... pop music, pop culture - it is actually 'popular music' popular culture', it is popular for a reason I think.

While looked down on by the fringes of society, society as a whole has made such things 'popular' so it must have some merit.  Neitzche would have scoffed that the 'dirty, hairy dwarves' are just being led by their mindlessness... he may be right but honestly... do we trash things 'pop' because they suck, or because they are popular?

Yesterday is ash, tomorrow is smoke; only today does the fire burn.
Nil Desperandum, Fata viem invenient

Opeth
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31 posted 05-17-2003 12:47 PM       View Profile for Opeth   Email Opeth   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Opeth

"... pop music, pop culture - it is actually 'popular music' popular culture', it is popular for a reason I think."

~ The reason is that pop music is simple and easy to understand = non-thinking music. The majority of people (the masses) just want simple music to listen and dance to. Music that is not popular and/or not easily understood is normally met with phrases, such as, "That is just noise" or "You call that music?"

[This message has been edited by Opeth (05-17-2003 12:58 PM).]

Ron
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32 posted 05-17-2003 03:18 PM       View Profile for Ron   Email Ron   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Ron's Home Page   View IP for Ron

Great art is always simple to understand, too, at least until it is removed sufficiently from its cultural roots (say, by time or language). But, like chess, what can be understood in an hour might still take a lifetime to master. Shakespeare was popular because he told good stories. He was great because those stories, 500 years later, can still surprise us with their depth and relevance.
Opeth
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33 posted 05-18-2003 07:49 AM       View Profile for Opeth   Email Opeth   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Opeth

Dr. Seuss was a great story teller too, but I outgrew his stories a long time back.

There is a major difference between the complexity of Brittany Spear/NSYNC type pop music and Dream Theater's Metropolis PT II.

[This message has been edited by Opeth (05-18-2003 07:50 AM).]

JP
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34 posted 05-18-2003 10:22 AM       View Profile for JP   Email JP   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit JP's Home Page   View IP for JP

Opeth you do have a point, but sometimes a person just wants to enjoy themselves, listen to a catchy tune or a soothing melody without having to work and understanding or appreciating the intracasies (sp?) of the peice.

There is reason why things like the movie "Dumb & Dumber" make so much at the box office - stupidy incarnate to be sure, but sometimes a thinking person wants to just laugh at the easy things to laugh at.

BTW, for the record... Sinatra was NOT that great of a singer.  In his early days for the "pop" music he was singing he was pretty good, but no where as good as Elvis, or some of the other singers out there.  His main popularity came from the indescribably 'something', certainly not the quality of his droning voice.

Yesterday is ash, tomorrow is smoke; only today does the fire burn.
Nil Desperandum, Fata viem invenient

Opeth
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35 posted 05-18-2003 10:31 AM       View Profile for Opeth   Email Opeth   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Opeth

"Opeth you do have a point, but sometimes a person just wants to enjoy themselves, listen to a catchy tune or a soothing melody without having to work and understanding or appreciating the intracasies (sp?) of the peice."

~ For sure. I have no qualms with that ascertation. I am just making the point that pop music is popular because of its simplicity, that is all.

"There is reason why things like the movie "Dumb & Dumber" make so much at the box office - stupidy incarnate to be sure, but sometimes a thinking person wants to just laugh at the easy things to laugh at."

~ Although I believe there are better choices in "simple" comedy movies to laugh at, I understand your point.

"BTW, for the record... Sinatra was NOT that great of a singer.  In his early days for the "pop" music he was singing he was pretty good, but no where as good as Elvis, or some of the other singers out there."

~ That is, of course, a matter of opinion. My mom would totally disagree with you.

Kamala
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36 posted 05-18-2003 04:59 PM       View Profile for Kamala   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Kamala

Man, Opeth and JP... you guys have been going to town!

I have to say, I'm with Ron on the fact that great art is always simple to understand.  The greatest things are those things that are so simple that someone *should* have thought of it before but no one did.  I mean... Cage, 4:33.  How much simpler can you get?  But HE was the one who thought of putting it on stage that way, and that's the genius of it.

People rag on Philips Glass and his minimalism, saying it's simple, mindless, pop-influenced repetition.  And that's true to a certain extent... but "Opening" is one of the most amazing pieces of music ever written and sticks like glue to most people who hear it.

