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Open Poetry #42
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2islander2
Member Ascendant
since 2008-03-12
Posts 6825
by the sea

0 posted 2008-07-05 04:36 AM


Granite,
you are blue,
you are pinkish,
you are grey,
You resist to the sea,
you carry the smells
of the universe,
you protect the looks,
the walls of my house
are made by your experiences,
by your timeless stones…
You have no fear
warlike granite,
salty granite,
the rain is a friend,
you are blue,
you are pinkish,
you are grey,
forever
your silence
resists to the sun.

[This message has been edited by 2islander2 (07-05-2008 08:39 AM).]

© Copyright 2008 yann rolland - All Rights Reserved
JamesMichael
Member Empyrean
since 1999-11-16
Posts 33336
Kapolei, Hawaii, USA
1 posted 2008-07-05 04:53 AM


Nice...James
Roniece Dawson-Bruce
Member Ascendant
since 2000-01-29
Posts 5689
Sydney, Australia
2 posted 2008-07-05 04:57 AM


Yann.. I enjoyed reading about this beautiful piece of granite   I think.. you could easily write on any subject and make it beautiful to read.. love RDB

Be kind at heart....for everyone you meet has their own battle to fight.........

Marchmadness
Member Rara Avis
since 2007-09-16
Posts 9271
So. El Monte, California
3 posted 2008-07-05 07:28 AM


I agree with Roniece, yann, you seem to be able to write about anything.
Granite is very beautiful. My son-in-law put graniye counter-tops in my kitchen and they are nice.
                                Ida

Margherita
Member Seraphic
since 2003-02-08
Posts 22236
Eternity
4 posted 2008-07-05 07:32 AM


Very well done, dear Yann! Granite emanates such power ...  it reminds me of the tombstone on my mother's grave, it fits her personality, her strength, her beauty, her forever lasting memory of love.

Beautiful!

Love,
Margherita

2islander2
Member Ascendant
since 2008-03-12
Posts 6825
by the sea
5 posted 2008-07-05 08:19 AM


Thank you James for your nice comment.

   yann

2islander2
Member Ascendant
since 2008-03-12
Posts 6825
by the sea
6 posted 2008-07-05 08:23 AM


Hello dear Roniece, you are really kind, I really enjoy reading your poems too and the last one was beautiful...I thought of granite because there is a lot of stones like that in my region, all the ancient houses are made of this granite and when you wander along the coast you see splendid granite rocks facing the sun and the sea.

  thank you very much

        yann

2islander2
Member Ascendant
since 2008-03-12
Posts 6825
by the sea
7 posted 2008-07-05 08:30 AM


Hello dear Ida, american kitchens are so nice, Europe copy the american interiors with taste and we have the expresssion "une cuisine américaine" in FRance when we ask for a kitchen...I admire people who can build kitchen as your son in law, I can't do that myself because I don't understand a single thing to screws, drilling machines , plaster, etc...

thank you for your nice comment.

   yann

2islander2
Member Ascendant
since 2008-03-12
Posts 6825
by the sea
8 posted 2008-07-05 08:36 AM


hello dear Margherita, it is a sad... when granite is used that way  it means a lot too, there is a great symbol in the choice ... it is a very beautiful and powerful stone as you said...I'm glad and honored you enjoyed my poem...

thanks to you


yann

OwlSA
Member Rara Avis
since 2005-11-07
Posts 9347
Durban, South Africa
9 posted 2008-07-05 08:39 AM


Yann, I love your poem and the description in a response of the ancient granite houses and the granite cliffs facing the sun and the sea.  

You may not be able to build kitchens, but you certainly build beautiful poems.

Our Drakensberg (meaning Dragon Mountains)Mountains in KwaZulu-Natal in South Africa are made of towering granite cliffs.

- Owl

Robert E. Jordan
Member Rara Avis
since 2008-01-25
Posts 8541
Philadelphia, Pennsylvania
10 posted 2008-07-05 08:47 AM


Yann,

Yes, I think granite would keep a place cool, and resist the sun.

Nice work on this.

Bobby

XGarapanX
Senior Member
since 2008-06-19
Posts 1435
Antarctica
11 posted 2008-07-05 09:19 AM


Yes, a great write about an off subject.

·´~`·­»Garapan«­·´~`·

2islander2
Member Ascendant
since 2008-03-12
Posts 6825
by the sea
12 posted 2008-07-05 10:59 AM


Hello dear Owl, thank you for your comment, I will seek for Drakensberg mountains on the web and surely will enjoy the discovering...
Yes we built our ancient houses with large stones of granit and very little windows to endure storm and attenuate the varition of temperatures, the ancient houses were typical and looked stubborn as the people of my region...

  thank you for your kind comment

  yann

2islander2
Member Ascendant
since 2008-03-12
Posts 6825
by the sea
13 posted 2008-07-05 11:00 AM


Thank you Bobby, you got it absolutly right...
your comments are always welcomed.

  yann

2islander2
Member Ascendant
since 2008-03-12
Posts 6825
by the sea
14 posted 2008-07-05 11:02 AM


Hello Garapan, appreciated your nice comment and yes i like off subjects (but not only)

  have a nice day

   yann.

