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Passions in Poetry

Sensitivity or lack of....

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RainbowGirl
Member Elite
since 07-31-99
Posts 3167
United Kingdom


0 posted 09-17-2000 07:33 PM       View Profile for RainbowGirl   Email RainbowGirl   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit RainbowGirl's Home Page   View IP for RainbowGirl

An email tonight brought something to my attention and oh boy, I hated reading it, knowing the hurt it caused, albeit inadvertently....

When we post our comments, please, please, be aware of sensitive hearts, caring hearts that read and if you are not specific, the damage you can do can be untold...

No, I am not prepared to disclose the contents of the email...but I will say this and I did in reply to this mail...listen to the words, open your heart, see what I am saying...please...

My reply:

it doesn't matter what words people use, caring is a feeling, a vibration for me that transmits through words because I pick up on the feeling...I don't know how to explain it really....the point is, it's not how you word what you're trying to express but the life you give to the words you use.......I don't lie XXXXXXXX  I never see the point in it myself, neither do I say words for the sake of it....please trust me on this but then again, I think you feel that same vibration yourself, so don't need to trust me, only yourself..   "

Please be careful with your words, you can hurt someone, even if you think you're not!




"If you always do what you've always done
You'll always be where you are right now."

Author Unknown




[This message has been edited by RainbowGirl (edited 09-17-2000).]
Erin
Member Elite
since 06-15-2000
Posts 2681
~Chicago~


1 posted 09-17-2000 07:39 PM       View Profile for Erin   Email Erin   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Erin

You know what Rainbow???I agree with you so much on this. I am somewhat sensitive to a point. And someone had the nerve to say something bad about me to a point where I just wanted to be so rude in a reply to their poem. Instead I decided to be nice. I think that this was a good subject to bring up too with some of the replies that are being left on poems.
Denise
Moderator
Member Seraphic
since 08-22-99
Posts 23002


2 posted 09-17-2000 07:45 PM       View Profile for Denise   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Denise

I agree, Cindy. It only takes a moment to think about what we are saying. And I couldn't have said this better myself!  

Denise
RainbowGirl
Member Elite
since 07-31-99
Posts 3167
United Kingdom


3 posted 09-17-2000 07:48 PM       View Profile for RainbowGirl   Email RainbowGirl   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit RainbowGirl's Home Page   View IP for RainbowGirl

Erin: Thank you for your reply, I have a special friend that is hurting and badly so, enough to stop the replies, to feel insignificant and all because some smart arse replied without thinking of those that truly care, we don't need dictionaries to show we care, just an honest heart...

I'm angry, and heaven help the recipient of that post...*he* should have known better....we people, that speak our hearts, do so with imagination, we view that person we reply to, we know the power of words, after all that is *our* language, to use it against a caring individual, is, in my words, ....I'm actually lost for words

...to hurt another is to hurt yourself!

"If you always do what you've always done
You'll always be where you are right now."

Author Unknown




[This message has been edited by RainbowGirl (edited 09-17-2000).]
Brad
Member Ascendant
since 08-20-99
Posts 5896
Jejudo, South Korea


4 posted 09-17-2000 07:55 PM       View Profile for Brad   Email Brad   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Brad

I'm terribly confused here.

You say:

"it doesn't matter what words people use"

and then you say:

"Please be careful with your words, you can hurt someone, even if you think you're not!"

How can it be both?

Without further information, it seems difficult to respond to this.

Brad

RainbowGirl
Member Elite
since 07-31-99
Posts 3167
United Kingdom


5 posted 09-17-2000 08:19 PM       View Profile for RainbowGirl   Email RainbowGirl   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit RainbowGirl's Home Page   View IP for RainbowGirl

Denise: Thank you sweetheart, your posts are always positive, encouraging and full of empathy...  

HUSG

Brad: Wake up please sweetheart, read with your heart not with your mind.....I'm talking here about how you place your words, the tone you use, caring is felt, regardless of words...go tell your wife  you love her, then tell someone else you love what they write, how you feel it, how it inspires you...then look at what happens....