Being musically challenged does *not* mean complexity.  In fact, even in the case of Mozart, his music is not exceptionally complex.  What Mozart had was an impeccable melodic sense and a strong hold over the masterful use of dissonance.  But, in all, his music *is* fairly simple and *was* kind of fluff, garden party popular music at the time.

Another guy who's genius everyone goes nuts for, Bach, completely dropped off the planet for a while until Mendelssohn rediscovered him and said, "this guy rules," and now no one can get through music school without pouring over his voice-leading, etc.  But Bach, also, was a patronized composer of essentially "popular" music performed in oratorios, etc.

So, I think there is some truth to the argument that when the masses make something popular, it's for a reason.  Not always just because it's "easy."  Furthermore, "easy" does not mean bad or less good than "complicated."  I mean, Schoenberg may be all nice and challenging, and the puzzle of twelve-tone (the craft) might be interesting, but few people actually *want* to listen to that stuff and few people derive an emotional satisfaction from it.  

In my opinion, the whole new complexity 20th century THING is just alienating and arrogant... as is saying that most people are just mindless drones that dig on super easy schlock instead of recognizing good music.

I think, to be fair, we should also consider -- in this discussion -- what is *made* popular by record companies, film execs, and so forth.  There's a lot of amazing independent music out there that is essentially pop-ish but no one knows about it because it's not on the airwaves.  In any discussion of popular music, I think we have to acknowledge that sometimes, it's the *media* and not the masses that makes something popular.  Otherwise, there's just no explanation for things like Britney Spears.

In her case, I think her real talent is dancing, for instance.  And her whole "i'm a sexy 18-yr. old who kicks ass dancing" is probably what has made her popular more than the music.  And it's an image that has been propagated by the media.

Whereas, the Flaming Lips, who are great in their little cooky way have been doing their thing for almost 20 years and have finally started to catch an audience because they're on an alternative circuit.

Okay... I'll stop there.

kamala
Severn
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37 posted 05-19-2003 05:49 AM       View Profile for Severn   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Severn

Interesting discussion - Kamala, a question for you: you're obviously familiar with Lisa Gerrard which brings me to my question - what are your thoughts on Delerium and the direction it's heading in? For example, have you heard much of Rhys Fulber's outfit Conjure One?

I have to confess to being something of an Electronica fan, which many dispute as being music at all (sin sin I tell you!)...but I find I'm stuck in the mid-90's...(thinking Autechre, Biosphere)...as far as quality goes.

It's losing it's edge. Crisis!

Yeah, so anyway - back to my question before the rant kicked in..???

K

wings of the moon
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38 posted 05-19-2003 09:48 AM       View Profile for wings of the moon   Email wings of the moon   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for wings of the moon

guess its true...my friend who's into foo fighters, ash etc complains about the lack of inovation or true musical ability today.
As a dancer I need the cheesy music, for the simple reason that its easy and fun to dance too.
As for personal enjoyement however, I'll confess to loving jazzy blues type music, such as fitzgerald, nina simone, james brown (if he fits in that category) as well as jungle type music like shyfx "shake your body" lol. And of course any french sung ballad, type "autumn leaves" sigh...
The only types of music I cannot stand are techno. How is that music?
Rap doesn't always do it for me either but generally I think i'm pretty open minded to all sorts of music just as long as I can dance, dream or laugh with it
(the most recent one i listened to that made me smile all day was "always look on the bright side of life!" with the whistles after, anyone know who its by?)

"more than yesterday, less than tomorrow, i love you"

wings of the moon
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39 posted 05-19-2003 09:50 AM       View Profile for wings of the moon   Email wings of the moon   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for wings of the moon

actually : one other thing :
its BRITNEY not brittany...
the latter is a beautiful country from which i origniate and i take offense that its compared to the toothpaste grinning hamster voiced girl...
grrrr...
will now calm down
(sorry for the outburst, but its the right board, no?)

"more than yesterday, less than tomorrow, i love you"

JP
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40 posted 05-19-2003 06:13 PM       View Profile for JP   Email JP   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit JP's Home Page   View IP for JP

quote:
(the most recent one i listened to that made me smile all day was "always look on the bright side of life!" with the whistles after, anyone know who its by?)


