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Gossamerwings
Member
since 07-18-2000
Posts 210


0 posted 08-02-2000 07:29 PM       View Profile for Gossamerwings   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Gossamerwings

I need help with this one.
My sister was(is)a member here before I joined.

I joined, using her computer and we will be sharing it for several months, if she doesn't kill me first.  

When she tries to log in to p.i.p. she erases my name and password and enters her own.Ceres accepts that without saying it is invalid or anything and she is in...but she is in AS ME and she can not submit poems or replys in her own name.  

I have talked with Ron about it and he says that it is not his Ceres,that it is my browser.(actually he said my PC).
I am using IE5 and sis and I have dumped all cookies,emptied the cache, defragged,cleaned this thing up like crazy.I have done everything I can think of...she still can't get in here as herself and she is upset. I don't blame her.

I would appreciate any help anyone can give me.


Gossamerwings


[This message has been edited by Gossamerwings (edited 08-02-2000).]
RainbowGirl
Member Elite
since 07-31-99
Posts 3167
United Kingdom


1 posted 08-02-2000 08:14 PM       View Profile for RainbowGirl   Email RainbowGirl   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit RainbowGirl's Home Page   View IP for RainbowGirl

I can think of 4 things that may or may not be causing that problem but in order to follow through with this you need to ensure that you are in DOS command mode ONLY... prior to that made sure you have deleted all cookies, all history and all temp internet files (but, from within the View, Internet options menu) then:

1) got to Start and Shutdown but before you click ok to shutdown hold down the Control key and keep it depressed as it reboots until you have the safe mode menu come up, choose option 5 which is DOS command mode only, it will enable a few drivers but only a few and that's ok.

2) type in the following,( I'll list both commands depending whether you are seeing the prompt for

c:\windows or c:\ ...)

if you see windows type the following

deltree history (the space is a space..lol)

if you see c:\

type cd c:\windows

deltree history

that's step 1

************

3) again, depending on which prompt you get, if it's c:\windows

type

deltree temp

if c:\

cd c:\windows

deltree temp

on both deltree history and temp you should get a confirmation message, say yes.

after you have deleted the history folder when you reboot it will automatically recreate your history folder, albeit an empty one...but for the temp folder you need to recreate it, so after deleting the temp folder you need to ensure you are at the windows prompt which as you just deleted that folder it should return you to c:\windows

type

md temp

(that's an abbreviation for make directory)

(only 2 to go)

ensuring you are at the c:\ prompt, type exactly, including the quotes

deltree "c:\windows Temporary Internet Files"

lastly it could be that your swap file is corrupt but I need to know where that resides as for some it is in the windows root directory and others it is in the root directory of c:\

You can find that by using the find menu....the file you are looking for is called

win386.swp

Depending where this file resides make sure you are in the right directory, i.e.

cd c:\windows

or

cd c:\

then type

del win386.swp

again this file will be recreated when you boot up.

I'll have to see how these instructions look when I've posted them, if you're not comfortable following those or have some concerns or questions, I'll be around on mail or ICQ for about an hour after posting this...

and lastly of course you will need to reboot...

Hope it works for you, I can't think of anything else..  

HUGS

****

ok, they look good to me with a small edit  LOL..



[This message has been edited by RainbowGirl (edited 08-02-2000).]
Gossamerwings
Member
since 07-18-2000
Posts 210


2 posted 08-03-2000 12:47 AM       View Profile for Gossamerwings   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Gossamerwings

Thank you so much for your reply. My sis said she already did this.
She still can't get in.  

Seems to me that if the system can't recognize us as two separate people that it is the systems fault, not the fault of this PC. I don't have this problem anywhere but here.

Thanks again for your time
and your response,I really do
appreciate it.


Gossamerwings
Ron
Administrator
Member Rara Avis
since 05-19-99
Posts 9708
Michigan, US


3 posted 08-03-2000 09:45 AM       View Profile for Ron   Email Ron   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Ron's Home Page   View IP for Ron

Heaven knows I don't often get irritated. But you asked for help and Cindy expended a lot of time and effort trying to supply it. To see you blow her off with "she already did this" goes beyond irritation. Frankly, if your sister knows enough about computers to have already gone through this process on her own, she can certainly explain to you why your supposition is -at best - na´ve.

However, for the benefit of those who don't have such a knowledgeable sister, let's explore it.

The Internet, by default, is a stateless environment. That simply means that when you go from one web page to another web page, you effectively become a brand new visitor. The web server on the other end creates a brand new process, opens a brand new connection, and presents you with a brand new page. Once you get the page you requested, the computer process is utterly destroyed, along with virtually all information about you. Whether you came from another web page on that same server or from a search engine in another time zone makes absolutely no difference.

