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Sensitivity or lack of....
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Sensitivity or lack of.... |
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RainbowGirl Member Elite
since 1999-07-31
Posts 3023United Kingdom 
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An email tonight brought something to my attention and oh boy, I hated reading it, knowing the hurt it caused, albeit inadvertently.... When we post our comments, please, please, be aware of sensitive hearts, caring hearts that read and if you are not specific, the damage you can do can be untold... No, I am not prepared to disclose the contents of the email...but I will say this and I did in reply to this mail...listen to the words, open your heart, see what I am saying...please... My reply: it doesn't matter what words people use, caring is a feeling, a vibration for me that transmits through words because I pick up on the feeling...I don't know how to explain it really....the point is, it's not how you word what you're trying to express but the life you give to the words you use.......I don't lie XXXXXXXX I never see the point in it myself, neither do I say words for the sake of it....please trust me on this but then again, I think you feel that same vibration yourself, so don't need to trust me, only yourself..  "Please be careful with your words, you can hurt someone, even if you think you're not! < !signature--> "If you always do what you've always done You'll always be where you are right now." Author Unknown [This message has been edited by RainbowGirl (edited 09-17-2000).] |
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Erin Member Elite
since 2000-06-15
Posts 2527~Chicago~ |
You know what Rainbow???I agree with you so much on this. I am somewhat sensitive to a point. And someone had the nerve to say something bad about me to a point where I just wanted to be so rude in a reply to their poem. Instead I decided to be nice. I think that this was a good subject to bring up too with some of the replies that are being left on poems. |
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Denise
Moderator
Member Seraphic
since 1999-08-22
Posts 22648 |
I agree, Cindy. It only takes a moment to think about what we are saying. And I couldn't have said this better myself!  Denise |
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RainbowGirl Member Elite
since 1999-07-31
Posts 3023United Kingdom |
Erin: Thank you for your reply, I have a special friend that is hurting and badly so, enough to stop the replies, to feel insignificant and all because some smart arse replied without thinking of those that truly care, we don't need dictionaries to show we care, just an honest heart... I'm angry, and heaven help the recipient of that post...*he* should have known better....we people, that speak our hearts, do so with imagination, we view that person we reply to, we know the power of words, after all that is *our* language, to use it against a caring individual, is, in my words, ....I'm actually lost for words ...to hurt another is to hurt yourself!< !signature--> "If you always do what you've always done You'll always be where you are right now." Author Unknown [This message has been edited by RainbowGirl (edited 09-17-2000).] |
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Brad Member Ascendant
since 1999-08-20
Posts 5705Jejudo, South Korea |
I'm terribly confused here. You say: "it doesn't matter what words people use" and then you say: "Please be careful with your words, you can hurt someone, even if you think you're not!" How can it be both? Without further information, it seems difficult to respond to this. Brad |
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RainbowGirl Member Elite
since 1999-07-31
Posts 3023United Kingdom |
Denise: Thank you sweetheart, your posts are always positive, encouraging and full of empathy... HUSG Brad: Wake up please sweetheart, read with your heart not with your mind.....I'm talking here about how you place your words, the tone you use, caring is felt, regardless of words...go tell your wife you love her, then tell someone else you love what they write, how you feel it, how it inspires you...then look at what happens.... < !signature--> "If you always do what you've always done You'll always be where you are right now." Author Unknown [This message has been edited by RainbowGirl (edited 09-17-2000).] |
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Brad Member Ascendant
since 1999-08-20
Posts 5705Jejudo, South Korea |
My only concern here is whether this is in reference to a post at CA or not (or even a post I made). I gave up trying to understand the assumptions guiding Open when people started being offended by those who point out typos. Brad |
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serenity blaze Member Empyrean
since 2000-02-02
Posts 27738 |
I'm with Brad---as I do try to reply frequently and yes, I am playful and off-the-cuff sometimes...but generally only with the people who know me...and certainly, if it were me that was the insensitive culprit, I would want to know... And there have been times, when I did not understand a reply to one of my poems, and also times that I misconstrued the intent of that reply...but me, being me, e mailed that person with a "huh?"---and have actually started many nice friendships in that manner. So, I'm not sure how to reply to this either. Unless it is particularly nasty---I would hope that all take the replies with a medicinal grain of salt. Personally, I would feel awful even inadvertantly hurting anyone's feelings, and would like to know. and hey...HUGS to everyone! PEACE. |
