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Passions in Poetry

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Poet deVine
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0 posted 04-15-2002 05:29 PM       View Profile for Poet deVine   Email Poet deVine   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Poet deVine

I'd be interested to know what you think of this article..if you can't see it, let me know and I'll email a copy to you.

http://www.cnn.com/2002/TECH/internet/04/15/internet.breakup/index.html
skyshine
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1 posted 04-15-2002 05:48 PM       View Profile for skyshine   Email skyshine   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit skyshine's Home Page   View IP for skyshine

I think it's kind of sad, and disappointing that people don't want to work at their marriage. I'm currently not in a relationship but from my former one I know that it takes a lot of communication and commitment to make it work out! And if someone doesn't want to do that, well they're not ready to get married then. I wasn't too happy to read that porn sites and "rekindle your friendship" sites are causing the breakup of marriage. I guess I can understand porn (I wouldn't want to be married to someone who was into it), but the past should be left in the past. Marriage is very serious and if there are any problems they need to be solved by the couple, not by one burying themselves in front of the computer to avoid them.

Did I make any sense? I'll clarify if I didn't.

sky

I'm in charge, and I say question authority!

Christopher
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2 posted 04-15-2002 05:53 PM       View Profile for Christopher   Email Christopher   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Christopher

The Internet doesn't cause failed relationships... peoplecause failed relationships.

Someone with fidelity or "staying power" issues has them whether they use the Internet or not. The difference is (and probably the reason the Internet is blamed) is in accessibility. Being such a great communication tool, it's "easier" to find someone of similar interests online.

It is the person wandering who's at fault, not the tool they're using.
skyshine
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3 posted 04-15-2002 07:58 PM       View Profile for skyshine   Email skyshine   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit skyshine's Home Page   View IP for skyshine

Should have clarified.....I guess I'm disappointed that people are using the Internet to let their marriage fall apart.

~sky

I'm in charge, and I say question authority!

Temptress
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4 posted 04-15-2002 09:30 PM       View Profile for Temptress   Email Temptress   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Temptress

funny you should use "staying power" Christopher. Are you reading my mind? LOL! I just used that in a poem I keep in my journal and poetry notebook.

How grave is my condition, for I cannot find the words to say, I need you so.
~Sarah MacLachlan~

Sunshine
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5 posted 04-15-2002 09:34 PM       View Profile for Sunshine   Email Sunshine   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Sunshine's Home Page   View IP for Sunshine


The Internet can become the immediate mailbox for love-letters that use to take a stamp, real handwriting, and a secret box in which to keep them.  

Nothing has changed in people - just the medium used.

And the sorriest thing about this is, no one takes responsibility in a failed marriage anyway, and always looks for something to blame.

Other than themselves.
Christopher
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6 posted 04-15-2002 09:47 PM       View Profile for Christopher   Email Christopher   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Christopher

Oh no, i disagree completely Kari - my ex-wife admits it's her fault.

Some people are born smart.
I don't know what happened to the rest of you.

Tracey
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since 08-29-2001
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where insanity meets breeding


7 posted 04-15-2002 09:57 PM       View Profile for Tracey   Email Tracey   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Tracey

Kind of a case of which came first...the chicken or the egg? The unhappiness in an already bad marriage, or the time on the internet spent getting away from the unhappy marriage? I too think the internet has just made it easier for people who would have cheated, or been distant in their marriages anyway. It's just become a scapegoat for people who are unhappy with their homelife anyway.
And lucky you Christopher...my ex-husband agrees with himself that the breakup was my fault!! Lol.

If she who dies with the most toys wins, then can I have some toy boys please?

Jeffrey E. Osborne
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out there


8 posted 04-16-2002 12:14 AM       View Profile for Jeffrey E. Osborne   Email Jeffrey E. Osborne   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Jeffrey E. Osborne