"If you always do what you've always done
You'll always be where you are right now."

Author Unknown


[This message has been edited by RainbowGirl (edited 09-17-2000).]
Brad
Member Ascendant
since 08-20-99
Posts 5896
Jejudo, South Korea


6 posted 09-17-2000 09:46 PM       View Profile for Brad   Email Brad   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Brad

My only concern here is whether this is in reference to a post at CA or not (or even a post I made). I gave up trying to understand the assumptions guiding Open when people started being offended by those who point out typos.

Brad
serenity blaze
Member Empyrean
since 02-02-2000
Posts 28839


7 posted 09-17-2000 10:20 PM       View Profile for serenity blaze   Email serenity blaze   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for serenity blaze

I'm with Brad---as I do try to reply frequently and yes, I am playful and off-the-cuff sometimes...but generally only with the people who know me...and certainly, if it were me that was the insensitive culprit, I would want to know...

And there have been times, when I did not understand a reply to one of my poems, and also times that I misconstrued the intent of that reply...but me, being me, e mailed that person with a "huh?"---and have actually started many nice friendships in that manner.

So, I'm not sure how to reply to this either.
Unless it is particularly nasty---I would hope that all take the replies with a medicinal grain of salt.  Personally, I would feel awful even inadvertantly hurting anyone's feelings, and would like to know.  
and hey...HUGS to everyone!   PEACE.
Irie
Senior Member
since 12-01-1999
Posts 1526
Washington State


8 posted 09-18-2000 01:35 AM       View Profile for Irie   Email Irie   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Irie

This is why I've always felt that if someone had something negitive to say, to do so by e-mail. (and I'm not saying what you had to say was negitive Rainbowgirl, just making a point)
You never know how they will take it.
Not everyone interprets things the same way..
it is a fine line.
I hope everyone fares well from what ever it is that happened.
Cheers and Hugs to you all!  


~Sheri

[This message has been edited by Irie (edited 09-18-2000).]
RainbowGirl
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since 07-31-99
Posts 3167
United Kingdom


9 posted 09-18-2000 07:55 AM       View Profile for RainbowGirl   Email RainbowGirl   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit RainbowGirl's Home Page   View IP for RainbowGirl

Brad: No, I'm not talking about you nor does my comment refer in any way to the CA forum, I would expect that anyone that posts in there is asking for constructive feedback..  

serenity: I'm not talking about playful comments to someone you know or for that matter, someone you don't...LOL..

Irie: Yes, I agree with you..  

All:  This post was not meant to refer to anybody directly and I will not break confidentiality either....   and besides, if everyone says "was it me?" eventually the person concerned may well ask the question and then I would be in the position of breaking confidentiality or lying, I'm not going to put myself in that position..  

The post was simply to ask that people be more aware of how their comments may be received by others...that was all..  

I hope that elleviates any confusion, but I admit, I do like to confuse people and I can even do it without even knowing it..  

Take care all

HUGS

[This message has been edited by RainbowGirl (edited 09-18-2000).]
Local Rebel
Member Ascendant
since 12-21-1999
Posts 5742
Southern Abstentia


10 posted 09-18-2000 11:21 AM       View Profile for Local Rebel   Email Local Rebel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Local Rebel

Well it seems to me, whether in person or on the internet -- we always have to keep in mind the personality of the person being adressed and the perspective from which they will interpret our words.

We always run the risk of offending someone but if we simply mind the manners we learned in kindergarten we'll be eating our feet with far less frequency.

It's a pretty miserable existence to always be second guessing what people mean and wonder if there was some kind of slight in things people say -- so, me personally, unless somone slaps me in the skull with a brick bat -- I assume people always a: like me, and b: actually mean it when they compliment me, and c: if they tell me my flye is open its because they're afraid I'll be embarrassed not because they don't want to see the contents.. LOL..

so -- in the words of Rodney King... why can't we all just get along...

Thanks Cindy..!!!

