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 Moderated by: Ron   (Admins )

 
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Dark Enchantress
Senior Member
since 07-27-99
Posts 1460
meet Morgana


0 posted 02-10-2001 12:52 PM       View Profile for Dark Enchantress   Email Dark Enchantress   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Dark Enchantress's Home Page   View IP for Dark Enchantress

Well, many times throughout my membership here I've seen other poems or my own locked or removed due to it's content. The content being on the subject of suicide, self-injury, or something along those lines. I realize the dangers they offer to the very young eyes of some of our poets and that exposing them to this is unacceptable. But I don't feel that it's right to deny someone of their freedom in expressing their emotions. These suicidal people, those who cut themselves and burn themselves, they know what they do is wrong. They usually don't mean to make what they do sound like the ultimate and best solution. Certainly not. This is why I think there should be another forum for these poems, which offers them both an escape for their emotions as well as the guidence they need. Wouldn't you rather help someone than to silence them? I know that you're very busy already with the new changes but I think this is something you should really put some thought into. Of course some rules would be set up like the audience and poets must be of a certain age (not just adults please, teens need this too), no poet is allowed to promote violence on anyone including themselves, etc., etc., etc.

Like I said before, for now this is just something to think about since you are already so busy. I love and appreciate Passions very much, I just feel that this is something that needs to be done one way or another.

Thanks


I am no one if not myself.

Angel of Darkness




[This message has been edited by Dark Enchantress (edited 02-10-2001).]
Nan
Administrator
Member Seraphic
since 05-20-99
Posts 24426
Cape Cod Massachusetts USA


1 posted 02-10-2001 02:52 PM       View Profile for Nan   Email Nan   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Nan's Home Page   View IP for Nan

This question has been raised before here at Passions.  

If our moderating team were qualified social workers and/or psychiatrists, we'd perhaps be able to handle such intensely volatile issues. Unfortunately, we're simply not equipped to do so.  Therein lies the semantical answer to your question.

Aside from that, the intrinsic philosophy behind Passions is one of anti-violence - against ourselves or others.  That isn't ever going to change.  

We understand that people need outlets for their suicidal emotions, but Passions simply isn't the proper place for them.  These are problems that MUST be brought to professionals who can deal with them properly.

We recognize the need... but we acquiesce to those who have the proper means to help...


Waft every crest upon your destined sea.
Embrace the Wave of Serendipity,
Lest its elusive arcane ecstasy
Refurl with sail for all eternity.
Acies
Deputy Moderator 1 Tour
Moderator
Member Laureate
since 06-07-2000
Posts 14805
Twilight Zone


2 posted 02-10-2001 05:08 PM       View Profile for Acies   Email Acies   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Acies

I was gonna say the same thing
basically, i agree w/ nan

I see no changes, wake up in the morning I ask myself, "Is life worth living or should I blast myself" TUPAC SHAKUR


Krawdad
Member Elite
since 01-03-2001
Posts 2627


3 posted 02-10-2001 05:18 PM       View Profile for Krawdad   Email Krawdad   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Krawdad

While it certainly is up to Ron and the invited moderators to decide what's appropriate here (and most of us can accept that), it should be acknowledged that such decisions are arbitrary.  Suicide and physical self abuse are obvious and frightening extremes of behavior, but certainly not the only behaviors (psychological abuse e.g.) that might benefit from some social, psychological or even psychiatric intervention.  Some of those other behaviors may be found in these pages.
Nan, are the moderators equiped to refer an extreme case to another site that would provide a professional response?

Kraw'
Ron
Administrator
Member Rara Avis
since 05-19-99
Posts 9708
Michigan, US


4 posted 02-10-2001 09:34 PM       View Profile for Ron   Email Ron   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Ron's Home Page   View IP for Ron

Suicide and the kind of depression that leads to suicide are not behavioral problems, Krawdad. They are medical conditions. I would never encourage someone with a broken leg to forego treatment just because sitting at the keyboard and writing poetry takes their mind off the pain for a little while. Nor would I be real pleased if their poetry encouraged others to break their legs.

Unfortunately, chemical imbalances aren't as obvious as broken bones. If you see two inches of fibula protruding from your shin, it doesn't take a medical degree to figure out that's probably the source of your pain. The pain of clinical depressions is every bit as intense, every bit as real, and every bit as rooted in physical causes. But, unlike a broken leg, it DOES take a medical degree to diagnose the source of that pain. And to properly treat it. I don't think there is anything arbitrary in deciding we don't want to promote death as a viable treatment.

Enchantress, our Guideline against advocating violence as a solution to problems has almost nothing to do with our younger Members.  Whether you're nine or ninety, it's just as wrong. Those who romanticize suicide do both themselves and society a great disservice. Themselves, because they misdiagnose the cause of their pain, blaming it on "events," and subsequently don't get the real help they need. Society, because they help perpetuate the myth there is somehow something noble or self-sacrificing in a foolish, unnecessary death. People are fond of saying suicide is the leading cause of teenage death, but that's only part of the truth. If those same teenagers had cancer, they would get help, because society recognizes cancer as a medical problem with a medical solution. Clinical depression is no different, and suicide isn't really the leading cause of teen death. Misinformation is the real cause, largely perpetuated by darn good writers. I believe people need help, real help, and not romantic justifications.

I sincerely wish I had a solution. But I don't, and without medical training, I won't pretend I can likely find one. What I can do, have done, and will continue to do, is refuse to be part of the problem.
Dark Enchantress
Senior Member
since 07-27-99
Posts 1460
meet Morgana


5 posted 02-11-2001 12:04 AM       View Profile for Dark Enchantress   Email Dark Enchantress   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Dark Enchantress's Home Page   View IP for Dark Enchantress

I don't really mean it for professional help. That seems to be what everyone thinks. It's mostly just for the pure expression of it. Self-expression at least allows some kind of communication, which is all I'm asking for. It's not like we're saying "I'm inflicting pain on myself 'cause it's the only thing I can do." We're saying, "This is what it feels like." Nothing more, nothing less. Most people that write like that only wish to express themselves and to be understood. It's just a very touchy subject for me because as I've said, I've had my own poems locked before as a result of me talking about my "illnesses". However I completely respect and understand your reasoning, Ron, which is why I won't bring it up again. Thank you for listening.  

I am no one if not myself.

Angel of Darkness






[This message has been edited by Dark Enchantress (edited 02-11-2001).]
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