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Passions in Poetry

On Poetry and its Success

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Member Rara Avis
since 06-15-99
Posts 7276
Mobile, AL

0 posted 12-09-2000 12:11 AM       View Profile for Temptress   Email Temptress   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Temptress

I wasn't sure where to put this, so I'm going to ask it here.

What does everyone think of this statement? Agree disagree, etc??

"The success of a poem doesn't always depend solely upon whether we agree with the standpoint."

Dopey Dope
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since 08-30-2000
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San Juan, Puerto Rico

1 posted 12-09-2000 12:55 PM       View Profile for Dopey Dope   Email Dopey Dope   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Dopey Dope

Well in my point of view i'd have to say that the success of a poem depends on many things. The format, the choice of words, the message and so on. Whether we agree with the message or not could cause controversy. I think that if you like the poem and completely agree with the message then hey, wonderful. If you disagree with it, it might leave some sort of impact upon your mind. You might like the poem simply because it compeltely goes against what you believe in, and thus helps you delve into another persons views.

UHhhhhhh.....i don't think i made much sense but oh well.

I was born myself, raised myself, and will continue to be myself. The world will just have to adjust.

I hate your socks. I'd like to burn them!

Marge Tindal
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since 11-06-1999
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Florida's Foreverly Shores

2 posted 12-09-2000 02:10 PM       View Profile for Marge Tindal   Email Marge Tindal   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Marge Tindal's Home Page   View IP for Marge Tindal

The ultimate success of a poem is in it's penning !

~*The pen of the poet never runs out of ink, as long as we breathe.*~
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Member Rara Avis
since 06-07-99
Posts 7296
America the beautiful

3 posted 12-09-2000 11:03 PM       View Profile for Elizabeth   Email Elizabeth   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit Elizabeth's Home Page   View IP for Elizabeth

I have to say that I agree. There are poems that I have thought were very well written, althought I personally did not agree with the sentiments expressed in them. There have also been poems with ideas that I liked that were poorly written. Just because someone doesn't like what a poem says does not mean it is a bad poem.
Kevin Rose
since 11-20-2000
Posts 64
Liverpool UK

4 posted 12-10-2000 08:10 AM       View Profile for Kevin Rose   Email Kevin Rose   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Kevin Rose

some of the most successful poetry in my opinion is that which makes you question your standpoint, when it differs from that one expressed in the poem.

Just like a painting can be good because it is a perfect likeness, or it can be abstact and impresionist, and you look at it from the artists point of view.

It doesnt matter whether you agree with the view, it does matter whether you successfully given an accurate portrayal of the creator's viewpoint.
White Wolf
since 09-18-99
Posts 384
Somewhere in the vast wastelan

5 posted 12-10-2000 06:33 PM       View Profile for White Wolf   Email White Wolf   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for White Wolf

     I believe in this I would have to stand out.  I disagree with the statements above and maybe I am alone in this.

     Here is my case.  Most of us would agree that poetry can be called the language of the heart.  No matter what you are writing, deep down it comes from the heart.  There is no right or wrong save this, if your heart isn't in it, it is as good as chicken scratch on a piece of paper(the chicken got into the ink).  The way I see it is that if your heart is in it, then it is good.  There is no bad poetry.  I here people whine and complain about spelling and punctuation and stuff of that nature.  To be truthful it makes me sick.  When we become concerned with these kinds of things it means that we have preconsieved notions that we are judging other people's poetry and in essence their hearts.  I don't believe anyone has that right.  Sure if you want to you can but that doesn't mean you should.  Some would say that I write very well according to them.  There is a simple reason for this.  I have the gift of being charming with my words and actions too but you can't see those from where you sit.  I am twenty-four years old, have had more than my share of people that wanted to prove their manliness through physical combat with and yet, here I sit in my twenty-forth year had have never been in a physical fight.  I let my would be opponent dumbfounded and still wondering how I could just walk away and niether party physically harmed.  Anyway in closing I would just like to say that I love all poetry and think it is abosutely wonderful.