     Internet porn? What's wrong with that? Where else can you see images of girl on girl on girl on girl on girl on man on sheep? (sorry... I couldn't resist adding a little levity to this otherwise somber discussion lol)
     But seriously folks...   I can see both good and bad sides to the internet/marriage discussion and I can also say that I have both benefited from and suffered because of the internet's affect on my own marital situation.
     First off, I have to agree with Chris - it is the person, not the medium. A cheater is a cheater irregardless of how he goes about it.
     Now before someone starts pointing the finger at me and reminding me not to throw rocks in glass houses (lol), I will admit that I have found myself involved in situations that I shouldn't have entered into and they were due to my involvement with others on the internet. It is all too easy to look elsewhere for attention, friendship, and support when you feel (rightly or wrongly) that you are not getting those needs met by your spouse. The problems arise when you forget that your relationship with your spouse is REAL and fooling around with it can have all too real consequences (ie.. divorce) and that internet relationships are mostly FANTASY.
     Before I go any further, I have to point out that good things can (and have) come out of the friendships/relationships I've made via the internet. I have met and befriended some of the most wonderful people (many of them in this forum!   ) and I was fortunate enough to share a year long relationship with a young woman I met on the internet who proved to be everything I could possibly want and need in a loving relationship. While I shouldn't have allowed myself to get involved with her while I was still married and I also shouldn't have allowed her and I's relationship to be reduced to a tawdry affair, I don't regret the moments we shared for a moment.
     The mistake people commonly make is they allow the internet relationships to get out of hand. It's OK to chat occasionally, write emails, (post poems   ) but when it starts to consume the time you would otherwise spend with your spouse and your kids, you need to be strong enough to step back from it. I wasn't that strong and I've suffered for it.
     On a more positive note, my internet meanderings have made me reconsider my position regarding my failed marriage. They've given me the strength to realize that the person my wife fell in love with so many years ago is "still out there" and that if I started applying the time, the words, and the actions that I've applied here (the internet) to her and I's relationship than maybe all is not lost.
     Now back to that porn issue... the missus and I have watched some great porn together and while we both have giggled like idiots at their extreme silliness, there have been those occasional moments where we've said to each other - "Hey, that looks like fun!" and then snuck off to the bedroom   .....
                        - Jeff

"this could get messy... but you don't seem to mind..."

[This message has been edited by Jeffrey E. Osborne (04-16-2002 12:16 AM).]

Poet deVine
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9 posted 04-16-2002 01:06 AM       View Profile for Poet deVine   Email Poet deVine   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Poet deVine

Great discussion guys!

and Jeff, I applaud your honesty and common sense.

When I first read this article I thought YES! the internet is the bad guy. Then realized that there is no bad guy - only confused people searching for love. I think the internet has brought people into my life that I would never have had the chance to meet otherwise. My son met his wife on this little 'box' so it has it good points too.

I think if there is a 'need' to seek a relationship outside the one you're committed to - there will be a way. The internet is just easier - you don't have to buy someone a drink to talk to them. But ultimately it's up to us to set our standards, live by our principles. We're only human after all.
catalinamoon
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10 posted 04-16-2002 08:51 AM       View Profile for catalinamoon   Email catalinamoon   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit catalinamoon's Home Page   View IP for catalinamoon

Well, I agree with those who say that someone who is lonely at home, or has a problem with intimacy, or what EVER,the internet just makes it slightly easier.
I have never (gasp) been in a chat room, the only people I know online are you all here, and people that I used to know before the internet was around, and now we do occasionaly stay in touch through it.
I also think that the first year or so of internet accesability appears to be  window of obsession,( a least everyone I have known went through that period,) then it becomes more moderated.
With me, it just takes the place of TV or reading, not time spent with someone who is ignoring me regardless. LOL
S
Dee
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11 posted 04-16-2002 08:11 PM       View Profile for Dee   Email Dee   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Dee

Ok so maybe its not the internet's fault but the usage of same.

My marriage problems can be partially linked to the net. Things like time spent with other woman in chat programs and the comments he makes to them that hurt or offend me.  Secret email address that they can send each other mail that I don't know about and can't find even if I did know. Looking at porn sites that make me feel inadequate. He doesn't see why I should be so upset by it all, but I am.

I used to spend too much time on here too but I have been taught that the net is no substitute for reality. (Sometimes I wish it was )

Just my opinion but I do think that the net is partially to blame for marriage problems.

Dee

Stand straight and tall, not the reflection as others see you, but as you truely are.        Clearwater

Janet Marie
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since 01-22-2000
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12 posted 04-17-2002 09:50 AM       View Profile for Janet Marie   Email Janet Marie   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Janet Marie

Tracy is right...it is often a matter of "which came first," ... and like Chris said...its about easy access to the tool ...I have said all along the Internet makes it way too easy to be "bad" or do things that we end up hurting ourselves and others on, IF temptation and or moderation is a problem.
And Internet Addiction is a huge problem... I have a business acquaintance who is a Psychologist and Marriage Counselor and he says in the past 5 years his cliental has become 99% Internet related or effected. He says he could literally make his practice treating Internet Addiction and related problems. And there are other sides to this coin...Companies and Businesses report huge losses of hours and productive manpower to employees on the Net on company time.