In the bad old days, that meant you would have to identify yourself anew for every single page. Not a lot of fun. So Netscape, one of the first browser companies, came up with a concept they called cookies. Since the web server has no way of keeping track of you, Netscape decided to let your PC keep track of you.

PC: "Here's the username and password my master just enteredů"

Web Server: "Okay, those are good. Please store both on your hard drive, in cookies, so you can give them to me again later."

PC: "Sure, I can do that for you!"


A few minutes later, you click on a link and go to a new web page. Remember, you just became a brand new visitor, creating a brand new computer process that doesn't know you from Eve.

Web Server: "Hello, PC on the other end. Do you happen to have any cookies for me?"

PC: "Well, yea, I do. Username is set to Gossamerwings and password is set to ****"

Web Server: "Fine. In that case, I won't ask your master to enter them again."


Most of the time, this little scenario works pretty smoothly and it saves Internet users a lot of typing. But software isn't perfect and sometimes it gets out of whack. In the conversation above, when your PC said, "Sure, I can do that for you," it was blatantly wrong. It couldn't do it. Maybe the file was corrupt, maybe you have the settings wrong. But it wasn't able to save the new cookies. And the next time the Web Server asked for the cookies, your PC gave it old information.

Please note that web servers do not talk to people. When your fingers touch the keyboard or wiggle the mouse, you are talking only to your own PC, not to the web server. At some point, when you click on a Submit button somewhere along the line, you are asking your PC to send something along to the web server. If it's what you typed, then your PC did a good job. If not, then it's a problem between you and the PC. Web servers do not talk to people. They can't look through the monitor and recognize eye color or length of hair. They can't even look at what you typed, but only what your PC tells them you typed. Web servers don't talk to people. They talk only to PC's. And if that works for approximately 25,000 people at Passions every day, but doesn't work for you, guess what? It just might be a problem with your PC!

I don't expect everyone to understand the intricacies of Internet communication like Cindy does, or like your sister obviously does. But neither do I expect people to stomp their feet and say, "This is the way I think it should be, now damnit, make it work." If you're going to ask for help, at least give the person who takes the time to reply the courtesy of assuming they know more than you do. If they didn't, you wouldn't need to ask for help and they wouldn't waste their time responding.

Lack of understanding is okay. Lack of courtesy isn't.

For those of you who share a computer with multiple Passionate personalities, you might want to avoid the problem entirely by using different Profiles. For IE users, that means setting up Profiles in Windows, which will then cascade to Internet Explorer. For Netscape users, you can use the Profile Manager that comes with recent versions. In both instances, your PC will set aside separate areas of the hard disk so you can have a different set of cookies for each Profile. An even easier, though less useful solution, is to go into Preferences here in the forums and tell Ceres to not use persistent cookies. That means every time you shut down your browser your cookies will go away - including the corrupt ones.

Of course, Gossamerwing's sister already knows all this.


Ron
Administrator
Member Rara Avis
since 05-19-99
Posts 9708
Michigan, US


4 posted 08-03-2000 10:04 AM       View Profile for Ron   Email Ron   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Ron's Home Page   View IP for Ron

Cindy, I wanted to let you know that I, for one, appreciate the help you tried to give. And I have a question about your procedure (if only for future reference).

I'm an avowed Netscape user, using IE only to test the pages I design. Ergo, I don't run into a lot of problems with IE simply because I don't use it consistently enough to have the problems surface. Nor have I had time to read up on its inner workings. I did notice, however, a folder in the Windows directory called Cookies. I assumed (and it is an assumption) that the Temporary Internet Files folder held the session (temporary) cookies, but the Cookies directory would hold the persistent ones. Can you verify that assumption? And if it's so, wouldn't the contents of that folder also need to be cleared?
RainbowGirl
Member Elite
since 07-31-99
Posts 3167
United Kingdom


5 posted 08-03-2000 11:21 AM       View Profile for RainbowGirl   Email RainbowGirl   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit RainbowGirl's Home Page   View IP for RainbowGirl

Gossamer: It may have seemed on the surface as though I was just repeating the commands that your sister already carried out but if she has in fact carried out what I suggested than I apologise for the following..  

These specific commands actually delete the folders themselves rather than just the contents, which is what we all normally do to release cache etc...    Again I apologise but I don't know that many people who would have carried out those specific commands and not have been able to correct the problem you have...I did of course forget as Ron has just reminded me that you could have reset the member profile...ooops, but it was late, around 1am here at that time so I'm sure you'll forgive me..*g*

Hope you managed to sort it out and it was good to test my brain after a a few glasses of wine...LOL

HUGS

Ron: Yes, cookies are actually kept in two places, one set in the actual cookies folder and the other, sometimes multiple sets, within the temporary internet files...if Gossamer had emptied the directory of cookies via the View, Internet, Setting and View Files option..(LOL) this would have emptied the cookie directory of all corrupted and non-corrupted files but only non-corrupted files from within the TIF dir, hence the final command of:

deltree "c:\windows Temporary Internet Files"

which would actually delete the whole directory and recreate it thereby getting rid of all cookies regardless of corruption...and yes, I know you know what deltree is...ROFL, but I explained in case anyone was reading and not fully understanding the difference...in essence all the commands I gave were actually deleting the host folders, rather than just their contents...  