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Irie Senior Member
since 1999-12-01
Posts 1493Washington State |
This is why I've always felt that if someone had something negitive to say, to do so by e-mail. (and I'm not saying what you had to say was negitive Rainbowgirl, just making a point) You never know how they will take it. Not everyone interprets things the same way.. it is a fine line. I hope everyone fares well from what ever it is that happened. Cheers and Hugs to you all!  < !signature-->~Sheri [This message has been edited by Irie (edited 09-18-2000).] |
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RainbowGirl Member Elite
since 1999-07-31
Posts 3023United Kingdom |
Brad: No, I'm not talking about you nor does my comment refer in any way to the CA forum, I would expect that anyone that posts in there is asking for constructive feedback.. serenity: I'm not talking about playful comments to someone you know or for that matter, someone you don't...LOL.. Irie: Yes, I agree with you.. All: This post was not meant to refer to anybody directly and I will not break confidentiality either.... and besides, if everyone says "was it me?" eventually the person concerned may well ask the question and then I would be in the position of breaking confidentiality or lying, I'm not going to put myself in that position.. The post was simply to ask that people be more aware of how their comments may be received by others...that was all.. I hope that elleviates any confusion, but I admit, I do like to confuse people and I can even do it without even knowing it.. Take care all HUGS [This message has been edited by RainbowGirl (edited 09-18-2000).] |
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Local Rebel Member Ascendant
since 1999-12-21
Posts 5767Southern Abstentia |
Well it seems to me, whether in person or on the internet -- we always have to keep in mind the personality of the person being adressed and the perspective from which they will interpret our words. We always run the risk of offending someone but if we simply mind the manners we learned in kindergarten we'll be eating our feet with far less frequency. It's a pretty miserable existence to always be second guessing what people mean and wonder if there was some kind of slight in things people say -- so, me personally, unless somone slaps me in the skull with a brick bat -- I assume people always a: like me, and b: actually mean it when they compliment me, and c: if they tell me my flye is open its because they're afraid I'll be embarrassed not because they don't want to see the contents.. LOL.. so -- in the words of Rodney King... why can't we all just get along... Thanks Cindy..!!! HuggsZzzzzzz |
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RainbowGirl Member Elite
since 1999-07-31
Posts 3023United Kingdom |
LR: Slapping you in the head with a brick bat - gently though..*g* But only to say: I love ya pal.. Thanks, you got it spot on and said it so much better cause I only caused total confusion with this one...oh well, words were never my strong point..*g* HUSG |
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JP Senior Member
since 1999-05-25
Posts 1343Loomis, CA |
I've wrestled with how to reply to this, thought against replying, and decided it would eat me up if I didn't. I agree with your philosophy RainbowGirl, awareness of what we say and how we say it is of paramount importance. The difficulty we have here, is that we do not know each other as well as we would like to think we do. No matter how much we try, it is nearly impossible to truly know someone whom you only 'see' by what they write on the internet. One cannot look into the eyes of their companion to see the reaction to one's words; nor can one judge another's reading ability to govern how s/he will read comments written. I know I have offended people in here, I know others have offended me, but that is the way of life is it not? Are we talking about intentional rudeness? I think not. I think we are talking mostly about unintential comments or phrasings which may have the power to inadvertantly hurt someone else's feelings. Plus (Brad made a good point about this...) add to that the very real idea that we are also speaking of some overly sensitive people, who do indeed seem to get offended at the slightest remark that isn't flattering (is that not to be expected on a site dedicated to, and comprised of, artists?) Am I to spend extra hours deciding whether or not to enter into a discussion on the forums for fear that what I have to say may offend someone? Am I to just quit responding completely? am I supposed to water down my responses so much that all I ever say is "nice job"? If so, what then is the purpose of Passions? If I cannot feel at home here, say what is on my mind and in my heart, using the same social courtesies I would use in the real world, then what is the purpose? Do I promote or condone rudeness? Certainly not. Can I excuse unintential harshness? Absolutely. That is afterall a human frailty, and we are still human. In fact, I could accept and forgive unintentional rudeness much easier than I can forgive oversensitivity. Being oversensitive seems just a tad more arrogant to me... Okay, that said, let me say this. Some folks just may not