HuggsZzzzzzz
RainbowGirl
Member Elite
since 07-31-99
Posts 3167
United Kingdom


11 posted 09-18-2000 11:38 AM       View Profile for RainbowGirl   Email RainbowGirl   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit RainbowGirl's Home Page   View IP for RainbowGirl

LR: Slapping you in the head with a brick bat - gently though..*g*

But only to say: I love ya pal..

Thanks, you got it spot on and said it so much better cause I only caused total confusion with this one...oh well, words were never my strong point..*g*

HUSG
JP
Senior Member
since 05-25-99
Posts 1391
Loomis, CA


12 posted 09-18-2000 12:07 PM       View Profile for JP   Email JP   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit JP's Home Page   View IP for JP

I've wrestled with how to reply to this, thought against replying, and decided it would eat me up if I didn't.

I agree with your philosophy RainbowGirl, awareness of what we say and how we say it is of paramount importance.  The difficulty we have here, is that we do not know each other as well as we would like to think we do.  No matter how much we try, it is nearly impossible to truly know someone whom you only 'see' by what they write on the internet.  One cannot look into the eyes of their companion to see the reaction to one's words; nor can one judge another's reading ability to govern how s/he will read comments written.

I know I have offended people in here, I know others have offended me, but that is the way of life is it not?  Are we talking about intentional rudeness? I think not.  I think we are talking mostly about unintential comments or phrasings which may have the power to inadvertantly hurt someone else's feelings.  Plus (Brad made a good point about this...) add to that the very real idea that we are also speaking of some overly sensitive people, who do indeed seem to get offended at the slightest remark that isn't flattering (is that not to be expected on a site dedicated to, and comprised of, artists?)

Am I to spend extra hours deciding whether or not to enter into a discussion on the forums for fear that what I have to say may offend someone?  Am I to just quit responding completely? am I supposed to water down my responses so much that all I ever say is "nice job"?  

If so, what then is the purpose of Passions?  If I cannot feel at home here, say what is on my mind and in my heart, using the same social courtesies I would use in the real world, then what is the purpose?

Do I promote or condone rudeness?  Certainly not.

Can I excuse unintential harshness?  Absolutely.  That is afterall a human frailty, and we are still human.  In fact, I could accept and forgive unintentional rudeness much easier than I can forgive oversensitivity.  Being oversensitive seems just a tad more arrogant to me...

Okay, that said, let me say this.  Some folks just may not understand that what they are saying, or how they are saying it, may come across as rude.  Not everyone was raised in an environment that placed emphasis on politeness.  In life we work and interact with these people and have a few, but not too many, difficulties.  If it is someone we care about, we guide them in efforts to have them recognize and alter their socially abrasive behavior (perhaps a little more guidance and a little less complaining would go a ways in relieving the tensions).

Okay, anything else?  Well, since we are on the subject... Does anyone know what empathy as opposed to sympathy is?

Often times we try to make another feel better by telling them "I know just how you feel"  "Oh, I've been there" or "I've been through the same thing and I feel for you" or something of the sort.

Take a moment to think about what you are saying, think of yourself, your life, and your circumstances, then think of the person you are speaking to and what they are saying.  Then tell me if such comments, although well-intentioned, are not rude, or demeaning.  Does it not trivialize a person's pain or depth of feeling to so casually jump in and assume you've 'been there, done that'?  Is it not even slightly selfish to jump in to try and share someone's pain (ie; spotlight - for lack of a better description)

I wonder if, a teenage boy, who's girlfriend of 6 months has just dumped him can truly say "I know just how you feel" to a lady of 40 something, who's husband of 20 years just left her...   perhaps the better thing to do would be to just lend your support, rather than try to become a partner in their pain.

I'm done for the moment.  I'm sure I've offended someone, so let me hear it.
  