Wasn't that by Mel Brooks and crew in History of the World Part I?  The Spanish Inquisition scenario I think...

Yesterday is ash, tomorrow is smoke; only today does the fire burn.
Nil Desperandum, Fata viem invenient

Kamala
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41 posted 05-19-2003 07:05 PM       View Profile for Kamala   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Kamala

Man, I LOVE this topic!!!  It's so great to be talking to fellow poets about music... my other love.  Now, re: "Always Look on the Bright Side of Life."  It was Monty Python and crew at the end of the film The Life of Brian.  Fantasmic movie for anyone who hasn't seen it!

Severn -- in response to your question.  Unfortunately, I don't know Delirium very well at all.  I've heard the Sarah MacLaughlin track from Brokedown Palace, and I've heard a few odd tracks every now and again by them... but I honestly don't know enough to say.  What I *can* say is that I like what I've heard, but I wouldn't be able to comment on their direction.  As for Conjure One, I've got to claim ignorance on that front as well.

I just want to say... I *totally* consider myself a fan of electronica and electronic musics, but it's such a huge world that I haven't even begun to tap into it really.  I only know a few artists and own a few tracks.  As for whether or not it's music, it most certainly IS!!!  And anyone who doesn't think so is... well... just plumb *wrong*.

As for contemporary electronic... I'm trying to think of where I might point you... Amon Tobin is a big one, Mouse On Mars is another group, Boards of Canada (who've been around for a while but are doing nice stuff).... um...  7% Solution (if you can find them)...  *I* happen to absolutely LOVE Stars of the Lid, but that is DEFINITELY an acquired taste.  Most people just find it dreadfully boring and completely uncreative.  It's kind of ambient, gauzy, fall-asleep-to music.  There's Aphex Twin, of course.  Who else?  I can't think of anymore right now.... oh yeah -- Photek, Orbital, Underworld, and Coldcut?  there are few more... and now I *really* can't think of anymore.  Hope that helps and that you don't already know and hate all of those!!!

Okay -- I'll go... but let's definitely keep this discussion up... it's not everywhere that you can go and find such an active dialogue about contemporary music.  I'm all for this thread!

Kamala
Severn
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42 posted 05-20-2003 03:23 AM       View Profile for Severn   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Severn

Kamala - love Aphex, hohum on Boards of Canada, familiar with Underworld, Orbital is already on my must get list....I REALLY recommend you get early to mid-90's Autechre. I think their debut album 'Incunabula' is their best - and their third album 'Tri Repetae' is excellent also.

I'd have to say Incunabula's become my favourite album - dark, melodic, hypnotic and utterly beautiful...something I become lost in. Particularly while listening with headphones - what a way to shut out the world. ~sigh~

(I think now I'm going to have to put it on)..

~One hour later~

And into the last track - and my favourite (if nothing else, find that song '444') - of Incunabula I decided, in my obsession, to dig out a review for you to read should you so wish...this review I feel explains Incunabula as well as it's possible without having actually heard it.
http://www.autechre.nu/cgi-bin/newspro/reviews.cgi?newsid971872260,59738,

I can honestly say this album changed my musical life heh.

~back to my former ramble~

If you can find them around there's actually a NZ group called Pitch Black who are of an international class - just very very hard to find overseas. If you ever d/l music you might have luck there.

As to Delerium - well...I can tell you right off that Silence is not particularly representative of their music as a whole. They started off as pure Electronica in the early 1990's and have moved into an ambient-electronic-dance mesh. (Silence for example). Hell, at least someone else has heard of them....I must say I was very impressed to see you mention Dead Can Dance. The key members of DCD established Delerium, which has also been closely affiliated with Enigma and Deep Forest...(and other, more minor outfits - including the aforementioned Conjure One...)

More ambient/dance/house bands I love - Future Sound Of London, Tosca, Thievery Corporation, Plaid...

I'll add some of the other ones you mentioned to my 'must look into' list...

K

ps - I forgot to mention the better known Groove Armada, Sven Vath and Massive Attack...




[This message has been edited by Severn (05-20-2003 04:55 AM).]

Kamala
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43 posted 05-21-2003 12:56 AM       View Profile for Kamala   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Kamala

Severn,

Okay -- so I've decided I pretty much always love reading your replies!  Thanks for the Autechre suggestion.  I must admit, my current precarious financial situation is going to prevent me from actually procuring said album any time soon... but it's definitely been duly noted for future reference!

