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Passions in Poetry

Gay

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Toerag
Member Ascendant
since 07-29-99
Posts 5839
Ala bam a


50 posted 08-07-2002 04:31 PM       View Profile for Toerag   Email Toerag   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Toerag

Yo Blaze...yanno?...I was kinda thinkin' about the poor soul who posted the original thread and how it kinda got "eaten by the gators" down the replies....see ya

[This message has been edited by Toerag (08-07-2002 04:38 PM).]

bsquirrel
Deputy Moderator 5 Tours
Member Rara Avis
since 01-03-2000
Posts 8382


51 posted 08-07-2002 05:35 PM       View Profile for bsquirrel   Email bsquirrel   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for bsquirrel

Sorry, Ron. I got carried away. I will not visit this particular thread ever again. It stopped being about the question, and became an Alley ego-match. My apologies.

Mike

(and hope you're getting the answers you need, TraceyStar1155 ... as this thread is showing, be careful out there, and surround yourself with good friends who understand, either way)

Bye.

"Oh you've got green eyes. Oh you've got blue eyes. Oh you've got grey eyes." -New Order

Titia Geertman
Member Ascendant
since 05-07-2001
Posts 5297
Netherlands


52 posted 08-07-2002 07:11 PM       View Profile for Titia Geertman   Email Titia Geertman   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Titia Geertman's Home Page   View IP for Titia Geertman


I've read this thread entirely and I must say I became angrier and agrier till the end.
Don't know if 'angrier' is a good word, but I think you get the picture.

Here is someone who just wanted to know 'how to know if one's gay', and she didn't get an answer to her question. All she got was a waterfall of pro's and contra's.

I can asure you, being a mother of a hetero girl and a lesbian girl: there's no difference in the way they act or in the love they feel for their partners.
When I look at both my daughters, I see two happy girls, and I mean happy in every way.

I've known from a very early age that my youngest daughter Lynn would come home someday with a girlfriend instead of a boyfriend, long before she herself knew she was a lesbian. I saw it in everything she was. I did not ever try to lead her into the hetero direction, because then she would have become a really unhappy person.

The really sad part is the intolerance and denial of the people around. Well not in my country, thank God. In my country homo's and lesbians are considered on an equal level as hetero couples, same rights, same duties.

Wether they are born with it or choose to be it, is not of my concern, because it's not important at all as a matter of fact.
What matters is if a person can live a life where he/she feels good in.

My own mother, who's 90 and grew up in a time that despices gay's, told my girl's partner the first time she saw her:
"I've never thought I would get a granddaughter in law, but as you are the choice and love of my granddaughter, you're more than welcome to this family".
That's tolerance!!! And she loves her granddaughter in law as much as she loves her grandson in law.

I don't think there's an answer to your question TracyStar, or it must be the same answer to the question 'how do I know I'm in love'. For there's no difference in my opinion whether you fall in love with a boy or a girl and when you do...you know.

Titia
a proud mother of a hetero and a lesbian daughter, proud because they live their lives as they both need to, to be happy.

Like scattered leaves...my words will flow

serenity blaze
Member Empyrean
since 02-02-2000
Posts 28839


53 posted 08-07-2002 07:35 PM       View Profile for serenity blaze   Email serenity blaze   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for serenity blaze

Brava, Titia, with hugs.

I agree profoundly with all you said--and hey? I got angry too...sigh
Titia Geertman
Member Ascendant
since 05-07-2001
Posts 5297
Netherlands


54 posted 08-07-2002 08:45 PM       View Profile for Titia Geertman   Email Titia Geertman   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Titia Geertman's Home Page   View IP for Titia Geertman


Thank you Serenity Blaze, I needed to vent a little, glad you think the same way as I do.

Titia

Like scattered leaves...my words will flow

hush
Senior Member
since 05-27-2001
Posts 1693
Ohio, USA


55 posted 08-07-2002 10:24 PM       View Profile for hush   Email hush   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for hush

"Wether they are born with it or choose to be it, is not of my concern, because it's not important at all as a matter of fact.
What matters is if a person can live a life where he/she feels good in."

Very well said. We can get mad and argue about this until we're all blue in the faces, but that's what it all boils down to.

Who is John Galt?

Opeth
Member Elite
since 12-13-2001
Posts 2224
The Ravines


56 posted 08-08-2002 11:45 AM       View Profile for Opeth   Email Opeth   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Opeth

Does one possess a "hard heart" if they believe that homosexuality is due to a genetic abnormality?

To the original thread starter:

How do you know if you are a homosexual?

At one time in my life, I believed that people chose to practice homosexuality and that it was wrong and sinful.  Then one day in one of my college classes, the instructor introduced a man to us. This man stood up in front of the class and proclaimed himself as a homosexual and asked the class if they had any questions. I waited until after the class ended and asked the guy why he chose this type of lifestyle. He told me that he didn't choose it and asked me if I could remember the first time that I "noticed" the opposite sex. I told him yes, it was in kindergarten, I noticed this girl and found her very attractive, she was different than the boys in that way. He told me the same thing happened to him at about the same age, except it was a boy, not a girl that he had been attracted to.