understand that what they are saying, or how they are saying it, may come across as rude. Not everyone was raised in an environment that placed emphasis on politeness. In life we work and interact with these people and have a few, but not too many, difficulties. If it is someone we care about, we guide them in efforts to have them recognize and alter their socially abrasive behavior (perhaps a little more guidance and a little less complaining would go a ways in relieving the tensions). Okay, anything else? Well, since we are on the subject... Does anyone know what empathy as opposed to sympathy is? Often times we try to make another feel better by telling them "I know just how you feel" "Oh, I've been there" or "I've been through the same thing and I feel for you" or something of the sort. Take a moment to think about what you are saying, think of yourself, your life, and your circumstances, then think of the person you are speaking to and what they are saying. Then tell me if such comments, although well-intentioned, are not rude, or demeaning. Does it not trivialize a person's pain or depth of feeling to so casually jump in and assume you've 'been there, done that'? Is it not even slightly selfish to jump in to try and share someone's pain (ie; spotlight - for lack of a better description) I wonder if, a teenage boy, who's girlfriend of 6 months has just dumped him can truly say "I know just how you feel" to a lady of 40 something, who's husband of 20 years just left her... perhaps the better thing to do would be to just lend your support, rather than try to become a partner in their pain. I'm done for the moment. I'm sure I've offended someone, so let me hear it.  < !signature--> Yesterday is ash, tomorrow is smoke; only today does the fire burn. JP "Everything is your own damn fault, if you are any good." E. Hemmingway [This message has been edited by JP (edited 09-18-2000).] |
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PhaerieChild Senior Member
since 1999-08-30
Posts 1787Aloha, Oregon |
Well JP, you didn't offend me and that said, I also want it on record that I agree with you. Sensitivity is such a hard thing to gauge when dealing with people that we don't really know except through the web. Sometimes it is hard to know what word or phrase will hurt someone inadvertantly and all we can hope for is forgiveness when a mistake is made or an emotion is painfully touched. Cindy, I do hope that I am not the cause of anyone's pain, but if I am, please tell them I am truly sorry and will try to do better next time. Hugs to all....Shawna Poetry~ Words falling on paper, painting a dream. Shawna R. Holder Boise, Idaho |
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WhtDove Member Rara Avis
since 1999-07-22
Posts 9245Illinois |
I'm finding myself not knowing quite what to say either. Some people can be easily offended by words that weren't meant to be that way. We do have to be careful. I have no idea if it was something I said, but I can assure you that if it was, it was only done in a kindness or humorous way. I would never intentionally say something to harm someone or hurt their feelings Hugs! |
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Poet deVine
Administrator
Member Seraphic
since 1999-05-26
Posts 22612Hurricane Alley |
Sometimes words can hurt more than a physical blow because it hits us in our heart - and if that heart is open and unprotected, the pain can be a terrible thing. All we have to judge each other on here is our words..and a few smilies. Not knowing what was said, all I can say is that either the offender didn't know his/her words would cause someone pain, or they knew it and didn't care - in that case 'shame on them!' We have no room for meanness here. Passions is based on the basic human right to say what you want - but not at the expense of someone's feelings. I sincerely hope the offender sees this and contacts your friend to apologize and make it right. |
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Corazon Senior Member
since 2000-02-02
Posts 1209 |
I respond with my heart, I read with my heart and I write from my heart....I hope I am always taken that way, I never like to hurt another hugs rg...long time no see |
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brian madden Member Elite
since 2000-05-06
Posts 4374ireland |
How may times have a slip of tongue on my part hurt someone I love, too often for my taste. I have put my foot it in a few times, hopefully not at the site and to avoid doing that I try to stay clear of religious debates because I can rant a bit and thread on toes. I know that there been and I am sure will be times when people will not agree with everything that I write, I can a bit preachy about certain subjects and I am sure that they just don't reply to my poems which is fine by me. I don't like everything I read either and concentrate on what I do like. I think it is excessive e-mailing someone with personal comments about their poem if they are a very critical nature, we have a forum for that. Was that person too afraid to share their comments in the forum where the poem was posted? Poetry is all about communicating emotions, feelings, connecting with people. It does not matter what way it is done, whether the poem is technically brilliant or just a simple flow of thoughts. A well-written poem will make people feel something. Personally I think people who make such a gesture are lacking in something, and should get a more productive hobby. < !signature--> My view stretches out from the fence to the wall No words could explain, no actions determine Just watching the trees and the leaves as they fall:Joy division [This message has been edited by brian madden (edited 09-19-2000).] |