Spuddette
Member
since 2008-07-03
Posts 112
England
15 posted 2008-07-05 11:17 AM


I really like this poem. xxxx
2islander2
Member Ascendant
since 2008-03-12
Posts 6825
by the sea
16 posted 2008-07-05 11:24 AM


HI  Spuddette, enjoyed your nice comment.

  yann

OwlSA
Member Rara Avis
since 2005-11-07
Posts 9347
Durban, South Africa
17 posted 2008-07-05 12:59 PM


Yann, I enjoyed your description of the granite houses so much that I am hoping, if I smile nicely enough, that we could get a poem about them, one day . . . ?  

- Owl

2islander2
Member Ascendant
since 2008-03-12
Posts 6825
by the sea
18 posted 2008-07-05 01:59 PM


Thank you very much Owl, I would surely try...

j'ai déja pensé à un vers tout à l'heure :
ces maisons sont têtues comme les gens qui les habitent...je vais essayé et je le posterai dès que j'aurai fini, merci beaucoup

yann

OwlSA
Member Rara Avis
since 2005-11-07
Posts 9347
Durban, South Africa
19 posted 2008-07-06 06:12 PM


J'en suis enchantée de l'idée, Yann.

- Owl

Earth Angel
Member Empyrean
since 2002-08-27
Posts 40215
Realms of Light
20 posted 2008-07-12 07:41 PM


Yann, the Man, can! Yeppers! You don't just see with your eyes ~ You really look at all that is around you through your poet's eyes!

I felt the strength of the granite ~ and your words!


Linda

2islander2
Member Ascendant
since 2008-03-12
Posts 6825
by the sea
21 posted 2008-07-13 02:20 AM


Hi Hearth Angel, you are so nice, your comment touched me ... I see as many of us more with the heart than with the eyes or with the brain, you're perfectly true...


thanks again

  yann

Bob K
Member Elite
since 2007-11-03
Posts 4208

22 posted 2008-07-14 03:23 AM




Dear Yann,

           What a friendly small piece, a cozy and happy small piece, utterly without presumption, pleased to be itself.  I was trained to admire poems with ambition, but I think now that the training was lop-sided, and ignored the importance of fine pieces like this one.  

     You do have some small trouble with the English idioms.  I do too, frankly; and I wouldn't have the slightest idea of what to do with French idioms.  

"You resist to the sea,"  is not idiomatic.  In English or its American variant,  one would probably say, "You resist the sea," instead.  It would be the same in the last line.  The resistance, for some reason, is more direct in English than in French,  one resists the sun directly rather than "to" the sun or "to" the sea.

     The French are certainly more practical about this, of course, since direct resistance to these elemental forces is futile; but while the English pride themselves on their practicality, it is the English who have the story of the King (Canute, isn't it?) who charges into the ocean and tries to beat back the waves with his sword.  The English are such Romantics.

     Other than these small suggestions, the poem is a good poem as it is in English.

     Were I to offer feedback beyond this, it would be in the form of suggestions for experiment.  Let's look a chunk at a time:


You are blue,
you are pinkish,
you are grey;
granite,
you resist the sea.
You carry the smells
of the universe.

     I've shifted the opening line downward to delay the mystery a bit.  The poem can start off as a direct address that way, and the reader, for a moment or two, has the illusion, that the poem is addressing him.  When Granite is introduced a few lines below, the reader is invited, indirectly, to consider himself as a sort of substance like granite, and to identify himself with the earth and the rock.  The poem, as a metaphor, will tend to do this anyway, but by delaying the introduction of the word "Granite," you invite the production of a small frisson of identification of self and substance in the stomach and not so much in the head.  Hopefully.  If it doesn't work for you, of course, screw my suggestion; it's simply junk.  You need to be congratulated about how you bring in sensory experience here, especially scent, the scent of the sea is a small wonderment here.  Thank you.

Now, perhaps another chunk:

You protect the looks;
the walls of my house,
are made by your experiences,
by your timeless stones…

     The word "looks" is simply not right, I think; and yet I don't know what the right word might be.  I think single syllable is a good instinct.  "Appearance" is too many syllables and too abstract both.  Perhaps if you might settle on some single aspect of the look of the house, something clear and concrete, that might solve the problem here, if indeed there is a problem outside my own fevered imagination.