The White Wolf

PS  Yes, I do know that now my complements to other people's poetry won't hold as much value as they once did.  But you know what?  I truly believe what I wrote and I am touched by every piece that I read.
Member Ascendant
since 08-20-99
Posts 5896
Jejudo, South Korea

6 posted 12-10-2000 08:41 PM       View Profile for Brad   Email Brad   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Brad

If a poem can be defined by a standpoint, I'm not sure I would like it. I usually prefer a more complex approach -- one that approaches my own general views on the complexity of life. In other words, any specific viewpoint wouldn't necessarily bother me (for the most part -- there are exceptions) but if a poem doesn't deal with complexity of the issues involved, I would probably consider it one-sided and not very satisfying. So, on the other hand, if it doesn't accord with my views on life (complexity), I probably wouldn't like it (less satisfying).

Is that clear?  

It seems strange that you argue against rhetoric when it comes to poetry (spelling, punctuation and all that other silly stuff) and for rhetoric when it comes to physical altercations (charming use of words). Are you arguing that effective rhetoric and sincerity cannot coincide?  This seems very odd for anyone interested in poetry.


White Wolf
since 09-18-99
Posts 384
Somewhere in the vast wastelan

7 posted 12-14-2000 12:59 AM       View Profile for White Wolf   Email White Wolf   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for White Wolf

  If you can do those things, then great.  I just know that one should not judge a piece simply because it is written or not written that way.  That was just the point I was trying to make.

The White Wolf
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Member Rara Avis
since 06-03-2000
Posts 9897
The Shores of Alone

8 posted 12-14-2000 07:30 AM       View Profile for catalinamoon   Email catalinamoon   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems   Click to visit catalinamoon's Home Page   View IP for catalinamoon

I would agree with your statement that the success of the poem does NOT depend upon the reader agreeing with it. However, if it is an extrememly controversial viewpoint, I do believe that adversely affects people, even though it shouldn't.
since 12-12-2000
Posts 93
Hamburg, PA

9 posted 12-14-2000 09:08 AM       View Profile for shira   Email shira   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for shira

I agree with this statement, as long as the author manages to write in such a way that the person, reagardless of opinion on the subject, wants to read the whole thing anyway and "experience" what the poem is saying. If you lose the audience part way through, then I think the poem is probably not "a success". Also, I think good structure, or interesting structure make a successful poem.
dreamer1 12 5 24
since 12-11-2000
Posts 172
crossing between

10 posted 12-15-2000 11:25 PM       View Profile for dreamer1 12 5 24   Email dreamer1 12 5 24   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for dreamer1 12 5 24

I think that personally the viewpoint doesn't bother me. I think that it doesn't really matter unless the reader is very single minded on a paritcular issue, or if the poem is very objective, it may offend some people.

....peace as a primary objective is dangerous because it implies that we would sacrifice anything for the sake of it....
Senior Member
since 12-01-1999
Posts 1526
Washington State

11 posted 12-18-2000 02:46 AM       View Profile for Irie   Email Irie   Edit/Delete Message      Find Poems  View IP for Irie

On poetry and it's success????
I guess that depends on what one means by success.

As far as my thoughts go....if a poem reaches out and grabs me,
pulls me in and touches me in one way or another
it's a success to me.
If a writer can make me feel what they are saying, in my book they have done well.
And if the piece has good meter, rhyme, flow etc...then it's even better.
But who am I?
I know there are rules to be followed in poetry, but I am not one to follow rules.
I don't even know what half of them are.
I write from the heart....what I feel.

Uhhhhh...Anyway, back to your question
(sorry, got a little side tracked there)  

I wouldn't think that it "solely" depends on the stand point, but I would
venture to say that it would have a lot to do with it.
If you don't have don't have success.
Then there is the flip side. A person could write a perfect poem, (Rules),
and that could be a success. BUT, it may have awful content.....
Again, that's in general. Success to one person is not success to another.

You've asked a really good question here Temptress.
My wheels are turning now.  


"The things that come to those that wait may be the things
left by those who got there first"

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