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RainbowGirl Member Elite
since 1999-07-31
Posts 3023United Kingdom |
My Apologies for the delay in replying, some kind and considerate soul had nothing better to do and decided to make the most of a vulnerable port, leaving me and my beloved friend (pc) in a bit of a mess.. Spent all last evening and the whole of the night rectifying the damage and ensuring it doesn't happen again..So if this doesn't make much sense, I've had no sleep, on the other hand if it drops off in mid-sentence, I am sleeping.. ***** JP: Now we can't have you eaten, unless of course it is alive..*g*..ooops Of course I am aware of the difference between empathy and sympathy, that's why I chose empathy, you know.. and I take it you're refering to my remark to Denise, well I happen to think in this case, it is true, but as you say, it's not in every case, so I concur a little (is that allowed?..*g* )I don't expect *anyone* to do anything which would be outside of their normal behavioural pattern, but surely it isn't too much to ask that one take another's feelings into consideration, after all, if you don't like something, does someone force you to say so?..I don't think so, I find it quite easy to say something kind rather than something that will offend... ..I think the difference lies between a debate where all parties expect a little parry and thrust than when someone posts a poem or replies to one, don't you? ps: You didn't offend me, I found you to be frank and to the point, that I can deal with..*g* ****** WildChild: Sweetheart, you !!! Offend someone....oh my, now you have me smiling, no sweetheart, I don't think so.. ****** Dovey: People can only be offended sweetheart when they're unsure of the reception to that which they have written...I don't think I have ever known you say anthing to the contrary.. ****** Sharon: Bless you!! You got it in one as well.. There is simply no need to say soemthing if it can't be encouraging ...alsas, I don't think there will be an outcome, but that isn't for me to say...sometimes you know, we can't actually tell soemone that they have hurt us, it's just too hard.. Thanks sweetheart.. ****** Corazon: I know you do, me as well...*g* ****** Brian: Well they do say that one should steer clear of Politics; Finance, and Religion, but I do admit I love a good debate..*g* So feel free.. Could you clarify your final paragraph for me though, I'm not sure if you're saying it's ok to offend so long as the author made you feel it whether you're saying the opposite? ****** HUGS all, time for sleep here, hope I made sense.. Take care < !signature--> "If you always do what you've always done You'll always be where you are right now." Author Unknown [This message has been edited by RainbowGirl (edited 09-19-2000).] |
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JP Senior Member
since 1999-05-25
Posts 1343Loomis, CA |
RainbowGirl - Honestly I was not referring to you when I wrote of empathy. In fact I cannot think of a thing you've ever written that has offended me - disagreed with, certainly, but offend? No. I was actually referring to more than a few posts that I have seen (yes, and written) where someone has happily jumped in and said basically "been there, done that!" This has been a long-standing gripe of mine... Pet peeves afterall, are our pets... Religion, Politics and Finances eh? Taboo subjects? What if we talk about how religion has bought the politicians? Would that cover it all? Yesterday is ash, tomorrow is smoke; only today does the fire burn. JP "Everything is your own damn fault, if you are any good." E. Hemmingway |
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RainbowGirl Member Elite
since 1999-07-31
Posts 3023United Kingdom |
JP: You mean you *just* read my opening comments and then waded straight in?...Shame on you...ROFL..but thank you for saying I have never offended you.. Hmmm...re: the "been there, done that"...soem people have been there and done that, myself included and I would hate to lay claim to the number of disasters as well, so I'm sure that many of us here have also been through a fair bit in their lifetime...Myself personally I always seem to know if someone is saying it genuinely, I don't know why, something in their comment perhaps that only they could feel if they *had* been there...but mostly I think people want to offer support and encouragement and sometimes I will just give "HUGS" because I don't really know what else to say other than I feel for them.. LOL@ "religion has bought the politicians"...In my experience politicians will use anything including religion if they can get away with it...*g* Thanks for the reply and I hope you don't object to my humour, I'm feeling a little bit mischevious... |
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JP Senior Member
since 1999-05-25
Posts 1343Loomis, CA |
I think the *HUGS* are probably the best response to a sad situation. Often, when blue, hurt, mad, or sad, I don't care if someone has been there, or experienced it, or "knows just how I feel", I would rather have a hug, or a gentle pat on the hand. Sympathy is sometimes better medicine than empathy... But then again, I just left the pity party in FEELINGS... Yesterday is ash, tomorrow is smoke; only today does the fire burn. JP "Everything is your own damn fault, if you are any good." E. Hemmingway |