Yesterday is ash, tomorrow is smoke; only today does the fire burn.
JP

"Everything is your own damn fault, if you are any good."  E. Hemmingway


[This message has been edited by JP (edited 09-18-2000).]
PhaerieChild
Senior Member
since 08-30-99
Posts 1829
Aloha, Oregon


13 posted 09-18-2000 06:06 PM       View Profile for PhaerieChild   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for PhaerieChild

Well JP, you didn't offend me and that said, I also want it on record that I agree with you. Sensitivity is such a hard thing to gauge when dealing with people that we don't really know except through the web. Sometimes it is hard to know what word or phrase will hurt someone inadvertantly and all we can hope for is forgiveness when a mistake is made or an emotion is painfully touched.
Cindy, I do hope that I am not the cause of anyone's pain, but if I am, please tell them I am truly sorry and will try to do better next time. Hugs to all....Shawna

Poetry~ Words falling on paper, painting a dream.

Shawna R. Holder
Boise, Idaho

WhtDove
Member Rara Avis
since 07-22-99
Posts 9561
Illinois


14 posted 09-18-2000 08:43 PM       View Profile for WhtDove   Email WhtDove   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit WhtDove's Home Page   View IP for WhtDove

I'm finding myself not knowing quite what to say either.

Some people can be easily offended by words that weren't meant to be that way.

We do have to be careful.

I have no idea if it was something I said, but I can assure you that if it was, it was only done in a kindness or humorous way.
I would never intentionally say something to harm someone or hurt their feelings  

Hugs!
Poet deVine
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 05-26-99
Posts 25869
Hurricane Alley


15 posted 09-18-2000 11:48 PM       View Profile for Poet deVine   Email Poet deVine   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Poet deVine

Sometimes words can hurt more than a physical blow because it hits us in our heart - and if that heart is open and unprotected, the pain can be a terrible thing.

All we have to judge each other on here is our words..and a few smilies. Not knowing what was said, all I can say is that either the offender didn't know his/her words would cause someone pain, or they knew it and didn't care - in that case 'shame on them!' We have no room for meanness here.

Passions is based on the basic human right to say what you want - but not at the expense of someone's feelings. I sincerely hope the offender sees this and contacts your friend to apologize and make it right.
Corazon
Senior Member
since 02-02-2000
Posts 1301


16 posted 09-19-2000 05:53 PM       View Profile for Corazon   Email Corazon   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Corazon

I respond with my heart, I read with my heart and I write from my heart....I hope I am always taken that way, I never like to hurt another  
hugs rg...long time no see  
brian madden
Member Elite
since 05-06-2000
Posts 4532
ireland


17 posted 09-19-2000 06:47 PM       View Profile for brian madden   Email brian madden   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for brian madden

How may times have a slip of tongue on my part hurt someone I love, too often for my taste. I have put my foot it in a few times, hopefully not at the site and to avoid doing that I try to stay clear of religious debates because I can rant a bit and thread on toes. I know that there been and I am sure will be times when people will not agree with everything that I write, I can a bit preachy about certain subjects and I am sure that they just don't reply to my poems which is fine by me. I don't like everything I read either and concentrate on what I do like.

I think it is excessive e-mailing someone with personal comments about their poem if they are a very critical nature, we have a forum for that. Was that person too afraid to share their comments in the forum where the poem was posted? Poetry is all about communicating emotions, feelings, connecting with people. It does not matter what way it is done, whether the poem is technically brilliant or just a simple flow of thoughts. A well-written poem will make people feel something. Personally I think people who make such a gesture are lacking in something, and should get a more productive hobby.


My view stretches out from the fence to the wall No words could explain, no actions determine Just watching the trees and the leaves as they fall:Joy division

[This message has been edited by brian madden (edited 09-19-2000).]
RainbowGirl
Member Elite
since 07-31-99
Posts 3167
United Kingdom


18 posted 09-19-2000 07:41 PM       View Profile for RainbowGirl   Email RainbowGirl   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit RainbowGirl's Home Page   View IP for RainbowGirl

My Apologies for the delay in replying, some kind and considerate soul had nothing better to do and decided to make the most of a vulnerable port, leaving me and my beloved friend (pc) in a bit of a mess..     Spent all last evening and the whole of the night rectifying the damage and ensuring it doesn't happen again..

So if this doesn't make much sense, I've had no sleep, on the other hand if it drops off in mid-sentence, I am sleeping..  