And yet another chunk:
Warlike granite,
salty granite,
You have no fear;
the rain is a friend.
You are blue,
you are pinkish,
you are grey,
and forever
your silence
resists the sun.


     With the movement of "You have no fear" from your placement of it in the first line down to , my suggested placement in the third, I'm hoping to give the line some active movement at the end.  You have no fear.  Then the next short line adds another short building block on top of that, trying to give the sense of a sort of story being told, and that the rain being a friend is a natural extention of
"you have no fear" when in fact the sole connection is that your creativity has decided to place it there.  It is an act of creative daring on your part.  An adventure.

     Next step, of course, is to paste the three pieces together, since we weren't really breaking them up into stanzas, only to work on them in smaller pieces, and we'll want to see what the overall poem looks like.

You are blue,
you are pinkish,
you are grey;
granite,
you resist the sea.
You carry the smells
of the universe.
You protect the looks,
the walls of my house,
are made by your experiences,
by your timeless stones…
Warlike granite,
salty granite,
You have no fear;
the rain is a friend.
You are blue,
you are pinkish,
you are grey,
and forever
your silence
resists the sun.

     So, Yann, I liked the poem without what I did to it.  I'm hoping that the stuff I did to it may open your eyes to other possibilities for ways of working, not that you would change your text along the lines I offer.  If you do, swell.  If not swell.  The important thing is that you understand what  charming poems these are.

     Have you had a chance to see any of Jennifer Maxwell's stuff recently?  If you get a chance, you should have a look at some of the stuff she's doing, too.  She's starting to do some exciting work too.  Anyway, keep writing.

Best wishes, BobK.



2islander2
Member Ascendant
since 2008-03-12
Posts 6825
by the sea
23 posted 2008-07-15 03:07 AM


Thank you Bob, you are kind, Reading your comment made me conscious I should care more about the use of a grammar book (resist the sea); I think I could find this kind of stuff in dictionaries....The way you conceive the poem brought a new light on it and took my attention in a very pleasant way....You are right english is a very poetic language, very musical, and more used than french...For these reasons I prefer to use english rather than french...

Thanks again for your captivating poem...

yann  

Bob K
Member Elite
since 2007-11-03
Posts 4208

24 posted 2008-07-15 01:28 PM




Dear Yann,

          Some of the idiom things are in grammar books, many are not.  Idioms are ephemeral and go through periods of being in fashion and out.  They're often different in American English and English-English.  Sometimes the words themselves are slightly different.  Americans on occasion go into hysterics when your Englishman will in the course of conversation talk about  "knocking up" a friend.  The English-English used to (and may still) use it for "visiting a friend."  The English-English, depending on their generation, may be shocked into immobility when a clueless American speaks about the time when  she slipped and "fell on her fanny."

     When my wife and I went to Paris, about 15 years ago now, every time either one of us tried to trot out our French (except once), we were greeted by a flood of what seemed almost accentless American English.  We figured that they found our French so appalling they couldn't stand to hear it mangled.  They spoke English out of self defense.  When we had the luxury of simply listening, the sound of the language was wonderful.  It was intoxicating in itself.  The differences in how it went about meaning something seemed endlessly fascinating as well.  "Resist to the sun" would simply be a small example to marvel at because it pointed out (to me) the assumptions I had never even thought about that were encoded in the way my language gave me to think.

     The exception was a place called "The Poet's Cafe."  We stumbled in after they finished serving lunch, but they made us comfortable anyhow, and for several hours we chattered as best we could back and forth in a mixture of half-English, half-French, each of us trying pretty well to fill in what we didn't understand.  They were preparing an issue of their magazine on Robert Graves, whom they though wasn't very well known over there, and they were busy trying to translate Graves into French.  I wish my French were decent enough to have been some help, but I kept myself laughing at the translations I kept getting back for what I thought I'd said from these wonderful poets.  Elaine and I got mildly drunk on table wine.

     Certainly English is a poetic and a musical language.  You underplay the music of French, though, perhaps out of politeness.  There is so little modern poetry translated, I think, between the two cultures, that I know only a few names.  A Bosquet, a Peguy, a Guillavec.  And they are not all that recent now, are they?  These days I'm more familiar with some of the Spanish and Latin American writers, more than the French writing that was such an important influence on American writing in the last century, where it influenced Stevens and Pound and many of the beats.

     I have no idea what influence American poetry, for example, has had on French poetry at all beyond the passion for Poe.  I'd be curious to find out, in fact, if there's been any influence at all.  French literature has always seemed to self-contained to me.  Arab influence must certainly have had a place, given the number of arabs who've settled in France.

     The recent upsurge in the use of English is just that: Recent.  Beforehand, the lingua franca (interesting phrase, that) was French for anything major at all in culture or diplomacy.  There will probably be a time when it will be Chinese, if the number of folk speaking a language is any gauge.  French has lost none of its elegance, and none of the strings and woodwinds that it plays so beautifully.  