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White Wolf Member
since 1999-09-18
Posts 371Somewhere in the vast wasteland |
I just thought that I would put in my two cents worth. First off I have a personal stake in this matter. No, not here, not yet but seeing as to the fact that I have yet to post some poetry has something to do with it. I have been sensitive all my life. Maybe too sensitive, who knows? While growing up, I was called stupid, a nothing, that I would be nothing, and many other things that are not appropiate to repeat here. Back then I just took it. I just couldn't fight back and when I did, it just wasn't worth it. But now I am older and realize that everyone deserves respect, and I do mean everyone. But when I feel that someone is being hurtful to hurt someone, like myself, I no longer stand by and watch. Depending on my mood and how I feel about what was said I will usually give one of two responses. One is I just explode and just trust me when I say nobody wants see that. The other way is I come up with something witty to say that gets my point accross rather effectively. But this has nothing to do with the subject at hand. This is my take on the subject is simply this, "If you can't say anything nice(or comforting like a hug) don't say anything at all". I like to see people smiling. Another thing I think is important is the fact that people complain so much about spelling. So much so that someone once suggested a forum so people could learn to spell better. While the idea is great the way it came about was totally offensive. Some people may not have had the education that others have had and some people, like me, just have never been able to spell things right. I know most of my words are cause I use a spellcheck on the words I think are spelled wrong. If you are one of those people that misspelled words just bug you to no end then don't read the poem or find someway to bring it to the person's attention in a nonhurtful manner, in private and don't bring it up to everyone whether you use their names or not. They will know who they are and be hurt by it. Misspellings are like my fly being down, I don't want it announced to the whole world even if they already know. Leave me some dignity. If the person who suggested the spelling think, please take no offense. I honestly don't remember who you are. And I would ask the the poeple that do know who it is, don't hold this against him or throw it in his face. When I say "him" I simply mean either male or female. I know I don't. Anyway I have put in my two cents worth and two on credit. Please don't be offended by this post. I was only trying to point out that nitpicking has never done any good. The White Wolf Would the bunny like this nice carrot? I don't bite. Much. :) |
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Trevor Senior Member
since 1999-08-12
Posts 700Canada |
How do you know what words will hurt until you say them? Isn't it a suppression of feelings and expression to tip-toe around the things that cause feelings and expression? Why should one only be allowed to express opinions of a pleasing nature? If someone shows a poem or any other communicative words, shouldn't they expect you to perhaps correct something simple like a spelling mistake or grammatical error.... a lot of you good folks seem to think that being wrong is something bad and should be all secretive like about it. Being wrong is not bad...well not always, at least not for minor things....I guess being wrong about flying with no wings could be considered bad..... I mean if being corrected about a spelling error gets you all peeved off then you definetly have some issues to deal with....issues larger than spelling. Lets save our energy for putting an end to violence, world hunger, bigger bags of potato chips, etc. before we curtail the correction of spelling or the supression of opinions. If accurately spelling (which in turn produces a more accurate ability to communicate) is not important then why are we wasting our time teaching children it....and if it is important then why get offended when someone corrects you? Corrections are progression. I know this whole thread isn't all about a couple of incidents where someone corrected spelling in a poem....but neither is my response. Things I'm saying can hopefully be applied to other situations....if applied to anything at all. Some of you ask people to ignore a poem, etc. if it only causes one to want to express criticism but in the same hand shouldn't that ignore tactic also be used by those reading a response to their work. Basically it sounds like some of you are saying to responders to ignore something that bothers you....shouldn't that also apply to the person posting?...personally I don't think anyone should ignore anything that is said...always something to be learned or at least remembered. Technically speaking, couldn't one say that the only reason someone had something to say about a poem is because the person posted the poem, their poem had an effect on the person who responded, it influenced them in such a way as to respond the way the have, it caused them to communicate and express....just like this thread has helped influence my words here, what you all have written has helped create this response. The whole idea of writing is expression and communication, now