*****

JP:  Now we can't have you eaten, unless of course it is alive..*g*..ooops

Of course I am aware of the difference between empathy and sympathy, that's why I chose empathy, you know..   and I take it you're refering to my remark to Denise, well I happen to think in this case, it is true, but as you say, it's not in every case, so I concur a little (is that allowed?..*g* )

I don't expect *anyone* to do anything which would be outside of their normal behavioural pattern, but surely it isn't too much to ask that one take another's feelings into consideration, after all, if you don't like something, does someone force you to say so?..I don't think so, I find it quite easy to say something kind rather than something that will offend...   ..

I think the difference lies between a debate where all parties expect a little parry and thrust than when someone posts a poem or replies to one, don't you?

ps: You didn't offend me, I found you to be frank and to the point, that I can deal with..*g*

******

WildChild: Sweetheart, you !!!  Offend someone....oh my, now you have me smiling, no sweetheart, I don't think so..  

******

Dovey: People can only be offended sweetheart when they're unsure of the reception to that which they have written...I don't think I have ever known you say anthing to the contrary..  

******

Sharon: Bless you!!  You got it in one as well..   There is simply no need to say soemthing if it can't be encouraging ...alsas, I don't think there will be an outcome, but that isn't for me to say...sometimes you know, we can't actually tell soemone that they have hurt us, it's just too hard..  

Thanks sweetheart..  

******

Corazon: I know you do, me as well...*g*

******

Brian: Well they do say that one should steer clear of Politics; Finance, and Religion, but I do admit I love a good debate..*g* So feel free..  

Could you clarify your final paragraph for me though, I'm not sure if you're saying it's ok to offend so long as the author made you feel it whether you're saying the opposite?

******

HUGS all, time for sleep here, hope I made sense..  

Take care



"If you always do what you've always done
You'll always be where you are right now."

Author Unknown




[This message has been edited by RainbowGirl (edited 09-19-2000).]
JP
Senior Member
since 05-25-99
Posts 1391
Loomis, CA


19 posted 09-20-2000 09:38 AM       View Profile for JP   Email JP   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit JP's Home Page   View IP for JP

RainbowGirl - Honestly I was not referring to you when I wrote of empathy.  In fact I cannot think of a thing you've ever written that has offended me - disagreed with, certainly, but offend?  No.

I was actually referring to more than a few posts that I have seen (yes, and written) where someone has happily jumped in and said basically "been there, done that!"  This has been a long-standing gripe of mine... Pet peeves afterall, are our pets...

Religion, Politics and Finances eh?  Taboo subjects?  What if we talk about how religion has bought the politicians?  Would that cover it all?



Yesterday is ash, tomorrow is smoke; only today does the fire burn.
JP

"Everything is your own damn fault, if you are any good." E. Hemmingway
RainbowGirl
Member Elite
since 07-31-99
Posts 3167
United Kingdom


20 posted 09-20-2000 11:35 AM       View Profile for RainbowGirl   Email RainbowGirl   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit RainbowGirl's Home Page   View IP for RainbowGirl

JP:  You mean you *just* read my opening comments and then waded straight in?...Shame on you...ROFL..but thank you for saying I have never offended you..

Hmmm...re: the "been there, done that"...soem people have been there and done that, myself included and I would hate to lay claim to the number of disasters as well, so I'm sure that many of us here have also been through a fair bit in their lifetime...Myself personally I always seem to know if someone is saying it genuinely, I don't know why, something in their comment perhaps that only they could feel if they *had* been there...but mostly I think people want to offer support and encouragement and sometimes I will just give "HUGS" because I don't really know what else to say other than I feel for them..

LOL@ "religion has bought the politicians"...In my experience politicians will use anything including religion if they can get away with it...*g*

Thanks for the reply and I hope you don't object to my humour, I'm feeling a little bit mischevious...