I enjoyed your explanation, I can picture you explaining to a group of eager students and them nodding with a look that says "Argh!! now I understand, why can't Microsoft explain it that way"...I'll have to remember that analogy..  

HUSG

[This message has been edited by RainbowGirl (edited 08-03-2000).]
Gossamerwings
Member
since 07-18-2000
Posts 210


6 posted 08-03-2000 12:12 PM       View Profile for Gossamerwings   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Gossamerwings

I don't understand why anyone here should think that I was rude or that I blew anyone off.  

I thanked Cindy for her help,perhaps you should get your head out of your ass and read my reply again,Ron.

This is the 2nd or 3rd time you have blasted me Ron, for no reason.
  
I simply stated what the problem is and what you said about it....well, I didn't add that you said I was threatening you, by merely asking for help.

I simply said my sister tried it already. What was I supposed to do, lie and say ok thanks I will try that ? Give me a break Ron.  This is going to piss everyone off and I don't care.>>>>>Email between us about this problem follows>>>

Hi Ron,
I need help. My sister is going to kill me, if I don't get this straightened out.
I signed up and logged onto passions using her computer and now your system won't let her back in.
It will only take my login>>> Gossamerwings.
Sis tries to login and she has access to my login. Does that make sense?
Am I going to have to move to a different poetry site,because of the confusion?

Gossamerwings

***Then I sent you the question again, because I wasn't sure if you received it because I was having problems with Hotmail, and you said****

I received the first copy, but frankly don't respond well to what seem
to be veiled threats. If you would like to move to a different poetry
site, you are certainly free to do so. Or you could post your questions
in the Q&A forum where anyone with just a bit of computer knowledge can
probably help you.

Ron

**And again I responded**

Oh my gosh....I don't know where this is coming from.
I didn't threaten anyone! Why would I?

I only meant if there was a problem with the system and both of us using the same puter,I or my sister could go to another site. Only as an aid to you and your overworked bandwidth.
I see no threat in that to anyone.I am shocked that you do.

This problem has nothing to do with my lack of computer-ese, it has to do with ceres not recognizing us as two seperate members of passions, so why would I ask the question of anyone besides yourself? Excuse me for taking up your time.


*************************
Sorry that you have difficulty responding to a simple question,Ron.

~Cindy.... I did thank you and I did tell you that I appreciated your help. I really did(and do) but if I had known that it was going to cause this much **** I would just have kept the question and the problem to myself.

My sis and I will send an email asking that our poetry is removed from the site.
Thank you all for your kind understanding and hospitality.




Gossamerwings
RainbowGirl
Member Elite
since 07-31-99
Posts 3167
United Kingdom


7 posted 08-03-2000 12:39 PM       View Profile for RainbowGirl   Email RainbowGirl   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit RainbowGirl's Home Page   View IP for RainbowGirl

Hmmmmmmmmmmm

Gossamer: You have to remember I'm a brit and we brits take our work seriously...*g*

Seriously, I wasn't trying to suggest you didn't know what I meant nor was I trying to suggest that I had more experience and I certainly don't expect anyone to lie, that wouldn't get any of us anywhere...

I try to use smileys to show I'm good natured but I have my graphics turned off so maybe I used sad ones in error...

It would be a shame for you to go but, and here's the brit in me, I don't think you were being very polite in that last message, I would hate someone to say that to me and especially in an open forum...

Whatever you decide, hope it all works out and I was glad to be able to offer a hand..

HUGS
Ron
Administrator
Member Rara Avis
since 05-19-99
Posts 9708
Michigan, US


8 posted 08-03-2000 01:29 PM       View Profile for Ron   Email Ron   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Ron's Home Page   View IP for Ron

You know, June, your anger wouldn't even bother me if I could believe you learned anything from this incident. Sadly, you are still convinced you are right and will likely take the same attitude to the next web site you frequent. Do you really think people are so stupid?

There is no sister, and never has been, just one person who thinks the anonymity of the web should extend to dishonesty. Maybe I was mistaken about your threat, which I admitted in the subsequent email you didn't print, but I doubt it. And everyone here knows you didn't try any of the suggestions Cindy outlined for you - saying you did was just a way of blowing her off.

I think it's sad when people lie in hope of gaining an advantage over others. When they do it just because it's easy, it's no longer sad. It's pitiful. I sincerely hope you will approach the next web site you visit with a little more honesty, June. Trust me - people aren't as stupid as you think.
 
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