if someone isn't free to do so freely, then what is the sense. Why start this thread if I can't feel free to go for or against it. Are only people with like-minded views allowed to publicly speak their minds? If I say I hate, I mean really hate, all the little *hugs* comments at the end of a response and they make my skin crawl, does that make me a bad person for feeling that or does it make you a bad person for having them there?..or neither...doesn't it just mean that you like something I don't. Does it mean you should stop writing them or I should stop disliking them? Why should someone be allowed to publicly write *hugs* and I not be allowed to publicly say I hate when people write *hugs*....I don't hate them by the way...I just sometimes find them annoying. Perhaps better advice than telling the masses to say things that will only appease the individual, would be telling the individual not to say anything if they fear responses that differ from what they want or expect from the masses. Now I'm not saying its okay to kick the dog when your brother spills your milk but I am trying to say maybe the dog won't be kicked if you are allowed to tell your brother that you dislike your milk being spilled....ie. maybe harsh, negative comments can stem from the fact that a person may have had their ability to express dislike suppressed by someone else. ANyways that's what I felt like saying, some of it may apply, some of it may not but after reading everyone's words this is what I felt like saying. Words are important, expression is important, feelings are important, speaking from the heart is important but how could anyone think that these are always happy, fluffy things?....ok, maybe I do have a few more things to say.... If someone thinks I'm an idiot, I'd like to hear them say I'm an idiot. Yes, it would hurt my feelings...I do have them too you know but it would also cause me to think, why does this person think I'm an idiot, then the door is open for communication and discussion as to why this person thinks I'm an idiot. If I never heard that this person thinks I'm an idiot then I would never have the opportunity to change their views of me or change myself or at least be able to form an opinion of whether I agree or disagree with that person. And if everyone thought I to be an idiot but no one ever said anything...and I really was or am an idiot then I'd stay an idiot because no one ever had the kindness to tell me what they really thought of me....well cause a true idiot would never be smart enough to figure out they were an idiot Lets take that idiot example one step further, say someone is calling me an idiot out of anger over something else...lets say that person is a woman who is abused by her husband and has a lot of pent up anger. Now just the simple action of her calling me an idiot opens the door for a discussion to find out what is really bothering her. It seems to me that everything one expresses is actually a reference to layers upon layers of everything one has ever felt....which in turn feeds another persons life. Okay that's all I'll say for now. Trevor *hugs* to all...can't believe I just did that |
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JP Senior Member
since 1999-05-25
Posts 1343Loomis, CA |
"Hello. I'm JP, and I'm an idiot..." "Hi JP!" What can I say Trevor, your eloquence is astounding. IMNSHO (in my not so humble opinion, BTW), you have captured the essence of the discussion and quite brilliantly made sense of the truth of it all. Anyone here at Passions is welcome to comment on my work in anyway they feel driven to. Of course that would entail actually reading my work... which lately seems not to be happening...(oops, sorry... I thought I was back at the pity party in FEELINGS). Anyway - I agree with Trevor... {{{{HUGS!}}}} Yesterday is ash, tomorrow is smoke; only today does the fire burn. JP "Everything is your own damn fault, if you are any good." E. Hemmingway |
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brian madden Member Elite
since 2000-05-06
Posts 4374ireland |
"Could you clarify your final paragraph for me though, I'm not sure if you're saying it's ok to offend so long as the author made you feel it whether you're saying the opposite?" No no I don't think it is ok to offend someone, say for instance I write a poem I would prefer for someone to give me an honest response... say well it is ok but it is lacking needs this that, I am totally against idiots who can't string an arguement or critique together saying "your poem sucks" I don't like everything I read, but that does not mean it is rubbish. It would be very arrogant of me to think that just because I don't like something that is has no value. I Like to hear people's opinions when formed in intelligent responses, I can handle hearing that something I wrote is not good if I can be given reasons. I can't help the way people will react to my poems but I do like to hear their thoughts even if they are opposed to mine. If the poem has made them think, made them question then I am happy. But I have no time for idiots who get kicks out of tearing poems apart when they can't even form an intelligent sentence.In fact that reminds me I should be getting back to posting in Crit. and stop feeding my ego. Just go easy on me, not that I am easily offended. "an afixiation a fix on anything the line of life the limb of a tree the hands of he and the promise that s/he is blessed among women". Patti Smith |