JP
Senior Member
since 05-25-99
Posts 1391
Loomis, CA


21 posted 09-21-2000 11:14 AM       View Profile for JP   Email JP   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit JP's Home Page   View IP for JP

I think the *HUGS* are probably the best response to a sad situation.  Often, when blue, hurt, mad, or sad, I don't care if someone has been there, or experienced it, or "knows just how I feel", I would rather have a hug, or a gentle pat on the hand.  Sympathy is sometimes better medicine than empathy...  But then again, I just left the pity party in FEELINGS...


Yesterday is ash, tomorrow is smoke; only today does the fire burn.
JP

"Everything is your own damn fault, if you are any good." E. Hemmingway
White Wolf
Member
since 09-18-99
Posts 384
Somewhere in the vast wastelan


22 posted 09-21-2000 02:38 PM       View Profile for White Wolf   Email White Wolf   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for White Wolf

I just thought that I would put in my two cents worth.  First off I have a personal stake in this matter.  No, not here, not yet but seeing as to the fact that I have yet to post some poetry has something to do with it.  I have been sensitive all my life.  Maybe too sensitive, who knows?  While growing up, I was called stupid, a nothing, that I would be nothing, and many other things that are not appropiate to repeat here.  Back then I just took it.  I just couldn't fight back and when I did, it just wasn't worth it.  But now I am older and realize that everyone deserves respect, and I do mean everyone.  But when I feel that someone is being hurtful to hurt someone, like myself, I no longer stand by and watch.  Depending on my mood and how I feel about what was said I will usually give one of two responses.  One is I just explode and just trust me when I say nobody wants see that.  The other way is I come up with something witty to say that gets my point accross rather effectively.  But this has nothing to do with the subject at hand.

This is my take on the subject is simply this, "If you can't say anything nice(or comforting like a hug) don't say anything at all".  I like to see people smiling.  Another thing I think is important is the fact that people complain so much about spelling.  So much so that someone once suggested a forum so people could learn to spell better.  While the idea is great the way it came about was totally offensive.  Some people may not have had the education that others have had and some people, like me, just have never been able to spell things right.  I know most of my words are cause I use a spellcheck on the words I think are spelled wrong.  If you are one of those people that misspelled words just bug you to no end then don't read the poem or find someway to bring it to the person's attention in a nonhurtful manner, in private and don't bring it up to everyone whether you use their names or not.  They will know who they are and be hurt by it.  Misspellings are like my fly being down, I don't want it announced to the whole world even if they already know.  Leave me some dignity.  If the person who suggested the spelling think, please take no offense.  I honestly don't remember who you are.  And I would ask the the poeple that do know who it is, don't hold this against him or throw it in his face.  When I say "him" I simply mean either male or female.  I know I don't.  Anyway I have put in my two cents worth and two on credit.  Please don't be offended by this post.  I was only trying to point out that nitpicking has never done any good.


The White Wolf


Would the bunny like this nice carrot? I don't bite. Much. :)
Trevor
Senior Member
since 08-12-99
Posts 744
Canada


23 posted 09-22-2000 12:55 PM       View Profile for Trevor   Email Trevor   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Trevor

How do you know what words will hurt until you say them? Isn't it a suppression of feelings and expression to tip-toe around the things that cause feelings and expression? Why should one only be allowed to express opinions of a pleasing nature? If someone shows a poem or any other communicative words, shouldn't they expect you to perhaps correct something simple like a spelling mistake or grammatical error.... a lot of you good folks seem to think that being wrong is something bad and should be all secretive like about it. Being wrong is not bad...well not always, at least not for minor things....I guess being wrong about flying with no wings could be considered bad..... I mean if being corrected about a spelling error gets you all peeved off then you definetly have some issues to deal with....issues larger than spelling. Lets save our energy for putting an end to violence, world hunger, bigger bags of potato chips, etc. before we curtail the correction of spelling or the supression of opinions. If accurately spelling (which in turn produces a more accurate ability to communicate) is not important then why are we wasting our time teaching children it....and if it is important then why get offended when someone corrects you? Corrections are progression. I know this whole thread isn't all about a couple of incidents where someone corrected spelling in a poem....but neither is my response. Things I'm saying can hopefully be applied to other situations....if applied to anything at all.