So my answer to you is this.

You will know if you are a homosexual if you find the same sex attractive and sexually appealing to you: those feelings of intimacy and love that differs from the love we have for our families and friends.

Is it a genetic abnormality? I believe research proves that it is. Does that make it wrong? In my opinion, no.

If you are merely curious about same sex relationships, that does not make you a homosexual. You will know in time.

Choose your friends wisely and use common sense judgment in all that you do. If you continue to have questions about these matters, find someone dear and close to you to confide in, especially if you ever feel the world closing in on you and there is no escape. Above all else, don't ever feel sorry, ashamed or bad for who you are. Accept yourself and love yourself, for you, like all of us, are unique in our own ways.

Sincerely,

The hard-hearted-intellectual-one...Opeth.
Toerag
Member Ascendant
since 07-29-99
Posts 5839
Ala bam a


57 posted 08-08-2002 11:58 AM       View Profile for Toerag   Email Toerag   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Toerag

Well said Opeth....(can't believe I totally agree with you this time..but I do, and you're a Navy rascal too!)The world must be coming to an end?????
serenity blaze
Member Empyrean
since 02-02-2000
Posts 28839


58 posted 08-08-2002 02:30 PM       View Profile for serenity blaze   Email serenity blaze   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for serenity blaze

*smiling at Opeth* oh and you too, TOE...geeez....

Thank you for addressing TracyStar's question. I do not object to a difference of opinion yanno, there was just a not-so-subtle aura of insensitivity that seemed to be offending even my not-so-delicate sensibilities.

I wanted to add my well wishes to yours for TracyStar. And Trace? grin, if ya learned nothing else from this thread, know this:

"No matter which way ya go? Just PLAY NICE."




(serenity exits, doing the cha-cha...)
Opeth
Member Elite
since 12-13-2001
Posts 2224
The Ravines


59 posted 08-09-2002 12:37 PM       View Profile for Opeth   Email Opeth   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Opeth

"Well said Opeth....(can't believe I totally agree with you this time..but I do,
and you're a Navy rascal too!)The world must be coming to an end?????"


lol...

~ Clinton forced the homosexual issue on the Armed Services back in 1993. I think the resulting policy, "Don't ask, don't tell" is overall an effective policy.

I don't believe a person should be kicked out of the navy because they are a homosexual, but I do think it should remain a private matter for the sake of unit cohesiveness, especially when serving aboard naval ships.
Toerag
Member Ascendant
since 07-29-99
Posts 5839
Ala bam a


60 posted 08-09-2002 12:50 PM       View Profile for Toerag   Email Toerag   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Toerag

Opeth, I can't remember where I read it, it was several years ago...There were issues involving restrooms, dressing rooms, not only in the military and barracks, but also in public. The don't ask don't tell thinggie does seem to be working....if not, it's not going public that I know of...
MidnightSon
Member
since 05-15-2002
Posts 328
between the gutter & the stars


61 posted 08-16-2002 07:39 AM       View Profile for MidnightSon   Email MidnightSon   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for MidnightSon

tracy....at the risk of being redundant, you will know.
you go with what makes you comfortable. everyone does. that's why i drive a comfortable gas guzzler instead of an economy car. you stick with what keeps you at ease, from clothes to cars to hair color to sexuality.

and to the debate... well i only say the same thing. people will go with what they're comfortable with. against nature, abnormal, moral, immoral, illegal, intrinsic.... does it make a difference in the end?
it doesn't. people are going to do what(who) they want to do, sooner or later.
just make sure you do the things you want for yourself, not beacause someone told you it's supposed to be one way or the other.
_______

i just read ron's suggestion for this topic on another post....
at what point, if any, are an individual's actions no longer the fault of the individual?

i gotta say never. there's always a choice. though the options may not always seem desireable, there's always a choice and we must be willing to accept responsibilty for them.

otherwise we'd become a society of prozac/ritilin users that commit crimes and blame our non-hugging parents for our actions, pleading for rehab in place of incarceration... god forbid

it's our struggle for identity that leaves us all unknown

[This message has been edited by MidnightSon (08-16-2002 07:41 AM).]

serenity blaze
Member Empyrean
since 02-02-2000
Posts 28839


62 posted 08-16-2002 01:46 PM       View Profile for serenity blaze   Email serenity blaze   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for serenity blaze

*smiling*

"that's why i drive a comfortable gas guzzler instead of an economy car."

*chuckle*

*snort*

(serenity exits, biting her fingers in restraint at the analogy...)



MidnightSon
Member
since 05-15-2002
Posts 328
between the gutter & the stars


63 posted 08-17-2002 07:48 AM       View Profile for MidnightSon   Email MidnightSon   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for MidnightSon

LOL
*shakes head*

any backpeddling would only deepen the hole.

ty for the smile this morn, serenity.

[This message has been edited by MidnightSon (08-17-2002 07:49 AM).]

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