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RainbowGirl Member Elite
since 1999-07-31
Posts 3023United Kingdom |
JP: HUGS are good to have and of course I will say that because I genuinely mean my hugs every time I place them on the end of my message..if I didn't, I simply wouldn't add them... However, I do think misplaced comfort can do as much damage as no comfort at all...so it's a personal choice, I will naturally respond to something that I sense, you know? That gut feeling type of poem/reply...those that I feel no affinity for I pass on by or as is more often the case these days, I simply can't read them all....once, I was here all the time, but then something triggers off a pattern and sometimes you have to do other things but rest assured, each and every time I say HUGS, I mean it...that's just the kind of person I am.. HUGS *g* ******* WhiteWolf: You do bring up many valid points, I would not dream of commenting on someone's grammar but it could make a lot of difference as to how smoothly I read what they feel...but I really wasn't talking here of the odd spelling error... Story for you....a few years back and on a completly different forum....a young lady was posting and always got her words mixed up or so it seemed, often transposed...I was talking to an extremely intelligent man and it bugged him no end, to the point where he said he was going to say that if she were a teacher, she should be ashamed of herself...I disagreed, without too much difficulty you could read the heart, the warmth and the care inside all of her messages...however, he did post such a message....turns out she was dyslexic...guess who felt bad about that or should have done.... Poems or replies are not all about grammar, they're about sharing, and I'm sure if I spelt heart as hart, most, would read between the errors... Thank you for your reply and the time it took you to do so.. HUGS ******* Trevor: ROFL...you do make a lot of sense...*g*...quite true what you say, how would we all know that occasionally we are thought of as grumpy; idiotic, vulgar, etc etc, if no one else took the time to say....thank heavens most think I am a warm type of soul but with a wicked sense of humour..*g* Food for thought.. Thanks for the reply, enjoyed it immensely.. ******* JP: We know....ROFL but a kind one, however much you like to think you're an argumentative so and so...*g* HUGS ******* Brian: Thanks for the clarification.. I don't personally belive that Open or any other forum other than C/A is the right place to critique anyone, unless, you know them extremely well....my own take, as a personal thought on this, is that many post an emotional poem and as such, that is how I read them, yes, sometimes when I print out a poem to share with someone else I can trip over the words (and I'm used to speaking publicly) simply because format got in the way of the actual message, sometimes a poem will run so smoothly, it litteraly will run off the tongue, sometimes you will laugh so much that you have to stop for breath...but I will never, ever think I'm so good, that I can afford to criticise another... Just isn't my style....but I am so glad you clarified that... To me, poetry is about expression, pain, happiness or simply bewilderment...which ever way...thank heavens, we have the means to place on paper/screen words that communicate who we each are.. HUGS ps: I made at least 5 spelling errors on this last post, fingers run in front of my brain..*g* [This message has been edited by RainbowGirl (edited 09-22-2000).] |
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StarrGazer Senior Member
since 2000-03-05
Posts 679Texas |
In my opinion there are two ways to critique a poem constructive critisism and then there is the just plain rudenes. Granted you may not like every poem you read but goes back to the "if you don't have anything nice to say don't say anything at all" form of thought. If you would like to give a writer advice on their poem I have found ,as a general rule, first say what you like about the poem and then if you have any suggestions to make write them down read through them as if they were intended for you and think of how the comments make you feel. If you have done all of this and think that the advice you offer has been stated in the best way that you know how and is not meant to be offensive and you don't find it as such say a little prayer and click send and hope that they do not take it in a offensive way... it's not guaranteed to work but at least you will know that you have put some thought into your response and if the person gets offended you have done everything within your power to insure that it did not happen. Now taking the role of the offendee, if someone posts a reply that you find offensive you can either confront them and tell them "hey, you really offended me with that remark" or you can simply weigh what they have said, determine if it has any merit kindly thank them and chose to ignore the offense secure in the knowledge that YOU like the poem. ok ok enough rambling ...sorry I can see both sides of the argument here, and I have solutions that seem to work for me so just thought I'd share them Shan |
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JP Senior Member
since 1999-05-25
Posts 1343Loomis, CA |
