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steavenr
Member Elite
since 2003-11-17
Posts 4058


0 posted 2008-12-18 05:36 PM



stranded on desert isle
no rhyme, no meter, no hope
all alone on sand-shores blown
by winds tempetuous and warm

awaiting relief from proper sounds
that soothe the savage beast
that in each breast beats savage-strong
and offers no retreat

with schemes defunct by unkempt measures
that serve as guard-rules stern
and bid the freedom yet unfound
by limitless words unheard

unwelcome freedom does exist
the rhymester doth proclaim
'tis not for some this sacred means
of scribing seems good at all

so some may read and simply follow
what's good for some...does not favor all

© Copyright 2008 Steaven R Snow - All Rights Reserved
amusemi
Senior Member
since 2001-12-08
Posts 1262
A State of Disarray
1 posted 2008-12-18 07:23 PM


I agree.  Sometimes the confines of rhyme are just too limiting and decrease the effect and the message.  Great write...kat
Vestibular Bard
Member
since 2008-12-11
Posts 284
New York
2 posted 2008-12-18 09:38 PM


Hey Steaven R! How do you do?
You’d be surprised what rhymes can do.
That free verse stuff gets too sublime,
It’s best for folks, who can’t bust rhyme.

I read free verse, and holy crap,
It’s one big adjective attack!
Sometimes I get just so perturbed,
Searching through it… for the verb!

Unwelcome freedom does exist,
And without rules, verse can’t resist,
Feeling dry and quite pretentious...

...While in my rhymes, I'm quite contentious.


[This message has been edited by Vestibular Bard (12-19-2008 09:15 AM).]

steavenr
Member Elite
since 2003-11-17
Posts 4058

3 posted 2008-12-18 09:55 PM


kat,
thank you very much...good to know someone of the 7,000 who have not yet bent the knee

VB,
well, you certainly got the last word...thank you kindly

Marc-Andre
Senior Member
since 2008-12-07
Posts 501

4 posted 2008-12-18 10:04 PM


I'm with Vestibular Bard on this. Too often, free verse is little more than bad prose in broken lines. With the variety of time-proven metrical lines and rhyme schemes (unless you choose to write blank verse,) and with the vast & etymologically rich vocabulary, a lot can be achieved.

My experience is that the stricter the form, the better I perform. It gives me freedom from laziness, prolixity and wandering thoughts, allowing me to delve deeper into the matter and into myself. And the opportunities for experimentation are boundless. Assuming that meter and rhyme would be insufficient to deliver a powerful message, there still remain the alliteration, the choice of hard or soft consonants, the choice of monosyllabic or polysyllabic words, the careful use of enjambments, the justified metric substitution, line truncation, feminine endings, etc.

Need I say more?

That said, I liked the imagery in your first stanza. A merry Christmas to you   Mark

steavenr
Member Elite
since 2003-11-17
Posts 4058

5 posted 2008-12-18 10:11 PM


Marc,
what you have said is said so well.  I come from the school that taught me to learn all the rules of traditional poetry first.  My first mentor would not allow any derivation...until ALL the rules were first, learned; second, followed, and third, respected.  I appreciate your love for fine writing.  I am certainly not rejecting it, just asking that we broaden our horizons to accept more.  My favorite form of poetry is still the Shakespearean Sonnet, but some of us are more Bills than Wills.   (I want to wear a Christmas hat)

Marc-Andre
Senior Member
since 2008-12-07
Posts 501

6 posted 2008-12-18 10:53 PM


Steavenr,

I believe we do agree on that only a true master of the poetic craft can write fine -and justified- free verse I've seen a few. Yet I do believe that it is the freedoms afforded by forms that sorely need to be promoted.

Thanks for posting and bringing the topic up.

Mark

Vestibular Bard
Member
since 2008-12-11
Posts 284
New York
7 posted 2008-12-18 11:16 PM


Steaven:


I must agree with Marc Andre,
With firmest forms, I like to play,
I don’t like amateur prolix...
I do delve deeper quite a bit.
I like a fun alliteration,
and silly, metered masturbation.
And hopefully, I’m not offending
With my rhyme’s firm fem’nine ending.

serenity blaze
Member Empyrean
since 2000-02-02
Posts 27738

8 posted 2008-12-18 11:24 PM


"ode to free verse"

*smile*

I found this to be clever, actually.

Odes are hard to do, as it is, so yep, a freeverse ode?

laughing

YOU ARE BRILLIANT.

Marc-Andre
Senior Member
since 2008-12-07
Posts 501

9 posted 2008-12-18 11:28 PM


Be it music, painting, sculpture, or poetry, it is through mastery of the craft that artistic talent is best revealed. Food for thoughts.

VB, that was amusing. I must go to work now, but after that, I'll surely be back here to play. Mark

steavenr
Member Elite
since 2003-11-17
Posts 4058

10 posted 2008-12-18 11:28 PM


serenity,
thank you for noticing that irony...should have figured you'd get it...thank you muchly (one of my favorite non-words) (and yes, another Christmas hat!)

ethome
Member Patricius
since 2000-05-14
Posts 11858
New Brunswick Canada
11 posted 2008-12-19 02:05 AM


I think the depth of perception makes both forms acceptable.
The rhyming kind is so musical and so much fun.
However, as a songwriter I use the rhymes all the time....Heh I guess that even rhymes

Aw hell it's some sort of addiction.....too!