Re: Delerium... interesting.  i didn't know that Deep Forest, Enigma, D-um, and DCD had all this cross over going on.  I must say, though... I've got some bones to pick with them vis a vis Enigma and Deep Forest -- both of which blatantly milked prominent world musicians for samples without any kind of remuneration.  And Deep Forest is one of the silliest, most laughable things EVER... I could not believe the blatantly exoticist, primitivist, ethnocentric babbling about "little people" at the beginning of that.  ARGH!!!  But that's just the ethnomusicologist in me talking.  Please pardon the rant... it's really not nearly as convicted as it sounds!

But as far as electronica and ambient go... I've tended to lump the two together -- along with the so-called "electronic music" of the 20th century academic composers.  My basic feeling is that if it's created using electronic means, then it's "electronic music"/electronica.  So, by that rationale, ambient is a subset in there... and I would definitely say that it's the subset I'm most fond of.  Slowdive, Hum, Mogwai, Godspeed, Sigur Ros, Stars of the Lid (which I mentioned before)... they're all more in the ambient category, I think.  But, I mean, Sigur Ros's ( ) is probably the tightest, most incredibly through-composed "popular" album I've heard in years... easily.  And they do an incredible job of blending the pop ensemble with the classic string quartet with electronic components.  (Needless to say, I love that band.)  But then there are others that are just completely unknown and impossible to find... like Auburn Lull.  I swear, you are now one of 5 people who knows that band exists.... but Auburn Lull absolutely sends me.  I fell asleep to it for months; it's amazing.

Incidentally, do you like the minimalists?  Nyman, Glass?  I'm curious because there are definitely parallels between their craft and that of the electronica artists.  And how about gamelan music? -- are you familiar with it?

Sorry if too many questions... it's just a very interesting discussion.

Yours Warmly,
Kamala

"At times, indeed, almost ridiculous--
Almost, at times, the Fool."

               ~~ T.S. Eliot

Kamala
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44 posted 05-21-2003 12:57 AM       View Profile for Kamala   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Kamala

... and ps:  Massive Attack's Mezzanine is the definitive Dark Erotica album.  I LOVE that album.

Opeth
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45 posted 05-21-2003 07:51 AM       View Profile for Opeth   Email Opeth   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Opeth

"I'm with Ron on the fact that great art is always simple to understand."

~ Always? I completely disagree with your usage of an absolute. In fact, great musical art, is more than not, imo and many others, more difficult to understand, otherwise all of those kiddie songs I sung in Kintergarden are the "Piccassos" of music.

"The greatest things are those things that are so simple that someone *should* have thought of it before but no one did.  I mean... Cage, 4:33."

~ Not necessarily simpler, but an idea that after expressed, seemed so easy that it was right there in front of all of us, which is not the same meaning as merely "simple music."

"People rag on Philips Glass and his minimalism, saying it's simple, mindless, pop-influenced repetition.  And that's true to a certain extent..."

~ I have not yet heard of any one person "rag" on Mr. Glass. I don't know any person who has ragged on Mr. Glass.

"Being musically challenged does *not* mean complexity."

~ Not always, but speak for yourself. Let's "keep it simple" shall we? I hear Ms. Spears or any rap song, and other forms of popular music...I don't know about you, but me, I understand it right away. I could hum the song mostly after one listen or two...simple melody, simple beat - this does not challenge me and it is, imo, lousy music written for the masses who want instant gratification.  As I said before, so be it, enjoy what you want to, I have no qualms.

But when listening to, oh, say a song by Liquid Tension Experiment or the 1st movement of Tchaikovsky's 6th...after listening, I don't get it...right away, but I know that there is something about the music that makes me want to go back and listen to it again, and again...and when it finally HITS...and I understand what the artists were intending, I feel good and I also know it is great music.

If I played April Ethereal by Opeth for people, I am almost certain to get from the overwhelming majority of these people, replies such as this....

1. Noise.
2. Devil music.
3. How can you listen to that crap?

etc, etc....

It took me quite some time to be able to understand that entire cd (My Arms, Your Hearse), but now that I do - I know in my mind just about every note and can hear every melody.