Some of you ask people to ignore a poem, etc. if it only causes one to want to express criticism but in the same hand shouldn't that ignore tactic also be used by those reading a response to their work. Basically it sounds like some of you are saying to responders to ignore something that bothers you....shouldn't that also apply to the person posting?...personally I don't think anyone should ignore anything that is said...always something to be learned or at least remembered. Technically speaking, couldn't one say that the only reason someone had something to say about a poem is because the person posted the poem, their poem had an effect on the person who responded, it influenced them in such a way as to respond the way the have, it caused them to communicate and express....just like this thread has helped influence my words here, what you all have written has helped create this response. The whole idea of writing is expression and communication, now if someone isn't free to do so freely, then what is the sense. Why start this thread if I can't feel free to go for or against it. Are only people with like-minded views allowed to publicly speak their minds? If I say I hate, I mean really hate, all the little *hugs* comments at the end of a response and they make my skin crawl, does that make me a bad person for feeling that or does it make you a bad person for having them there?..or neither...doesn't it just mean that you like something I don't. Does it mean you should stop writing them or I should stop disliking them? Why should someone be allowed to publicly write *hugs* and I not be allowed to publicly say I hate when people write *hugs*....I don't hate them by the way...I just sometimes find them annoying. Perhaps better advice than telling the masses to say things that will only appease the individual, would be telling the individual not to say anything if they fear responses that differ from what they want or expect from the masses. Now I'm not saying its okay to kick the dog when your brother spills your milk but I am trying to say maybe the dog won't be kicked if you are allowed to tell your brother that you dislike your milk being spilled....ie. maybe harsh, negative comments can stem from the fact that a person may have had their ability to express dislike suppressed by someone else.

ANyways that's what I felt like saying, some of it may apply, some of it may not but after reading everyone's words this is what I felt like saying.

Words are important, expression is important, feelings are important, speaking from the heart is important but how could anyone think that these are always happy, fluffy things?....ok, maybe I do have a few more things to say....

If someone thinks I'm an idiot, I'd like to hear them say I'm an idiot. Yes, it would hurt my feelings...I do have them too you know but it would also cause me to think, why does this person think I'm an idiot, then the door is open for communication and discussion as to why this person thinks I'm an idiot. If I never heard that this person thinks I'm an idiot then I would never have the opportunity to change their views of me or change myself or at least be able to form an opinion of whether I agree or disagree with that person. And if everyone thought I to be an idiot but no one ever said anything...and I really was or am an idiot then I'd stay an idiot because no one ever had the kindness to tell me what they really thought of me....well cause a true idiot would never be smart enough to figure out they were an idiot

Lets take that idiot example one step further, say someone is calling me an idiot out of anger over something else...lets say that person is a woman who is abused by her husband and has a lot of pent up anger. Now just the simple action of her calling me an idiot opens the door for a discussion to find out what is really bothering her. It seems to me that everything one expresses is actually a reference to layers upon layers of everything one has ever felt....which in turn feeds another persons life.

Okay that's all I'll say for now.

Trevor
*hugs* to all...can't believe I just did that     
JP
Senior Member
since 05-25-99
Posts 1391
Loomis, CA


24 posted 09-22-2000 01:05 PM       View Profile for JP   Email JP   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit JP's Home Page   View IP for JP

"Hello.  I'm JP, and I'm an idiot..."

"Hi JP!"


What can I say Trevor, your eloquence is astounding.  IMNSHO (in my not so humble opinion, BTW), you have captured the essence of the discussion and quite brilliantly made sense of the truth of it all.

Anyone here at Passions is welcome to comment on my work in anyway they feel driven to.  Of course that would entail actually reading my work... which lately seems not to be happening...(oops, sorry... I thought I was back at the pity party in FEELINGS).

Anyway - I agree with Trevor...


{{{{HUGS!}}}}


Yesterday is ash, tomorrow is smoke; only today does the fire burn.
JP

"Everything is your own damn fault, if you are any good." E. Hemmingway
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