Eric

Alison
Deputy Moderator 5 ToursDeputy Moderator 1 TourDeputy Moderator 1 TourDeputy Moderator 1 Tour
Member Rara Avis
since 2008-01-27
Posts 9318
Lumpy oatmeal makes me crazy!
12 posted 2008-12-19 02:46 AM


Steaven,

I keep coming back to read your poetry.  

Alison

threadbear
Senior Member
since 2008-07-10
Posts 817
Indy
13 posted 2008-12-19 03:05 AM


Wittily penned, Steve!
One should know the rules
before breaking them.
JF

YoungatHeart2
Member
since 2008-12-12
Posts 81

14 posted 2008-12-19 04:57 AM


I agree with Serenity and threadbear.
Your ode is awesome and you are very creative!!!! May I take my tongue out of my cheek now?
YaH

Marc-Andre
Senior Member
since 2008-12-07
Posts 501

15 posted 2008-12-19 12:15 PM


This is         verse. For         and rhymes.       I’ll achieve
My              I’ll    no            Nay,                with
First try       longer bend       I will let          white space
At              my      knee        My                such
Free            to       form       Verse be free.    Imagery, and

With  all       do away.      Elf that       This is       For reading,
En-    slav-     and           I    mean      my            Thank
ing con-       you can       business       rebellion,    You. Now would
   Vent-        see           here,   can             this    you
   Ions         for yours-    ’t       you?    Is my art.    Like a brown bag?

Vestibular Bard
Member
since 2008-12-11
Posts 284
New York
16 posted 2008-12-19 12:24 PM


Marc,

I enjoyed your verse, but I think it could have used one more 'Nay' in there.

Marc-Andre
Senior Member
since 2008-12-07
Posts 501

17 posted 2008-12-19 12:29 PM


Thanks VB, I have a hard time formatting it here, the layout is much crisper on my word file. But I think you've seen it.

But seriously   In which stanza would you had the second "nay?"

LOL. Mark

inkedgoddess
Member Rara Avis
since 2002-11-19
Posts 7392
Ohio
18 posted 2008-12-19 03:59 PM


i revel and rebel in free verse best

personally i think anyone can do that singstong rhyme stuff

like im a poet and i didnt know it
ya know what i mean jellybean

steavenr
Member Elite
since 2003-11-17
Posts 4058

19 posted 2008-12-19 05:19 PM


Eric,
addiction to rhyme...is there a cure thanks for commenting

Alison,
a great compliment from a true student of the art...thank you...means a lot

JF,
you sound like my dear friend McCamish...certainly do agree with you...regarding the rules...though a child of the sixties, never really got into my era...I'm such a conventionalist...thank you for commenting

Young,
thank you...but, imho, it is neither an ode nor free verse...and, my problem when I put my tongue in cheek is that I often leave it long enough to become foot in mouth

Marc,
if I remember correctly, I would call yours a concrete...but my problem is that I cannot make out what it should read...help, please?

inked,
tsk, tsk, tsk...how very naughty of you to declare the virtues of free verse...but, then again, you are a goddess...thanks for your comments...I liked them...

LindsayP
Member Elite
since 2007-07-28
Posts 3410
Australia, Victoria
20 posted 2008-12-19 08:34 PM



Steav' you would have guessed by now that I favour rhyming poetry but I also like

reading free verse as well, as long as it is telling a story,and your poem just does that. much enjoyed.

Lindsay

steavenr
Member Elite
since 2003-11-17
Posts 4058

21 posted 2008-12-19 09:32 PM


Lindsay,
never would have thought this would raise such a firestorm...really just threw together with so little thought...oh, well...glad you liked it...thanks for stopping by

2islander2
Member Ascendant
since 2008-03-12
Posts 6825
by the sea
22 posted 2008-12-21 05:07 AM


Hi Steavenr, this is surprising as inspiration but the question worth to be set...For myself I think that the rhymes add music for sure but I'm dubious about the sense the poet want to bring to his poem.  I think the modern poetry is more images and senses than music and less senses...I enjoy very much free verse and will never write with rhymes but I like reading poems with rhymes...Thank you for the clever and thoughtful poem.


yann  

Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505
Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA
23 posted 2008-12-21 10:28 AM


I searched around for free-verse poems
Written by the Christmas gnomes.
Alas! My search left me aghast
Even when I searched the past.

I'm sure there must be some good reason
For using rhyme for Christmas season.
Perhaps we like to understand
The words displayed by poets' hand.

We like the rhythm and the flow
That settles like the falling snow.
We like the metered verse that rhymes
Wnene'er we celebrate this time.

We like the beat of reindeer hoofs
As they make way along our roofs.
We like the structure life employs
Which makes life music, not just noise.

If it's good enough for Christmas time,
This measured verse that we call rhyme
Then you can keep the other stuff.
For me, my rhyme is quite enough



Marc-Andre
Senior Member
since 2008-12-07
Posts 501

24 posted 2008-12-21 10:45 AM


I'm with you all the way, Balladeer. Actually, almost all the way. Meter I deem necessary; rhyme slightly less so. I'm not ready to dismiss blank verse. There are so many works in blank verse worth the name of poetry, e.g. Milton's Paradise Lost. As for free verse, I must admit that I yet have to read one that I have really enjoyed without thinking it would have been better with a "liberating" and empowering structure. Mark

P.S: very nice little poem you've posted here

Balladeer
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-05
Posts 25505
Ft. Lauderdale, Fl USA
25 posted 2008-12-21 05:09 PM


Thanks,Marc-Andre. Acutally, though, I HAVE read a few free verse poems that I think would have been diminished if written in rhyme. Sylvia Plath's Daddy is the one that comes most quickly to mind. They are the exceptions, though.
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