Great music isn't always complex, in fact, like you said, it can be so simple in its complexity or vice-versa, that I one could say "It is so easy, How come no one else thought of that?"

"In fact, even in the case of Mozart, his music is not exceptionally complex.  What Mozart had was an impeccable melodic sense and a strong hold over the masterful use of dissonance."

~ To me, you are equating Mozart to pop music stars of our time. There is no comparison. Mozart is calculus compared to our today's pop star's addition & subtraction.

"So, I think there is some truth to the argument that when the masses make something popular, it's for a reason."

~ Yes. Mostly, dumb-downed simple dance or toe-tapping music created by the media and record company execs to make heaps of money.

[This message has been edited by Opeth (05-21-2003 07:58 AM).]

Ron
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46 posted 05-21-2003 09:54 AM       View Profile for Ron   Email Ron   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Ron's Home Page   View IP for Ron

Art, of any kind, is communication. As such, there are always two sides to be considered.

When I find myself tempted to represent an artist as merely simple or unimportant, the image of a soup can always springs to mind and helps me suppress the urge. Maybe the art really is simple and unimportant. Or maybe, just maybe, the deeper message is so far over my head all I can see is the simplicity in which it was wrapped?

Two sides to consider. And it's not always easy to know which is guilty of being simple.
Opeth
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47 posted 05-21-2003 10:11 AM       View Profile for Opeth   Email Opeth   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Opeth

I see your point, but...

3 to 4 minute song consisting of a simple repetitive beat and melody certainly is not over my head.  Again, that is why those types of songs are popular - they are easy to "get" right away.

Those on the receiving end must have the ability to understand what the messenger is sending, if they don't, they don't "get" it....and call it something like, "Noise."

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48 posted 05-21-2003 12:29 PM       View Profile for Mistletoe Angel   Email Mistletoe Angel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Mistletoe Angel's Home Page   View IP for Mistletoe Angel

I do think art can be taken two ways also. For instance, it depends on how you choose to define art, for there are multiple definitions of art, three of which deeply stand out:

1: "Human effort to imitate, supplement, alter, or counteract the work of nature."

2: "The conscious production or arrangement of sounds, colors, forms, movements, or other elements in a manner that affects the sense of beauty."

3: "High quality of conception or execution, as found in works of beauty; aesthetic value."


Yes, there truly is a lot of music out there that lazily and effortlessly fails to "imitate or alter the work of nature." But I do believe there exists such a thing as "good pop music", for to many there is that sense of beauty in what we listen that happens to make it hugely in the media and even when many don't even think in a philosophical sense why they love that music, there is that inexplicable satisfaction found deep within it all.

I do listen to some popular music indeed, and I am not ashamed. By reading my signature, you can tell I am a huge Shakira fan, and she has a pop platform, but she has a very poetic soul that many American and European audiences have failed to recognize that is especially present in her Spanish songs. You would truly be impressed if you saw her Spanish lyrics! I also love to listen to college stations and try to listen to many local acts that don't make it mainstream to discover obscure artists!

And I listen to Top 40 every now and then, and we get many occasional bland hits, but the beauty still makes a visit every now and then, and what may seem ugly to one is beauty to another!

I am not big on rap at all, but I do admire how they speak freely and love them or hate them, as lazy as their rhyming may sound at times, there is that occasional masterpiece. I really don't care for Eminem personally, but he truly is a lyrical prodigy, and sadly I think many rather look on Eminem's demeanor rather than his songwriting talent in the most part.

By the way, I love Delirium, their music always has me daydreaming!

Sincerely,
Noah Eaton

Underneath your clothes, there's an endless story

***Shakira***

Opeth
Member Elite
since 12-13-2001
Posts 2224
The Ravines


49 posted 05-21-2003 12:40 PM       View Profile for Opeth   Email Opeth   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Opeth

In the days of instant gratification: Fast food restaraunts, drive-thru every-businesses, Luncheables (sp?) brand lunches for our children (show how much you love your child by giving them junk food like that), instant every-food, ATMs, etc, etc, etc....

The same with music for the masses, something simple to grasp and understand, makes for much money in the so-called "artist's" pocket.

How many people actually take the time to listen to a complete symphony, to learn it, to understand how each movement is connected?

Answer...

Definitely not the masses.

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