Okay, I've decided. I'm just going to start using smilies. I read a lot of the work on this site and I don't always comment, often I am not moved to, often I cannot think of anything worthwhile to say The resounding message here is "if you don't have anything nice to say, blah, blah, blah..." Then add to that the idea that if I am not putting some sort of reply on someone's poem, I in turn get brushed aside. There's a whole courtesy/karma/payback thing going on here that I cannot quite grasp... So, I'll just start posting smilies when I read a poem, bump everyone to the top when I read it - perhaps blue smilies when they make me sad, embarrassed smilies for poems in the Adult forum, mad smilies (oxymoron?) when I don't like something... At least this way I will let the poet know that I read his or her work and I won't have to fake something nice nor offend with something not nice. Yesterday is ash, tomorrow is smoke; only today does the fire burn. JP Most people would rather die than think; in fact, they do so. B. Russell |
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Trevor Senior Member
since 1999-08-12
Posts 700Canada |
Hello again everyone, JP: Thanks for the kind words. I don't know if I made sense of it all but I hope at least I didn't make the water any muddier Cindy: "I disagreed, without too much difficulty you could read the heart, the warmth and the care inside all of her messages...however, he did post such a message....turns out she was dyslexic...guess who felt bad about that or should have done...." Why should he have felt bad, you make it sound like what he did was something bad, he didn't know that she was dyslexic and now he does. To me that is something good. If he had kept silent you may never had known this and never have come to a better and deeper understanding of this person. You probably would have always thought that this girl was awful at spelling or sentence structure if no one had questioned it. There's no shame in being dyslexic but that doesn't mean it should be ignored. If anyone needs extra help with spelling and grammar its those that suffer from dyslexia. I mean the fact that she even had the ability to write poetry most likely comes from the fact that there are people who have corrected her backward tendencies and tried to help her. If people had just sat idly by and said, I don't want to offend her by pointing out mistakes, her writing would probably be incomprehensible and never improve and she would never be able to share her written words and thoughts with you. BTW glad you enjoyed my initial response. "To me, poetry is about expression, pain, happiness or simply bewilderment...which ever way...thank heavens, we have the means to place on paper/screen words that communicate who we each are.." I couldn't agree with you more, however....and there always seems to be a however waiting to escape from me , the written language is about communicating thoughts and feelings so that we can more accurately project ourselves to others. Isn't that the point of writing? Its like painting pictures of ourselves through words even when those words pertain to someone else.....and if there is no discussion on how we use language then how can we ever become effective at doing this....and if we can't become effective at doing this then how can we expect to have any understanding of each other or our world? How can we expect to be understood?Well I guess that's it for me, I'll shut up now. Thanks for the interesting discussion, Trevor |
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RainbowGirl Member Elite
since 1999-07-31
Posts 3023United Kingdom |
StarrGazer: Thanks for your input.. I agree that should you wish to respond to something with suggestions then you should do so through email, unless of course they have requested ideas/suggestions...but, I read everything as coming from a unique individual and anything I might have to say would surely be from my own perspective? And no I wouldn't comment on form because I have no idea about that at all, and it shows..*g* But we're on the same line I think...not everyone will say something to an unkind comment and I am probably the worst offender on that subject, give me someone who is hurting and I'll be like a ferret with a rat but rarely on my own behalf...LOL ******* JP: ROFL...if I see a smiley, right way up or upside down as the only comment from you I think I shall be to busy reminding myself of this thread and laughing...I almost want to go and hunt out any replies from you...*g* ****** Trevor: Yes, I believe he should have been ashamed of himself, this was not on a poetry forum and he could have asked in a diplomatic way, rather than just assume that she was making no effort...he could have emailed her privately, he could have been diplomatic, to me they are both a courtesy one should apply in any situation...but just because that's my personal opinion, it doesn't make me right...*g* As for his comment to me when he did know, if I remember correctly it was soemthing like, 'well she shouldn't be posting then' .....*sigh* Re the writing form etc...just my own personal thoughts here...I did try once to get a grasp on all the various forms but I found that when I tried to apply them, I lost the natural me and this strange stiff person came out instead...so I gave it up...I just write exactly as I feel at any given moment and as for style, the only comment I can make on that is that it is called RainbowGirl/Cindy style...ROFL Thanks again for all your replies...it's been a great way to get to know you better.. HUGS all [This message has been edited by RainbowGirl (edited 09-23-2000).] |
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