     Last, but most importantly, Yann, this poem is yours.  I play tricks with revision.  If I show the tricks, you aren't obligated to use them, but in revising future poems they become options.  I try to suggest you can revise your language toward the strengths of the poem, not simply toward what you intend the poem to mean when you start out.  A twist in the language can sometimes reveal a way of taking the poem you hadn't considered when you began.  It may also lead to dead ends.  I offer possibilities by displaying my own revision process, which is what my friends originally did with me.  Sometimes I took the suggestions, sometimes I rejected them, at least for use in the poem under discussion; but the newer ways of using the writing process to help me revise my own stuff?   that I kept.  All of it.  It's not stored in an orderly fashion in my brain, so the only way I really have of getting to it, is working with poems.  I find I can't work with my own poems in front of other people; I often revise them  hundreds of times, and nobody with a sane bone in their body is going to follow me through that process.  I have trouble sticking with it myself.  It often takes years.  I can offer to work with somebody else when I have the time and energy and when the poem fascinates me, as yours happened to do.  But make no mistake, all my tinkering is simply to show possible ways of working with your poem.  You wrote it, Yann, the poem is yours.  

Sincerely yours, BobK

2islander2
Member Ascendant
since 2008-03-12
Posts 6825
by the sea
25 posted 2008-07-15 05:47 PM


Hello Bob, sincerily I don't correct the poem on this site because it has to make sense with the comments, yours specially,...I have corrected it on another site (american poems)..I agree with what you say and myself enjoy very much to hear an american speak french...It's always delightful...You mentioned three poets that are very talented poets indeed but have no notoriety with the public...Peguy is considered too classical...And Bosquet and Guillevic are unknown from the public....They know better Zidane and Plattini...Bosquet and Guillevic are talented poets but  not genius like Aragon Eluard or the Giant Apollinaire (some of his poems are the best I have ever read, more beautiful than Baudelaire or Verlaine)....You also are right when you say these poets are from the past...Frankly I don't know about the contemporary french poets...

French litterature with the nouveau roman has closed many doors with the real world to become the mirror of the writer...Have you try to see yourself in a mirror...It is a nonsense, we see no-one exept oneself  try to look oneself trying to look oneself endlessly...It is the void...Now french writers talk about themselves and it is the void....That's my humble opinion...

in fact it is for the reality that I came on american sites, I want to write about real subjects....Not about myself...


thanks again

  yann

Bob K
Member Elite
since 2007-11-03
Posts 4208

26 posted 2008-07-16 06:47 PM


Dear Yann,

          Zidane and Platini, as in the footballers?  I thought they were poets for a while, and tried to look up their works, which apparently are manifold.  Poets of the athletic field, though.  Foolish and silly; so sorry,  BobK.

Sunshine
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-25
Posts 63354
Listening to every heart
27 posted 2008-07-16 07:36 PM


Dear Yann...

should you ever wish to correct a piece of poetry before submitting it to Open, then Critical Analysis is just the place for you!

Helpful people, such as BobK, read there, and I'm sure Bob's advice would have been utilized willingly, as you have a wonderful attitude, which is something to be admired.

You see, you do not have your critique window open, yet BobK politely, and kindly allowed as to the fact that you may wish to have such assistance in honing your poetry. He's a good man, he is.

Again, Critical Analysis could get you some additional help, and you might find it a place of poetical value.

By the way...after reading your poem, no one should ever see granite as anything but a living matter.





" It matters not this distance now  " Excerpt, Yesterday's Love
~*~
KRJ

Bob K
Member Elite
since 2007-11-03
Posts 4208

28 posted 2008-07-16 08:31 PM




Dear Sunshine,

          I had not in fact noticed.  I've made the untoward assumption that people wanted feedback, and you are right in making your extraordinarily polite correction.  I can only wish that I had noticed on my own earlier, and had not put others through what must have been through a difficult and  uncalled-for ordeal.  I will make a point of confining my comments to folks who submit poems to appropriate forums or who have let it be known that they have requested comment.

     Thank you very much, Sunshine, for your kind comments.

Sincerely yours, BobK.

Sunshine
Administrator
Member Empyrean
since 1999-06-25
Posts 63354
Listening to every heart
29 posted 2008-07-16 09:41 PM


Bob,

you've always been the politest of our reader/commentators...something that I have watched and admired completely. Even in the most abusive of areas, such as our discussion arenas, where tempers can run rampant, you have always conducted yourself with the ultimate of courtesy!

I just wanted Yann to know that there is a place to "run by" our poetry for future placement in any of the areas, as that is the only place you can post your poetry, and then post it again in any of our Open Forums.



Be well...




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