But back to the topic of marriage and the Net...it does in the end come back to if a person is going to cheat...if they are seeking for something more, for whatever the reason....they will find a way to do it...Net or not. The Internet has become the singles bars of the new millennium. And some people are of the thought that since its "cyber" and not something they touch in reality...that its not really cheating...I have had people tell me they have "cyber affairs" to keep from going out and "really cheating." Each has to draw their own lines of reality ... but we all know its all relative to the person who is being "cheated on." They wont feel any less hurt, once they find out.
And Internet addiction is no different from any other compulsion or obsession...like drugs, alcohol, over eating...any time moderation is out of control, there will be fall out.
Not all Internet addiction is about cheating, cybering and porn sites either....sometimes its a matter of too much time spent chatting on messengers and writing emails...(reading and replying to poetry)  
people just making contact with others that common bonds have been forged with thru efforts to fill a loneliness that too many carry inside. A very wise person recently said to me..." I realized I am not addicted the Internet...I am addicted to the unconditional love I find from people here."Something we all will relate to. My Psychologist friend says that many of his patients come to him because they cant sleep or leave the house due to wanting to be on-line 24-7. He also says its very difficult to get under control because so many work on computers or have several in the house for kids in school and home businesses...so how do you totally take away the access and temptation...and he says like any other addiction...to effectively treat there must be a period of no access to teach moderation.  He has clients who were going to electronic stores, malls that have terminals, places like Kinkos that rent comp time, and libraries to sneak on-line when their families had taken the comps away at home.
No easy answers....big problem for many...my self included, I should be doing my taxes...but here I am...*sigh*  "'tis not easy being a moth"  
And Dee you are so right girlie......" the net is no substitute for reality" ... "getting a life" will make us much happier in the end...taking the first step is scary and hard.  But so is most anything worth having.
my love to poetry land, thanks for listening.
jm

[This message has been edited by Janet Marie (04-17-2002 09:51 AM).]

Christopher
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13 posted 04-17-2002 01:32 PM       View Profile for Christopher   Email Christopher   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Christopher

i think one of the most important things with an addiction like this is to not try to eliminate it from your life, but rather integrate it in a healthy manner. i'm sure that many/most people have a comfortable, healthy place in their lives for this medium... it's finding that plateau between addiction and abstinence that can sometimes be difficult... especially if you're unhappy with your life or yourself ("...addicted to the unconditional love...").

a glass of wine every once in a while is good for digestion... a bottle a day probably isn't good for you. *hic*

excellent comments in this thread!

C

Some people are born smart.
I don't know what happened to the rest of you.

Janet Marie
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since 01-22-2000
Posts 18986


14 posted 04-17-2002 04:12 PM       View Profile for Janet Marie   Email Janet Marie   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Janet Marie

quote:
i think one of the most important things with an addiction like this is to not try to eliminate it from your life, but rather integrate it in a healthy manner.


I understand what you are saying here Chris...but for me...using the word addiction and healthy in the same sentence is kind of an oxymoron. One cancels the other out. Your advice is very good, but can someone who is addicted to anything, follow thru without help? I mean isn't the very nature of addiction, about the person lacking the self control needed to resist what ever the vice they are leaning on? If it were so simple as being able to walk away and chose the healthier option...then there wouldn't really be an addiction problem. Someone truly addicted to anything wont be able to self moderate. I can only speak for me...( and I know some who have been able to self moderate and curb this on their own) but there are days when I am depressed and lonely..that short of someone cutting the cord off this thing...or my hands so I cant type....then I am going to be on here way more than I should be...
regardless of what I KNOW I am supposed to be doing. One hour turns into 3 and unless I am distracted by something or someone or forced off because I have to leave, then I sit here and lose track of time.  Comp addiction is no different from any other vice, it's a need that becomes bigger than most can handle on their own.  And most times its a symptom of other problems that takes on a life of its own.
And yes...I understand it comes down to finding something in "real time" that makes me feel "as good" as I do when on here...like I said above..."getting a life" that fills the lonely or heals the depression and then it wont matter to be on here. That's the hard part and the scary part. I'm not trying to make excuses....just trying to be honest...I know there are so many others struggling with this, in different degrees, for different reasons....but many have shared with me that they feel as lost as I do ... maybe if we can talk about it honestly, we can help one another find our way back. The first step is being able to admit there is a problem, I've always been honest about my "mothyness." But honesty only goes so far....somewhere a long the way, self moderation and intervention if that wont work must come in to play. Sooner or later...any addiction will catch up with us and cost us.
thanks again for listening.  

 
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